IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

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  • #16
    Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

    Originally posted by Ed Seedhouse View Post
    It wouldn't be chess anymore.



    It would already be a different game.

    In any event I don't think there would be any need to introduce pure luck into chess to make it a good TV sport. Look at golf. If they can make golf a spectator sport without changing it's rules they can do the same with chess. It's just a matter of creativity.
    True, it wouldn't be chess any more, it would require a new name. The actual over-the-board play would be just like playing chess from some non-standard starting position (never the same) with your King and no more than 7 other pieces / pawns.

    But your comparison to golf is laughable. What are the demographics of the TV golf audience? Probably at least 80% retired men who have nothing better to do and enjoy watching something that moves slowly so as not to confuse them and shows a lot of nice, manicured scenery. Golf does attract lots of spectators to the actual tournaments because it's outdoors, people get to walk around, enjoy nature and a fair degree of quiet. And golf is big, it needs lots of acreage, so people can find a spot and still get a good view. You could try holding an outdoor chess tournament, but you wouldn't get away with charging spectators the kind of fees that golf charges. Very few people will get a good view of anything unless it's on a jumbotron somewhere, and all they're going to see is a piece move maybe every 15 minutes. If they try moving from board to board, they don't get anything, because chess isn't divided up into short segments. You have to watch the entire game to get anything out of it. Remember, we are talking about the general public here, who don't follow or understand chess. They'll just shake their heads and wonder why they wasted their time and money.

    I'd also point out that for all it's skill level, golf still includes a large degree of luck, and unknowns can still beat the likes of Tiger Woods on any given weekend. Chess is completely devoid of luck, and the general public just doesn't like that. You say it's just a matter of creativity. To that, I say that if the creativity doesn't include introducing some degree of luck plus dividing the game into smaller segments, the effort to have chess achieve mass spectator popularity and regular TV coverage to even half the levels as poker has achieved will fail miserably.

    Incidentally, the top prizes in the World Series of Poker are much better than the top prizes for any of the golf major tournaments. Poker doesn't restrict entry to any top echelon of players. Anyone with $1500 to $10,000 can enter one of over 50 separate WSOP bracelet-level events, and guess what, thousands of them do. This is what those who dream of chess popularity have yearned for.... for years and years and years....

    *** the preceding was sponsored by the Debbie Downer Foundation.
    Only the rushing is heard...
    Onward flies the bird.

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    • #17
      Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

      One can increase the luck of winning a prize without changing the nature of the game.

      For starters, don't have ratings. When people sit down to play poker with non-elite Pro X (i.e not someone like Ivey) they probably know that he is better, but not how much better. Ratings give players an accurate gauge of where they stand. That's bad for the dreamers who hope to win it all.

      Also pair randomly. That way some 1600-strength player can get lucky and face a series of 1200s and win it all over Masters who are battling it out.

      Chess by its nature is an elitist activity. The average chess player is much smarter, likes thinking more, and has a longer attention span than the average person. You can dummy down the game, but that is likely to drive out the only people in this country who are passionate about it in the first place. ;-)
      "Tom is a well known racist, and like most of them he won't admit it, possibly even to himself." - Ed Seedhouse, October 4, 2020.

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      • #18
        Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

        Kevin has commented on the Presidential race.

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        • #19
          Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

          Originally posted by Jean-Pierre Rhéaume View Post
          Thank you Mr Berry for giving us the link.

          Over the years, I've heard often about that Gallup study, but NEVER saw the questions and numbers.

          When Camille Coudari called me in 1979 to suggest splitting the bill to find out how many chess players there are in Canada, it seemed like a good idea.

          (1)
          I've been told often that Québec (FQE ?) never paid its share of the bill.

          (2)
          Also, I was told the survey was an ''omnibus'' one : the questions on chess were I slight portion of the whole survey (i.e. it was not a survey on chess).

          Anything true in (1) and (2) ?

          Thank you again for your nice work.

          JPR
          You're welcome. According to the Wayback Machine, the poll has been there at least since 2005. It's well-indexed by google.

          1. Somebody paid the bill. AFAIR, the total was something like $800 to $900, so each half was something like $400 to $450.

          2. Sure, it might well have been an omnibus survey. I didn't ask. Gallup couldn't balance its books by charging $900 for a one-off survey!

          PS I replied earlier, but at the moment I clicked Preview Post, the chesstalk server was down, and I could not recover. Fortunately (for all) it was not a long reply. Lesson: copy and paste to a scratch area.

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          • #20
            Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

            Originally posted by Jonathan Berry View Post
            You're welcome. According to the Wayback Machine, the poll has been there at least since 2005. It's well-indexed by google.

            1. Somebody paid the bill. AFAIR, the total was something like $800 to $900, so each half was something like $400 to $450.

            2. Sure, it might well have been an omnibus survey. I didn't ask. Gallup couldn't balance its books by charging $900 for a one-off survey!

            PS I replied earlier, but at the moment I clicked Preview Post, the chesstalk server was down, and I could not recover. Fortunately (for all) it was not a long reply. Lesson: copy and paste to a scratch area.
            Thank you Mr Berry.

            Lesson: copy and paste to a scratch area.

            I almost always do that, with my e-mail also.

            have a nice week-end.

            JPR

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            • #21
              Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

              Seems like Kevin is too busy finding odd pictures to post on his blog and it seems the long-awaited expose on the CFC is now sometime "this week"...

              This reminds me of another tome of his that he threatened to release many times (and I believe he finally did - after a number of false starts). Likely he has decided to wait until after the CFC AGM... by then it will be even older news, whatever he has to say. The piecemeal release strategy is pointless - why not release it all, NOW, before the AGM?
              ...Mike Pence: the Lord of the fly.

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              • #22
                Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                I love his odd pics :) that and the jokes... It provides great material to email to my dad

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                • #23
                  Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                  Does anyone find Spraggett's countdown to a big storey even remotely similar to the chesstalk stunt he pulled a few years back with a similar count down?

                  I'll be surprised if he has anything even remotely interesting after the countdown is over. In addition, the threats of lawyers or at least the implication they need be consulted is another popular theme for this guy (it was used last time).

                  His site has some great games, but some really base material as well. Its a mix of his games, great knowledge for the history of chess and... crap. The pictures posted on his site are probably equivalent to the tv network Fox for their overall standpoint. Entertaining stuff to the over-sexed masses. If he got rid of them it would be a top-notch site which I think could bring him serious acclaim.

                  I appreciate Spraggett's contribution to chess in both his great games and historical reports. Yet like another, brighter chess light - Bobby Fischer - his outside-of-chess contributions seem to be media fodder. Good thing nobody is inclined to take away his assets here in Canada, that might lead to an even more powerful analogy with Bobby.

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                  • #24
                    Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                    Originally posted by Mavros Whissell View Post
                    Does anyone find Spraggett's countdown to a big storey even remotely similar to the chesstalk stunt he pulled a few years back with a similar count down?

                    I'll be surprised if he has anything even remotely interesting after the countdown is over. In addition, the threats of lawyers or at least the implication they need be consulted is another popular theme for this guy (it was used last time).

                    His site has some great games, but some really base material as well. Its a mix of his games, great knowledge for the history of chess and... crap. The pictures posted on his site are probably equivalent to the tv network Fox for their overall standpoint. Entertaining stuff to the over-sexed masses. If he got rid of them it would be a top-notch site which I think could bring him serious acclaim.

                    I appreciate Spraggett's contribution to chess in both his great games and historical reports. Yet like another, brighter chess light - Bobby Fischer - his outside-of-chess contributions seem to be media fodder. Good thing nobody is inclined to take away his assets here in Canada, that might lead to an even more powerful analogy with Bobby.

                    I agree - if he included just the chess material, it would make a worthy Chess Webzine for the CFC - isn't that ironic?!

                    His analysis is outstanding and his insight is very sharp - I do laugh at some of the stuff he posts, but it is quite a contrast to the chess material!
                    ...Mike Pence: the Lord of the fly.

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                    • #25
                      Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                      So, where's the long-awaited exposé? Is this just a technique to draw traffic to his website?

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                      • #26
                        Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                        Still waiting.

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                        • #27
                          Re: IMPORTANT: Kevin Spraggett's blog and the revelation this week ...

                          Posted today, I think, on Spraggett's website:

                          THE RISE AND FALL OF CANADIAN CHESS

                          This article's publishing date has been put back to the end of the summer.

                          JC: I guess we'll just have to keep waiting. The trouble with performing the dance of the seven veils, is the audience gets bored if the veils don't come off pretty regularly.

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