Chess Canada Webzine A SIMPLE TASK FAILED

[Eric Hansen]

Re: Good job Vincent

First of all, I'd like to congratulate Mr. Chow on creating what seems to be a pretty good site, but what is the purpose of having two links to get to the exact same thing? I find it a bit strange that there are links at the top of the page and also on the sidebar. In my opinion, the second pair of links aren't needed. What do others think?
http://members.chess.ca/

I think www.uschess.org is an excellent federation website, and we should try to use that as a model.

[Keith MacKinnon]

Re: Good job Vincent

First of all, I'd like to congratulate Mr. Chow on creating what seems to be a pretty good site, but what is the purpose of having two links to get to the exact same thing? I find it a bit strange that there are links at the top of the page and also on the sidebar. In my opinion, the second pair of links aren't needed. What do others think?
http://members.chess.ca/

[Vincent Chow]

Re: Chess Canada Webzine A SIMPLE TASK FAILED

I can see where people can get confused with the date posted. Unfortunately, there is no field to enter the start date for the tournament.
I would have to alter the database/table to add another field and write a custom module. I did so for some of the other pages. I suppose I will have to reprogram this page as time allows and hopefully simplify it.

I agree with most of Steve's comments. In fact, I installed DotNetNuke on one of my development computers two years ago. There are several reasons I chose Joomla. One of the major reasons is that the ISP limited the size of the SQL Server database to 25 MB. After that we would have to pay for an upgrade. Since MySQL and SQL Server in this case would have comparable performance the choice was clear. DNN is free, but the database wasn't.

I deliberately simulated a magazine and not a website. We already have a website. It was actually tough to do. I have submissions that would stretch a "webzine" concept such as pictures for a gallery, games, history docs, comments more suitable for a forum, etc. Don't get me wrong, many have merit. I will try to incorporate some as well as introduce other ideas. Currently, I am planning a submit games for master analysis.

I do take this as constructive criticism (better for my peace of mind) and would like to thank Steve. I will add to my todo list.

[Anthony Cheron]

Re: You should look at little closer

I can see how Anthony got confused by the dates sitting beside each tournament listing. .

Thank you for verifying that this particular page can be confusing. I honestly was frustrated. ( now I know where to go to get the results, but think of other people having the same issue /issues )

Most of us would like things to succeed. Perhaps my frustration resulted in a small step forward. I would like to think so.

[Bob Gillanders]

Thanks Steve......

for the constructive suggestions. I will pass them onto Vince.:)

[Steve Karpik]

Re: Chess Canada Webzine A SIMPLE TASK FAILED

It's these techies that make the sites hard to navigate.

Good web site design is user-centered. The design should be intuitive (i.e. the route to a particular objective should be clear and obvious). Behind a design is a technology (ASP .NET, PHP, or whatever) but that is invisible and largely irrelevant to the user. "Techies" implement a design. If the design is poor (and that doesn't mean the colours are ugly), then the web site does not communicate clearly. It's not a problem with "techies".

PS A good web site design doesn't depend on you memorizing what is behind a particular button.

[John Brown]

Re: Chess Canada Webzine A SIMPLE TASK FAILED

It's these techies that make the sites hard to navigate.
Even Chess Talk was a nightmare when Chris Malon first chnged it's design etc.

If you keep it simple then everyone can enjoy the results. Complicate it and you loose many in the technical talk.

Oh yes and if people would learn to read and not just mouse click then maybe they could find the things they want. I learned this when showing seniors how to find things on the internet. If it is simple to see and find then they like it.
Add frills and chills and they shelf it.

I did not like the Webzine at first either but once I got used to the (where things are ) clicks . I feel that it is going forward.

When is the next change of the front page etc. coming ? April I hope.....

[Steve Karpik]

Re: You should look at little closer

After reading Anthony's post, I have a few comments on the design and information architecture of the CFC online magazine.

I can see how Anthony got confused by the dates sitting beside each tournament listing. Looking at the page source code I see that you're using Joomla! (not a huge favourite of mine). I'm guessing that the webmaster used a "News" or "Announcements" module the tournament calendar. Perhaps rather than treating these as announcements, they might be better presented as calendar events (which doesn't mean you need to show a calendar per se). I'm not a Joomla! expert but I'm guessing that it has to have some sort of "Calendar" module that would be more appropriate for tournament announcements (two columns -- first column the starting date for the tournament, 2nd column the tournament name hyperlinked to the details). If nothing exists (which I doubt), you might have to write a custom module but I doubt that would be necessary. Restructuring this page might eliminate some confusion. Sometimes what is perfectly clear to the web developer is completely opaque to the user.

On a more general note, my feeling is that your main navigation is too closely bound to the notion of an index for an old-school paper magazine. You've got about 3 times as many top level navigation elements than one would generally aim for. Look at the ChessTalk bulletin board where you've only got a main nav with 7 elements. Each of these can of course point to pages deeper in the site architecture.

The site just feels too much like a magazine right now which means that you're not really taking advantage of the fact that it is a web site not a paper magazine (each of these media -- magazine and web site -- have strengths and weaknesses that have to be worked with). But the great thing about the web is that redesigns and refinements are not too hard to do. I've been responsible for many sites in the past where we initially missed the boat on the information architecture and had to refine it.

Lastly a technical suggestion that you may disregard entirely. Joomla! has a very simple section/category/article hierarchy. If what you're doing fits Joomla! then Joomla! is a great content management system (CMS) although I don't like PHP at all. I lean more towards DotNetNuke (also an Open Source CMS) but a lot more flexible with a very large assortment of modules out of which pages can be built. The DotNetNuke page templating scheme is extremely flexible so much so that your information architecture is not dictated by the underlying application.

I've built quite a number of web sites based on DotNetNuke and have been very happy with the result (for instance, the Scarborough Chess Club web site is a very simple application of DotNetNuke while a little bit more complicated one is here: www.5scwc.org where the navigation and menu is a little bit more complicated). And like with Joomla!, the price for DotNetNuke is right -- $0.00.

However, the choice of one's favourite CMS tends to be a lot like one's predilection towards a particular religion and can lead to heated debate and probably shouldn't be discussed at the dinner table.:)

Hopefully all the above will be taken in the spirit of friendly, constructive criticism.

[Ken MacDonald]

Was That An Apology?

xoxoxoxoxo

[Anthony Cheron]

Re: You should look at little closer

I think you are looking at the dates the items were posted.

You are right. They seem to be the dates the items were posted.

Question: What purpose do these posted dates serve? They are under the category 'Date'. One would think that the category of 'Date' would mean the 'date of the tournament'.

Who really cares when the items are posted anyway?

The dates of the tournaments are relevant, not the date of the posting.

Keep up the good work Bob. I guess jobs are hard to find nowadays, and wish you all the luck in the future.

Tip- make it easier for the end-users.

[Bob Gillanders]

You should look at little closer

Lets give the Chess Canada Webzine a simple task to perform.

Check for the upcoming tournaments in your Province. Simple task right?

This is what you get for Ontario:

http://members.chess.ca/index.php?op...d=42&Itemid=61

13 entries --- NON OF WHICH ARE IN THE FUTURE! -- TASK FAILED

ALL OF THE OTHER LISTED PROVINCES PRODUCED SIMILAR RESULTS! ( Quebec was not embarrased by this as it is not listed)

Can tournament directors rely on the CFC for promotion of their tournaments by the use of Chess Canada Webzine? From today's results? NO. From tomorrow's results? WHO KNOWS

Common people, speak up. You have a right to know where tournaments are being held! -- especially if you are paying CFC dues.

Suggestion (my positive criticism): dismantle the (useless) CFC Webzine and put out a magazine --- Even if it starts out as a 2 page newsletter run from a Xerox machine at 2 cents a page.

If you actually took a few moments to read the listing, you will see they are all future events. I think you are looking at the dates the items were posted.

Thank you for pointing out all the tournament listings for the next 3 months and what a spectacular job our new webzine is doing of promoting them. If you want to go backwards and start a 2 page newsletter, go ahead. You will make many friends at Canada Post. As for me, I'll stick with the webzine. ;)

I will also take this opportunity to point out that we have a self serve tournament listing on the discussion board. TD's are finding this is an excellent venue to advertise their events, allowing them a 2 way dialogue with players, an opportunity to post preregistered lists etc.

Just another free service courtesy of the CFC.

Any other complaints Anthony.

[Anthony Cheron]

Lets give the Chess Canada Webzine a simple task to perform.

Check for the upcoming tournaments in your Province. Simple task right?

This is what you get for Ontario:

http://members.chess.ca/index.php?op...d=42&Itemid=61

13 entries --- NON OF WHICH ARE IN THE FUTURE! -- TASK FAILED

ALL OF THE OTHER LISTED PROVINCES PRODUCED SIMILAR RESULTS! ( Quebec was not embarrased by this as it is not listed)

Can tournament directors rely on the CFC for promotion of their tournaments by the use of Chess Canada Webzine? From today's results? NO. From tomorrow's results? WHO KNOWS

Common people, speak up. You have a right to know where tournaments are being held! -- especially if you are paying CFC dues.

Suggestion (my positive criticism): dismantle the (useless) CFC Webzine and put out a magazine --- Even if it starts out as a 2 page newsletter run from a Xerox machine at 2 cents a page.