COVID-19 ... how we cope :)

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  • Originally posted by Garland Best View Post

    Ok, I have to counter this disinformation. I am not going to deny that the testing does result in a small number of false positives. No test is perfect. BUT YOU CANNOT USE THIS AS EVIDENCE THAT THE CURRENT LOCKDOWNS IN CANADA ARE UNJUSTIFIED. Here is why.

    FACT: In August 21 of this year the daily number of tests performed in Ontario, Quebec, Albert and British Columbia totaled 47830 (I am using these 4 provinces as they perform the most tests and I don't have the time to complete the math for all 13 provinces and territories.).
    FACT: In August 21 of this year the 7 day daily average of new Covid-19 cases in Canada was 391/day.
    FACT: In August 21 of this year the 7 day daily average of new deaths due to Covid-19 cases in Canada was 7/day.
    FACT: In December 21 of this year the daily number of tests performed in Ontario, Quebec, Albert and British Columbia totaled 124221. This is an increase of 2.6 times.

    So, if I assume that most if not all of these tests were false positives, I would expect the daily number of new cases increase in proportion to the number of tests performed, and the number of new deaths to not change very much at all. So if the false positive claim was true, then the number of new cases reported daily would be about 1016 new cases per day and say 10 new deaths per day.

    INSTEAD:
    FACT: In December 21 of this year the 7 day daily average of new Covid-19 cases in Canada was 6722/day, an increase of 17 times.
    FACT: In August 21 of this year the 7 day daily average of new deaths due to Covid-19 cases in Canada was 111/day, an increase of 16 times.

    Bottom line, the case rate and death rate are both climbing rapidly, and there is NO WAY it can be attributed to false positives. So this Christmas Holiday, PLEASE:

    1) Accept the reality that the high Covid-19 rates are real.
    2) Stay home. Don't visit family or friends, no matter how hard it is.
    3) If you do HAVE to leave your home, wear a mask.

    (Data taken from www.covid-19canada.com)
    Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
    I am not going to deny that the testing does result in a small number of false positives
    90% + false positives! I already provided you with irrefutable scientific documentation of that as per your request. How dare you call that "disinformation" without
    any published scientific evidence to the contrary!

    Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
    FACT: In August 21 of this year the 7 day daily average of new deaths due to Covid-19 cases in Canada was 111/day, an increase of 16 times.
    Please explain where all the influenza deaths in Canada disappeared to.

    Please show us "excess deaths" between 2019-2020.
    Please show us stats on hospital admissions

    Bottom Line Lockdowns and masks have not worked but the one thing that does work, early intervention our friend Garland here prefers to ignore. The fascist Govts in Canada even went so far as to recommend against vitamin d3 in Quebec elder care centres even though virtually all COVID victims are elderly and d3 deficient. Instead they sit with there hands in your pockets allow patients to go untreated do nothing and watch them suffocate!

    Imagine lockdowns and masks for a virus with a 99.997 percent survival rate if you are healthy and under 70. If you are unhealthy the same stats if you treat on onset of early symptoms.
    EGCG , Quercetin, zinc, d3 all available at any vitamin shop. That is what save lives, not masks and lockdowns.

    Remember Garland if you get early symptoms follow the liberal "science" and do nothing! Wait until it is too late go to the hospital and let them put you on a ventilator and blow up your lungs (8 out of 10 cases) Very nice way to go! Adios amigo!

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/...ths-in-canada/

    Screen Shot 2020-12-23 at 2.19.14 PM.png

    Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Wednesday, 23rd December, 2020, 03:21 PM.

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
      90% + false positives! I already provided you with irrefutable scientific documentation of that as per your request. How dare you call that "disinformation" without
      any published scientific evidence to the contrary!
      How about countering my data below? Are you going to claim that the rapid increase in the counts over the past 5 months are all just false positives? Are you kidding me? How is that supposed to be happening? The persons doing the tests are just cranking up the dials for the number of cycles to get the numbers?

      Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
      Please explain where all the influenza deaths in Canada disappeared to.
      How about the fact that more persons in Alberta have died from Covid-19 in the past 10 months than have died from the flu in the previous 10 years? https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/more-albe...-flu-1.5231406

      Comment


      • Good to see the more progressive darling Dems (such as Ocasio-Cortez) support President Trump's COVID relief amendments ...including the elimination of all the waste!!!

        10's of millions of dollars towards counting fish???

        Just to name but one, ha!

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Garland Best View Post

          How about countering my data below? Are you going to claim that the rapid increase in the counts over the past 5 months are all just false positives? Are you kidding me? How is that supposed to be happening? The persons doing the tests are just cranking up the dials for the number of cycles to get the numbers?
          I have to say that I share Garland's skepticism over your claims.
          " 90% + false positives!" - what does that mean?

          I am not sure, so if you want to clarify that statement, please do.

          If it means that the cases reported are at least 90% false positives, then is this analysis correct?

          Cases reported in Ontario - 162,663 - if 90% of these are false positives, then we only have 16,266 real cases.
          We do have deaths = 4,229 plus current hospitalizations etc.
          So that give us a fatality rate of 4,229 / 16,266 = 26%

          Holy shit, that can't be right? Is that what you are saying?
          Just trying to understand......:)


          Last edited by Bob Gillanders; Wednesday, 23rd December, 2020, 06:41 PM.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Bob Gillanders View Post

            I have to say that I share Garland's skepticism over your claims.
            " 90% + false positives!" - what does that mean?

            I am not sure, so if you want to clarify that statement, please do.

            If it means that the cases reported are at least 90% false positives, then is this analysis correct?

            Cases reported in Ontario - 162,663 - if 90% of these are false positives, then we only have 16,266 real cases.
            We do have deaths = 4,229 plus current hospitalizations etc.
            So that give us a fatality rate of 4,229 / 16,266 = 26%

            Holy shit, that can't be right? Is that what you are saying?
            Just trying to understand......:)

            I just don't get him either.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Garland Best View Post

              How about countering my data below? Are you going to claim that the rapid increase in the counts over the past 5 months are all just false positives? Are you kidding me? How is that supposed to be happening? The persons doing the tests are just cranking up the dials for the number of cycles to get the numbers?



              How about the fact that more persons in Alberta have died from Covid-19 in the past 10 months than have died from the flu in the previous 10 years? https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/more-albe...-flu-1.5231406
              Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
              How about countering my data below? Are you going to claim that the rapid increase in the counts over the past 5 months are all just false positives? Are you kidding me? How is that supposed to be happening? The persons doing the tests are just cranking up the dials for the number of cycles to get the numbers?
              i said that approximately 90% are false positives which would be defined as someone without symptoms carrying non infectious viral debirs. The lab technicians go by current protocol recommendations. Did you read anything I previously posted on this subject as per your request for links or do you just ignorantly blab without any understanding at all? If you can't find the links i gave to you just say so and I will repost.

              Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
              How about the fact that more persons in Alberta have died from Covid-19 in the past 10 months than have died from the flu in the previous 10 years?
              I do not have data for deaths by various causes in Alberta ie Heart and stroke +flu in 2020 compared to prior years. I do know that the CDC stats clearly show that heart related deaths AND flu related deaths were attributed to COVID19. So that is one possible explanation to your question.
              This video presentation shows you exactly what links to go to on the CDC data base to see for yourself.



              Bottom line many deaths are being lumped in the US as being attributed to COVID19. When you look at overall deaths in Canada as per the chart I gave above the increase in deaths to date is comparable to prior years taking into account population growth and shift towards an older population. I will say that in prior years in Nursing homes immune boosting supplements and vitamins were encouraged that inexplicably are discouraged both in the US and Canada this year that no doubt would be a contributing factor to an increase in deaths.

              You fail to address the most important question of all....Is early intervention a more viable solution to lockdowns and masks? If "no "please state your evidence, That would be a more productive discussion then suggesting "disinformation".


              Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Wednesday, 23rd December, 2020, 08:23 PM.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Neil Frarey View Post
                10's of millions of dollars towards counting fish???
                I for one would very much like to know officially how many really bad poker players there are out there.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
                  I said that approximately 90% are false positives which would be defined as someone without symptoms carrying non infectious viral debirs. The lab technicians go by current protocol recommendations. Did you read anything I previously posted on this subject as per your request for links or do you just ignorantly blab without any understanding at all? If you can't find the links i gave to you just say so and I will repost.
                  So you attribute an increase in the daily confirmed cases by a factor of 17X compared to August to a 17X increase in false positives and that the over 6700 daily confirmed cases are still 90% false positives? I have a decent grasp of Bayesian statistics. If you have a test that is correct 99.9% of the time, and you test 100,000 people where only 10 people are sick, then you will get roughly 109 positive results, where 99 of those people are false positives. That's a false positive rate of 90%. But test 100,000 people where 5000 are sick, and you now get 4995 sick people correctly diagnosed, 95 false positives, and 5 false negatives. Now only 1.9% of those positive results are false positives. I could accept your scientific papers back in August. Not now with today's numbers and much higher percentage of positive results. They have not cranked up the protocals since the summer.

                  Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
                  I do not have data for deaths by various causes in Alberta ie Heart and stroke +flu in 2020 compared to prior years.
                  See https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...Page14481.aspx

                  Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
                  I do know that the CDC stats clearly show that heart related deaths AND flu related deaths were attributed to COVID19. So that is one possible explanation to your question.This video presentation shows you exactly what links to go to on the CDC data base to see for yourself.
                  Nope, not buying it. Her plots clearly show a strong spike in total deaths in April, and the "decrease" in deaths due to other causes are primarily a non-increase in deaths attributed to other causes when compared to previous years where there was a strong flu spike in deaths. To me that looks like heart failures brought on by the flu in previous years were listed as heart failure, and this year heart failure brought on by Covid-19 are listed as Covid-19. The "decreases" do not match up to the increases. And her analysis ends in October before the second wave hit in force.

                  Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
                  I will say that in prior years in Nursing homes immune boosting supplements and vitamins were encouraged that inexplicably are discouraged both in the US and Canada this year that no doubt would be a contributing factor to an increase in deaths.
                  Having a grandmother and later a mother-in-law in private nursing homes as well as friend who is a general practioner and who was in one of the homes working on cases when others were avoiding going this spring, I can report that this is a complete fabrication and falsehood. Not happening in the homes in my area.

                  Originally posted by Sid Belzberg View Post
                  You fail to address the most important question of all....Is early intervention a more viable solution to lockdowns and masks? If "no "please state your evidence, That would be a more productive discussion then suggesting "disinformation".
                  Prevention is more effective than early intervention. You want evidence? Look at per capita case rates and death rates in Atlantic Canada compared to the rest of Canada. Look at the effectiveness of lockdowns in Australia when an outbreak occurred. And why restrict yourself to one method?

                  Frankly speaking if a person openly defies wearing a mask and social distancing rules and that person comes down with Covid and somehow infects someone who tries to follow the rules, then that first person should be held criminally responsible. If it results in a person dying of Covid, then that's criminal negligence, possibly manslaughter.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Garland Best View Post

                    Frankly speaking if a person openly defies wearing a mask and social distancing rules and that person comes down with Covid and somehow infects someone who tries to follow the rules, then that first person should be held criminally responsible. If it results in a person dying of Covid, then that's criminal negligence, possibly manslaughter.
                    Yep, I agree!

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Pargat Perrer View Post

                      I for one would very much like to know officially how many really bad poker players there are out there.
                      25 million to combat Asian carp, 7 million dollars for Reef fish management, 2.5 million dollars to count the number of Amber Jack fish in the Gulf of Mexico and another provision to promote the breading of fish in federal hatcheries. That's just about 35 million wasted dollars on fish ... not struggling Americans trying to stay alive ... but 35 million dollars on fish!!!

                      This COVID Relief Bill isn't for those who really really need it ... this bill is about buying Democratic votes. Pay forward!

                      The most insulting waste of money in this so called COVID Relief Bill?

                      Up to $1,800 per ... illegal alien! So, how much do Americans receive? $600 each in relief payments ...sigh. Americans only receive $600 each ... illegal aliens receive up to $1,800 each.

                      Gotta just love those sneaky darling Dems!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Garland Best View Post

                        So you attribute an increase in the daily confirmed cases by a factor of 17X compared to August to a 17X increase in false positives and that the over 6700 daily confirmed cases are still 90% false positives? I have a decent grasp of Bayesian statistics. If you have a test that is correct 99.9% of the time, and you test 100,000 people where only 10 people are sick, then you will get roughly 109 positive results, where 99 of those people are false positives. That's a false positive rate of 90%. But test 100,000 people where 5000 are sick, and you now get 4995 sick people correctly diagnosed, 95 false positives, and 5 false negatives. Now only 1.9% of those positive results are false positives. I could accept your scientific papers back in August. Not now with today's numbers and much higher percentage of positive results. They have not cranked up the protocals since the summer.


                        See https://www.albertahealthservices.ca...Page14481.aspx



                        Nope, not buying it. Her plots clearly show a strong spike in total deaths in April, and the "decrease" in deaths due to other causes are primarily a non-increase in deaths attributed to other causes when compared to previous years where there was a strong flu spike in deaths. To me that looks like heart failures brought on by the flu in previous years were listed as heart failure, and this year heart failure brought on by Covid-19 are listed as Covid-19. The "decreases" do not match up to the increases. And her analysis ends in October before the second wave hit in force.



                        Having a grandmother and later a mother-in-law in private nursing homes as well as friend who is a general practioner and who was in one of the homes working on cases when others were avoiding going this spring, I can report that this is a complete fabrication and falsehood. Not happening in the homes in my area.



                        Prevention is more effective than early intervention. You want evidence? Look at per capita case rates and death rates in Atlantic Canada compared to the rest of Canada. Look at the effectiveness of lockdowns in Australia when an outbreak occurred. And why restrict yourself to one method?

                        Frankly speaking if a person openly defies wearing a mask and social distancing rules and that person comes down with Covid and somehow infects someone who tries to follow the rules, then that first person should be held criminally responsible. If it results in a person dying of Covid, then that's criminal negligence, possibly manslaughter.
                        Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
                        I could accept your scientific papers back in August
                        Garland, no new discoveries were made between August and now with respect to the Polemerace Chain Reaction. You go above an amplification rate of 30 cycles and 90 percent of the time the only thing you will pickup is trace RNA and non infectious viral debris. Those results were reproduced in the papers already given to you including one by Dr Carl Heneghan Oxford Professor editor of the BMJ/EBM.

                        Even the WHO admitted that in the news release I posted. Calling an asymptomatic patient COVID positive without retesting them at a lower amplification rate is junk science.
                        Even Carry Mullins the inventor of PCR stated that it should never have been used for diagnostic testing.

                        The main primer used in most PCR tests today is the Drosten Primer that has been shown to have cross detection issues with SarsCOV1. In other words you could have had a common cold and still test positive.

                        If you ever test yourself for COVID you should do the antigen test, not the PCR test.

                        You are still not convinced the PCR tests the way they are administered now are junk science that yield mostly false positives? Here is a review by experts that I would urge you to read very carefully.
                        https://cormandrostenreview.com/report/

                        Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
                        And her analysis ends in October before the second wave hit in force.
                        Good on you for taking the time to listen to her presentation. She gave you the links in the presentation and the updated data is there to see for yourself. No need to dismiss it out of hand.

                        Originally posted by Garland Best View Post
                        Prevention is more effective than early intervention. You want evidence? And why restrict yourself to one method?
                        No you are wrong, From time immemorial, treat sooner rather than later has been the standard in Medicine. Below is an excellent chart someone did early in the Pandemic. I posted an update I did myself here already with similar evidence. You hit the nail; right on the head: WHY DOES HEALTH CANADA INSIST ON NO EARLY INTERVENTION!!!! Instead we are restricted to the Lockdown/mask method that is not working! By the way did you ever read Dr . Fauci's 2010 paper on the 1918 pandemic? It went in two waves. The second wave was the worst as most died of bacterial pneuomonia (not the virus) caused by wearing masks that inevitably were contaminated and people just breathed it in. Forget manslaughter--what the govts are doing is eldercide!

                        CFRScreen Shot 2020-12-23 at 10.40.41 PM.png
                        Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Thursday, 24th December, 2020, 07:23 AM.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Neil Frarey View Post

                          25 million to combat Asian carp, 7 million dollars for Reef fish management, 2.5 million dollars to count the number of Amber Jack fish in the Gulf of Mexico and another provision to promote the breading of fish in federal hatcheries. That's just about 35 million wasted dollars on fish ... not struggling Americans trying to stay alive ... but 35 million dollars on fish!!!

                          This COVID Relief Bill isn't for those who really really need it ... this bill is about buying Democratic votes. Pay forward!

                          The most insulting waste of money in this so called COVID Relief Bill?

                          Up to $1,800 per ... illegal alien! So, how much do Americans receive? $600 each in relief payments ...sigh. Americans only receive $600 each ... illegal aliens receive up to $1,800 each.

                          Gotta just love those sneaky darling Dems!
                          If $35 million were divided up among 200 million people, that'd be 17.5 cents per person. Of that $35 million, the majority of it is going to Tennessee and Kentucky, which are two Republican states, and it was added because of Republicans: https://www.wate.com/news/federal-fu...-river-basins/

                          Tennessee Wildlife Federation is proud of its contributions to securing these funds and extends a thank you to the many groups and people involved in this legislation, particularly Senators (Lamar) Alexander and (Mitch) McConnell as well as Congressmen (David) Kustoff, (Tim) Burchett, (John) Rose, (Phil) Roe, (Jim) Cooper and (Steve) Cohen — and their dedicated staff,” said Butler.
                          So you're complaining about an inconsequential percentage of the bill being spent on something that was requested by Republicans and putting the blame solely on Democrats for it, even though the bill had broad bipartisan support in both the house and the senate (which is controlled by Republicans). Sounds about par for the course.

                          Also, illegal immigrants obviously aren't getting $1,800 while others only receive $600:

                          "No unauthorized immigrants are getting Stimulus Checks under the new plan," said Gelatt. "And none got stimulus checks under the CARES Act.”

                          “Basically if you don’t have a social security number," Walker added. "You’re not going to get a stimulus check.”

                          Our experts said the confusion is likely due to a portion of the bill, allowing “mixed-status” households to receive stimulus checks. A "mixed-status" household is a family that includes at least one spouse that is a citizen or green card holder with a social security number, and another that is undocumented.

                          In the first round of stimulus checks back in March, the $1,200 stimulus check was not offered to "mixed-status" families. This meant that many citizens with qualifying incomes were left out of the first round of stimulus checks.

                          “The new fix is that - you know - US citizens or green card holders can get their stimulus payments regardless of who they married and who they filed taxes with,” Gelatt said.

                          Under the new law, still awaiting a signature from the president, a citizen or green card holder with a social security number, who is in a mixed-status family, will be entitled to the $600 check. The couple would also be eligible for an additional $600 for each dependent.
                          Last edited by Lucas Davies; Thursday, 24th December, 2020, 05:40 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Neil Frarey View Post


                            Up to $1,800 per ... illegal alien! So, how much do Americans receive? $600 each in relief payments ...sigh. Americans only receive $600 each ... illegal aliens receive up to $1,800 each.

                            Gotta just love those sneaky darling Dems!
                            Even if this were true, these "aliens"(what a term!) who immigrated into a country of immigrants, with less 'illegality' and less 'violence' than had the original settlers of 16th century, perhaps needed more help than others currently in that country, from the taxpayers in that country ... why does that upset a Canadian chesstalker so much?

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Lucas Davies View Post

                              So you're complaining about an inconsequential percentage of the bill...
                              Inconsequential for whom, Lucas?
                              You?

                              Originally posted by Lucas Davies View Post

                              ... blame solely on Democrats for it,
                              It is my understanding that bills first must receive a majority of votes in the Democratic controlled house of reps, this bill is all Pelosi's doing ...complete with her seal of approval, ha!

                              https://kids-clerk.house.gov/grade-s....html?intID=17


                              .
                              Last edited by Neil Frarey; Thursday, 24th December, 2020, 11:38 PM.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Dilip Panjwani View Post

                                Even if this were true, these "aliens"(what a term!) who immigrated into a country of immigrants, with less 'illegality' and less 'violence' than had the original settlers of 16th century, perhaps needed more help than others currently in that country, from the taxpayers in that country ... why does that upset a Canadian chesstalker so much?
                                Brutal term, I agree.

                                Haven't we progressed well past the 16th century? Moved forward, with much struggle & cost, to build upstanding countries of law & order? So for those who wish to become citizens must first follow those laws and order.

                                You're not suggesting lawlessness are you?

                                Comment

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