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I watched the video and it provides definitive proof that Nikolay had no access to a queen.
I can see how such a mistake by the Arbiter could easily happen given the speed of which events occurred (he thought the queen was accessible to Nikolay when in actuality it was in Bator's hand and only put back with capture pieces after promotion).
Since we have the video review like in hockey or any professional sports, isn't it just a simple measure of appealing, analyzing video and overturning an erroneous decision? In my opinion, it's not even a close call.
I really hope that those in charge make the correct decision to preserve the integrity of our noble game. This is our national championship with thousands of dollars and chess opportunities on the line for our players.
P.S. I would also put zero blame on Bator. It isn't his duty to "help" his opponent in the heat of the moment. People shouldn't attack his integrity. He's playing to win like Nikolay and they are both fabulous chess players.
Sincerely,
Jonathan Yu
Bator stood silent as his opponent is forced to under-promote. Perhaps in the heat of the moment Bator was unaware that he denied his opponent his queen but one thing we know 100 Percent for sure is that he did and if he see's the video he should be offering his resignation. It should go without saying that integrity is worth more then a victory, even an important one and the game of chess is bigger then that.
The position at first glance appears to be winning for Nikolay where he effectively ends up in a two pawns up queens on the board ending if allowing the game to take it's normal course.
Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Monday, 3rd July, 2017, 10:43 PM.
I watched the video and it provides definitive proof that Nikolay had no access to a queen.
I can see how such a mistake by the Arbiter could easily happen given the speed of which events occurred (he thought the queen was accessible to Nikolay when in actuality it was in Bator's hand and only put back with capture pieces after promotion).
Since we have the video review like in hockey or any professional sports, isn't it just a simple measure of appealing, analyzing video and overturning an erroneous decision? In my opinion, it's not even a close call.
I really hope that those in charge make the correct decision to preserve the integrity of our noble game. This is our national championship with thousands of dollars and chess opportunities on the line for our players.
P.S. I would also put zero blame on Bator. It isn't his duty to "help" his opponent in the heat of the moment. People shouldn't attack his integrity. He's playing to win like Nikolay and they are both fabulous chess players.
I know for sure that the stakes were very high: a trip to Tbilisi for the World Cup in September and another one to Batumi for the 2018 Chess Olympiad. To show good sportsmanship Bator should have allowed Nikolay to continue the game with a queen instead of the rook. A player can overrule the touch move rule if he wants. http://www.fide.com/component/conten...fair-play.html
1) Was there an Appeals Committee selected (or available) for this tournament?
2) If so - was an appeal made to the Appeals Committee? (the CFC Handbook makes no mention of a timeframe, but at one time an appeal had to be made in writing within 30 minutes of the game's completion or incident/interruption).
3) The "National Appeals Committee" chapter in the Handbook http://chess.ca/handbook#section-12 refers regularly to the (tournament) "Appeals Committee", so I'm not sure what happens if the appeal has not gone through this initial process. (I was at times a member of the NAC, and I'm fairly sure that all appeals sent to us had already gone through a tournament Appeals Committee procedure).
After the playoffs, I asked about the appeals process. I was told to appeal to the CFC, not to the tournament appeal committee.
1) Was there an Appeals Committee selected (or available) for this tournament?
2) If so - was an appeal made to the Appeals Committee? (the CFC Handbook makes no mention of a timeframe, but at one time an appeal had to be made in writing within 30 minutes of the game's completion or incident/interruption).
3) The "National Appeals Committee" chapter in the Handbook http://chess.ca/handbook#section-12 refers regularly to the (tournament) "Appeals Committee", so I'm not sure what happens if the appeal has not gone through this initial process. (I was at times a member of the NAC, and I'm fairly sure that all appeals sent to us had already gone through a tournament Appeals Committee procedure).
Yeah, I re-watched the first video right after posting. Bator puts the queen back on the table right after you promote and the hubbub is beginning. I agree with Bob G. that making an appeal to the NAC would be a good idea. I'm not sure you would be successful, but it won't hurt to try. I don't think the outcome of that game is fair.
Steve
Hi Steve,
Yes, I just sent an email to the CFC.
David Begoray - I was kicking myself for not getting a queen while I still had time. "every russian school boy knows you should get a queen 20 moves before promoting, or even for a psychological trick" Its too bad I am not a russian school boy, and even if I was - there would be no queen on the table.
I would like to Believe that the Mighty Bator would not intentionally Queen-napp his opponent's Queen. But we all know that Chess Players are devious.
Here i would like to state the Arbiters were Dunces and should have made sure that at least Two Extra Queens were available ( I think they should have had 16 extra Queens just in case they queened all of their pawns during the game). Err "every Russian School Boy Knows.....[add appropriate stereotype rule here]." David Begoray
Presumably because the queen returned to the table right before the arbiter intervened. Everybody assumed it was always there..spectators also said they did not see the queen, but later saw it already after the conflict.
Yeah, I re-watched the first video right after posting. Bator puts the queen back on the table right after you promote and the hubbub is beginning. I agree with Bob G. that making an appeal to the NAC would be a good idea. I'm not sure you would be successful, but it won't hurt to try. I don't think the outcome of that game is fair.
Whether Bator withheld the Queen intentionally or not is not the question here. He was holding the Queen that Nikolay needed and that's already enough information to rule in Nikolay's favour. There is no way that you punish the person who 1) doesn't have his own Queen to promote to 2) doesn't have an extra one provided by the tournament.
Comical that our national championship didn't have arbiters who would think to place extra Queens on the table :D
Bator only realized what he was doing when all hell broke loose, and replaced the queen where it should have been all the timel He probably didn't appreciate that there was a known prat as referee, who royally screwed up?
However he stayed conspicuously silent throughout the mess, and in my opinion lost all rights......he should be forfeited.
13.3 *The arbiter shall observe the games, especially when the players are short of time, enforce decisions he has made and impose penalties on players where appropriate.
14.1 Member federations may ask FIDE to give an official decision about problems relating to the Laws of Chess.
Richard Berube emailed me that, "with this new information, i Will ask the arbiter of his décision star the same."
I am not sure about the legalities and procedures I (they) should follow. Is it the arbiter's decision, or the CFC appeal committee?
First, it is the arbiters decision. Then you may appeal the decision to the CFC appeals committee.
But I would send the appeal to CFC right away. Just send an email to CFC office.
Last edited by Bob Gillanders; Monday, 3rd July, 2017, 08:26 PM.
Well, we do elect a National Appeal Committee every year.
Let's give them something to do.
Nikolay, you should formally lodge an appeal with the CFC.
Just my 2 cents.
Richard Berube emailed me that, "with this new information, i Will ask the arbiter of his décision star the same."
I am not sure about the legalities and procedures I (they) should follow. Is it the arbiter's decision, or the CFC appeal committee?
Well, we do elect a National Appeal Committee every year.
Let's give them something to do.
Nikolay, you should formally lodge an appeal with the CFC.
Just my 2 cents.
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