Will Round 1 ever start on time?

[Brian Clarke]

I don’t believe that I have ever attended a weekend or week-long tournament that started on time. This includes tournaments throughout Ontario and several locations in USA. It includes tournaments held 20 years ago and tournaments held within the past year. It includes tournaments that I attended as a participant and those that I either organized, directed or both.

From experience, I can confidently state that getting Round 1 up and running is far more difficult and creates more anxiety for directors than all other rounds combined. Why is that? It’s because registration is still going on immediately before the start of Round 1 and keeps on going well into the scheduled start time of Round 1. If things go well, the round will start about ½ hour late. If they don’t go well, it can be over an hour late.

So just before the round most people show up, go to the registration area, pay their money, and then stand around for what seems like forever, waiting for the start. Other people know that the round will start late and avoid the wait by showing up late themselves, knowing full well that they can still get in. This is unfair to the earlier arrivers. In all the registration commotion, the director is trying to keep track of who paid the entry fee, who has expired memberships that need to be renewed, who needs byes, who is withdrawing, and who simply isn’t going to show up. All this is a recipe for disaster and results in frequent pairing errors.

So what’s the solution? I have thought about this for a long time and I propose the following for future tournaments:

1. All participants must preregister before an established deadline (by email, in person, or other suitable means set up by the organizer).
2. All participants must prepay (by email, PayPal, in person, or other suitable means).
3. All participants must have CFC memberships that are current up to the final day of the tournament. Those that don’t can submit payment for renewal during their preregistrations.
4. The director will input the roster of participants into the pairing software database (usually SwissSys or Swiss Manager).
5. Any preregistered person can withdraw up to 30 minutes before the scheduled start of round 1 by notifying the director by email or other suitable means. Persons who send withdrawal notifications before this deadline will be refunded in full.
6. The director will adjust the roster in the pairing software as required until the 30 minutes before start of Round 1 deadline.
7. The director pairs the sections for Round 1 and posts them in the playing areas approximately 15 minutes before the start of Round 1.
8. Participants get to their boards while the director make announcements.
9. Round 1 starts on time!
10. Any persons who did not preregister but show up to play can be added by the director at his/her discretion, but they will not be included in the Swiss pairing. These persons will be paired with whomever is available. They will be included in the Swiss pairing for later rounds.

Note that there is almost no risk to preregistering and prepaying since this can be reversed with full refund right up to ½ hour before start by notifying the director. With the preponderance of cell phones, Wi-Fi and the like, that should be easy for just about everyone. If you preregister and then fail to show up without notifying the director, you forfeit your game and you will be withdrawn from the tournament without a refund.

I am seriously thinking of implementing this arrangement for future tournaments but I would like to get feedback on the viability of the above and welcome any tweaks you have to offer.

[Gordon Ritchie]

Re: Will Round 1 ever start on time?

I share your pain but here in Ottawa we have been most fortunate to have most of our weekenders directed by Halldor the Terrible who invariable gives the signal to start right on the button.

[Nigel Hanrahan]

Good organization helps!

You are missing the obvious. Discounts for early registration, for example, helps to make the task easier and is more of a carrot than a stick. I have heard these arguments about how first rounds are always chaotic. However, more recently, it's been also argued that it all has to do with organization and that well organized tournaments do not have such problems. Why not ask some of the BC organizers, for example, about their successes?

A recent example comes to mind. The Canadian Sr ch, recently held in Surrey, B.C., had 50 early registrants and so closed registration several weeks before the event. Yes, there were a few changes after that, but nothing significant to delay the start. And that was with group photos, a visiting chess dignitary, etc. Ask the TD (Joe Roback) and some of the organizers (I think including Paul Leblanc, Victoria Jung-Doknjas, Roger Patterson I think, et al) what they did.

[Alex Ferreira]

Re: Good organization helps!

Hi,


I have been spoiled in some Ottawa tournaments myself, a few years ago. Registrations closed one full hour before Round 1, and Round 1 started on the dot. But as mentioned above, this has been the exception.
Why?
Lenient organizers and an undisciplined chess community. Is it fair to 80 players that 20 arrive late? Of course not! Yet as you mentioned, you have some people who will casually arrive late to avoid the rush. Others arrive late because they arrive late everywhere they go. Others have this "understanding" that Round 1 will start late anyway.


Organizers in North America seem to be willing to do anything to accommodate all players, making all kinds of exceptions, and people take advantage!
Different organizers also have their own challenges.
For example for us at Hart House the challenge is... we cannot issue cheques as prizes the day the tournament finishes, because they would have to be signed by our Finance Department, which is obviously shut down on a Sunday evening. This means we need entry-fees cash flow to be able to pay prizes in cash. Cash entry fees means paying the day of, line-ups, the works.
One tool I have found useful is... steepen the late fees. When we had it at $10 late fee, we would have 10 people at the door sometimes. Now we charge $20 and have 1 or 2. If we still had 10 people I would continue to raise it until it stopped. Or we could not allow late entries at all. We used to accept "early entries" by e-mail up to the night before, now we give ourselves 36-48 hours advance notification to be better prepared, since a good turn-out at Hart House can be quite a large number of people. I absolutely refuse to believe that 90%+ of the participants don't know whether they will be available or not to play chess all weekend at least 72 hours in advance, yet given the opportunity, 25-30% will *always* register as late as they can.

We can still close early registrations X amount of time before Round 1, or deem it invalid, remove players, etc... It's frantic, it's crazy, but we are usually able to start Round 1 about 15 minutes after the scheduled / advertised time (was not always the case, our first couple tournaments a few years ago was about 1 hour late).
Is this acceptable? If it remains as is without several complaints, it may very well be the way it continues to be!
Can we change it? Definitely! Should we? Probably.

It would be very simple... do it two or three times with strict deadlines during which there will be several displeased people who will miss a Round 1 pairing, and then a new norm and set of standards takes over.
I wouldn't dare arriving late at an Ottawa tournament, and if it were to happen I would expect not to be paired in Round 1.


Alex Ferreira

[Roger Patterson]

Re: Will Round 1 ever start on time?

I don’t believe that I have ever attended a weekend or week-long tournament that started on time..

you should try attending a Victoria Chess tournament (e.g. Grand Pacific Open, BC Open, etc.). Our TDs are usually watching the second hand of their watch as they make their opening remarks so that the precise moment is used.

Not that I don't understand your remarks. But we take the point of being on time seriously and we put the resources into making sure it happens. Some things that we do:

1) Pre-registration. Make it simple, painless, and cheaper to register and pay online in advance. Typically we have 90-95% of entries pre-registered.

2) Shock and awe in providing enough resources for on site registration. Typically, that 2-3 people at the registration desk plus the TD. If you are paying attention to my numbers in point one, that is 4 people for maybe 8 entries. Using one person is not enough (5 minutes per entry times 8 entries is 40 minutes which is too much)

3) cut off registration at least 30 minutes in advance. Well, we don't always meet that precisely but we do get the round started on time.

4) Deal with CFC membership as much as possible before the event. Emails go out to all pre-registered players with membership issues well in advance. Doesn't solve the whole problem but it sure helps. And chasing CFC memberships is a real time sink.

So why do most events so typically start late? In my view:

a) understaffed.

b) underestimation of the time / resources it takes to process an entry

c) they don't really think round 1 starting late is a problem. I've been told that by one particular organizer. His last event started 1.5 hours late (so I'm told - I don't go to that person's events, partially for that reason).

[Roger Patterson]

ps

something else we do is that our pre-registration closes on the Monday before the event. This allows everyone involved in processing entries to do their thing (entering SwissSys, chasing CFC memberships, etc.) at a reasonably relaxed pace without being rushed. Is as much as a number of people will pre-register only at 11:59pm on the last day of pre-registration, you need some elapsed time to deal with that.

[Aris Marghetis]

Re: Good organization helps!

Hi,


I have been spoiled in some Ottawa tournaments myself, a few years ago. Registrations closed one full hour before Round 1, and Round 1 started on the dot. But as mentioned above, this has been the exception.
Why?
Lenient organizers and an undisciplined chess community. Is it fair to 80 players that 20 arrive late? Of course not! Yet as you mentioned, you have some people who will casually arrive late to avoid the rush. Others arrive late because they arrive late everywhere they go. Others have this "understanding" that Round 1 will start late anyway.


Organizers in North America seem to be willing to do anything to accommodate all players, making all kinds of exceptions, and people take advantage!
Different organizers also have their own challenges.
For example for us at Hart House the challenge is... we cannot issue cheques as prizes the day the tournament finishes, because they would have to be signed by our Finance Department, which is obviously shut down on a Sunday evening. This means we need entry-fees cash flow to be able to pay prizes in cash. Cash entry fees means paying the day of, line-ups, the works.
One tool I have found useful is... steepen the late fees. When we had it at $10 late fee, we would have 10 people at the door sometimes. Now we charge $20 and have 1 or 2. If we still had 10 people I would continue to raise it until it stopped. Or we could not allow late entries at all. We used to accept "early entries" by e-mail up to the night before, now we give ourselves 36-48 hours advance notification to be better prepared, since a good turn-out at Hart House can be quite a large number of people. I absolutely refuse to believe that 90%+ of the participants don't know whether they will be available or not to play chess all weekend at least 72 hours in advance, yet given the opportunity, 25-30% will *always* register as late as they can.

We can still close early registrations X amount of time before Round 1, or deem it invalid, remove players, etc... It's frantic, it's crazy, but we are usually able to start Round 1 about 15 minutes after the scheduled / advertised time (was not always the case, our first couple tournaments a few years ago was about 1 hour late).
Is this acceptable? If it remains as is without several complaints, it may very well be the way it continues to be!
Can we change it? Definitely! Should we? Probably.

It would be very simple... do it two or three times with strict deadlines during which there will be several displeased people who will miss a Round 1 pairing, and then a new norm and set of standards takes over.
I wouldn't dare arriving late at an Ottawa tournament, and if it were to happen I would expect not to be paired in Round 1.


Alex Ferreira

Well written Alex. I was doing similar things in Ottawa when you joined us. I would set an alarm on my watch, for an hour before, and then closed off registrations no matter who showed up, to ensure the vast majority of the pairings were on time. After completing first-round pairings, then I would return to anyone who came in after the 1-hour limit. And I would keep raising late registration fees like you, and eventually, it increased the percentage of timely registrations. I would get personally disappointed if I started any round over 15 SECONDS late. By the way, thank you so much to all the people who spoke well to my reputation on some other threads recently. I humbly appreciate your kind supportive words. I will not respond directly to inanities. I really care about arbiter-ing, and I wish haters would think about how their words can hurt. Peace of mind to all.

[John Brown]

Re: Good organization helps!

Hi Brian;
Two simple solutions
1. Eliminate Email registration if you do not pay before the deadline then you get pot luck on being paired Round 1.
2. Make late fees 0ver the top say $30-50. If that does not get people to pay early or show up early then you'll never stop the late starts.
I do support the idea (if you give enough notice) that you cannot play, then you get back your entry.

[Erik Malmsten]

Re: Good organization helps!

These days it takes 3 minutes to print and post pairings. With assistants handling the late entrants, finding the ratings until 30 minutes before. Can't pairings be posted 15 minutes before and td announcements at the start.

Pair latecomers 30 minutes after the round has started and give both of them a time penalty.

This doesn't apply to blitz where most entrants are last minute.

[Pierre Denommee]

Re: Good organization helps!

Hi,


I have been spoiled in some Ottawa tournaments myself, a few years ago. Registrations closed one full hour before Round 1, and Round 1 started on the dot. But as mentioned above, this has been the exception.
Why?
Lenient organizers and an undisciplined chess community. Is it fair to 80 players that 20 arrive late? Of course not! Yet as you mentioned, you have some people who will casually arrive late to avoid the rush. Others arrive late because they arrive late everywhere they go. Others have this "understanding" that Round 1 will start late anyway.


Organizers in North America seem to be willing to do anything to accommodate all players, making all kinds of exceptions, and people take advantage!
Different organizers also have their own challenges.
For example for us at Hart House the challenge is... we cannot issue cheques as prizes the day the tournament finishes, because they would have to be signed by our Finance Department, which is obviously shut down on a Sunday evening. This means we need entry-fees cash flow to be able to pay prizes in cash. Cash entry fees means paying the day of, line-ups, the works.
One tool I have found useful is... steepen the late fees. When we had it at $10 late fee, we would have 10 people at the door sometimes. Now we charge $20 and have 1 or 2. If we still had 10 people I would continue to raise it until it stopped. Or we could not allow late entries at all. We used to accept "early entries" by e-mail up to the night before, now we give ourselves 36-48 hours advance notification to be better prepared, since a good turn-out at Hart House can be quite a large number of people. I absolutely refuse to believe that 90%+ of the participants don't know whether they will be available or not to play chess all weekend at least 72 hours in advance, yet given the opportunity, 25-30% will *always* register as late as they can.

We can still close early registrations X amount of time before Round 1, or deem it invalid, remove players, etc... It's frantic, it's crazy, but we are usually able to start Round 1 about 15 minutes after the scheduled / advertised time (was not always the case, our first couple tournaments a few years ago was about 1 hour late).
Is this acceptable? If it remains as is without several complaints, it may very well be the way it continues to be!
Can we change it? Definitely! Should we? Probably.

It would be very simple... do it two or three times with strict deadlines during which there will be several displeased people who will miss a Round 1 pairing, and then a new norm and set of standards takes over.
I wouldn't dare arriving late at an Ottawa tournament, and if it were to happen I would expect not to be paired in Round 1.


Alex Ferreira

Late registrations are a big problem. Some European tournaments have no problem with a "no registration on site policy". I know one case in Montreal in which there was 65 preregistrations and 100 registrations at the door. The 65 preregistrations covered the rental cost of the tournament venue only, leaving 0$ in price. Money did rule and the tournament has begun late and paid all its advertised prices. After this tournament, a mandatory first round bye for registration after the deadline has been introduced unless the arbiter decide otherwise (if there are one on two late registrations, the arbiter can handle them).

North America is the Realm of Capitalism. Most Organizers maximize the short term profit and don't care about the players waiting even if this can be bad for long term profit and for the promotion of the game.

In Quebec, we have another problem : the triple rating system : FIDE, CFC and FQE. Pairing software accept only two ratings: FIDE and national. We can put the FQE rating as national rating, but that will not solve the problem. The rating check for the rating list not used by the software is manual. This significantly slow down the data entry process.

[Doug Gillis]

Re: Good organization helps!

As a regular tournament player I do not see what all the fuss is about. For years my practise has been to 1. register by email at least no later than the day before the tournament, (more often than not several days before the tournament), 2. arrive an hour prior to the start of the first round, and 3. pay cash at the site. I do not see how this practise is the cause of the first round to start late. A player who has pre-registered still has to present oneself to the organizer and how does handing over the cash entry fee slow things down? With the computers normally in use, it seems to be just a matter of checking in the box whether a player has pre-paid or is paying on site. The notion of having to pre-register and pre-pay for a weekend Swiss weeks in advance or be considered late strikes me as ridiculous, (not to mention a "money grab").

I am old school so paying by electronic wire transfer etc is not an option. That leaves sending the entry fee by mailing a cheque (at the moment there is a postal strike looming) or paying cash at the site.

I am regularly at the site an hour before the start and have often arrived before the organizer.

I feel that the simple solution is just to announce that if a player does not arrive physically by no later than 15 minutes before the start of the first round then the player is not guaranteed to play in the first round.

[John Brown]

Re: Good organization helps!

As a regular tournament player I do not see what all the fuss is about. For years my practise has been to 1. register by email at least no later than the day before the tournament, (more often than not several days before the tournament), 2. arrive an hour prior to the start of the first round, and 3. pay cash at the site. I do not see how this practise is the cause of the first round to start late. A player who has pre-registered still has to present oneself to the organizer and how does handing over the cash entry fee slow things down? With the computers normally in use, it seems to be just a matter of checking in the box whether a player has pre-paid or is paying on site. The notion of having to pre-register and pre-pay for a weekend Swiss weeks in advance or be considered late strikes me as ridiculous, (not to mention a "money grab").

I am old school so paying by electronic wire transfer etc is not an option. That leaves sending the entry fee by mailing a cheque (at the moment there is a postal strike looming) or paying cash at the site.

I am regularly at the site an hour before the start and have often arrived before the organizer.

I feel that the simple solution is just to announce that if a player does not arrive physically by no later than 15 minutes before the start of the first round then the player is not guaranteed to play in the first round.

Hi Doug;
We could have a monkey collect the money and as long as the donkey can make change there is no problem.
As you have not been involved in the registration of tournaments it makes sense that you know little of what is involved with checking data bases , registering the player in the computer after the money has been taken.
That is what takes time. Paying ahead of time allows organizers get those players into the computer right away.
My advice is run a tournament and see our nightmares. Or be a player and stay silent.

[Mathieu Cloutier]

Re: Good organization helps!

A few years ago, we had a huge opportunity to have a world class tournament in downtown Montréal, with the Québec Open being played at the Queen Elizabeth hotel. And yet, the organizers completely missed the boat with late registrations and a first round that started more than 1 hour late.

It's a cultural thing it seems. As Brian says, some players just assume they can come in late and still get paired for first round. As long as we let that go, chess will never be considered a serious competitive activity.

For locals events, there should be a freeze on registrations at least 1h before the start of first round. For bigger events, the freeze could be 24h before the first round. And I mean a hard freeze. Anyone coming after that gets a bye.

It always baffles me that chess players can't register 1h in advance for an activity that last several days, if not a week.

[Hugh Brodie]

Re: Will Round 1 ever start on time?

Another problem is players who pre-register without paying, and then don't show up for the first round - giving out unnecessary full points.

And then there are memberships - it seems at Montreal events there are always people who haven't paid their memberships - even with stern warnings (e.g. they won't be paired the next round, but I've never seen that happen). All membership problems should be settled before the first round with the player not getting paired unless his membership is up to date (e.g.) 30 or 60 minutes before round 1 (allow the option of a full/partial refund). Such players should be notified as far in advance as possible that their entry is "incomplete".

[Brian Clarke]

Re: Good organization helps!

Actually, I welcome all comments, whether from other organizers and arbiters or just regular players who have never done either. While Doug may be happy to hang around for an hour or so before the start, I can't imagine everybody feels the same way. That's especially true for parents of players who do nothing but hang around for the whole weekend.

I do think that it is important to minimize wait times, pairing errors, people who get paired to no-shows, etc., and that's what I'm trying to do.