My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

[Kevin Pacey]

Back around 8 May 2009 I posted the following on the CFC Discussion Board, besides the OCC message board and chesstalk:

"Since the CFC Ratings Auditor/Committee nor the CFC Governors/Executive seems to be in any hurry to do anything about the longstanding obvious deflation of CFC Active ratings, I will now be boycotting CFC Active events until a correction to the CFC's Active rating system is made. I do not wish to pay an Active rating fee in order to continue to receive a clearly deflated rating."

To date no indication has appeared to me that the CFC is about to correct the CFC Active rating system's deflation any time soon. It would be nice to know if at this year's CFC Annual Meeting any governors/executives are going to raise the matter of the CFC Active rating system being deflated - as Chris Mallon's post on the CFC Discussion board (8 May 2009) acknowledged:

"Actually, the Active ratings WERE supposed to be corrected at the same time [as the regular ratings], but an error in the script prevented this. This was pointed out to the Exec and the Ratings Auditor at the time but apparently ignored - despite the fact that we also provided a corrected script which would have fixed it.

I had totally forgotten about all of that."

I would add that the CFC's Rating Auditor has an especially shameful role in this typical piece of CFC neglect .

[Zeljko Kitich]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

Active ratings are usually out of whack in any case because people only play active games sporadically and there are maybe 2 opportunities to play active a year for example in our neighbourhood. The Hamilton club may run 2 nights of active and there is the Niagara active once per year. You can easily find players who haven't played active in years who still have an active rating & as a result usually significantly different than their regular rating. My point I think is its hard to have a meaningful active rating system under these conditions, really if the active rating was scrapped it would be no great loss, just as blitz or casual games are not rated. I'd be hard pressed to think of 2 players that I know that actually care much about their active rating.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

Here's part of a post I made on the CFC Discussion Board some time ago, which has points that may be of interest to you:

"A number of years ago Larry Bevand did a poll on chesstalk asking how many people cared about both their Active & regular CFC ratings, just their regular rating, or just their Active raing. There were at least some respondents who indicated by one answer or another that they cared about their CFC Active rating. My vaguest of memories tells me it was at least 33% of respondents, which flies in the face of what one Governor here in Ottawa recently told me. His off the cuff rejection of my concern about CFC Active rating deflation was that nobody other than myself cared about their CFC Active rating. Another Governor here whom I spoke with said nothing but gave some slight appearance of being sympathetic.

Also a number of years ago, I used to play in some of the Active events organized in Ottawa at Strategy Games, which were run by the CMA and ratings were based on CMA's Active rating system. The CMA Active rating system was even more prone to rapid deflation than the CFCs Active rating system at the time. However I didn't play long enough in such events while they were still being run to have a terrible CMA Active rating compared to my CFC one, and the CMA offered gift certificate prizes, which is more than the CFC Active events here offer to this day ($0 in prizes, no CFC gift certificates, but sometimes trophies as of this year depending who runs them)."

I would add that here in Ottawa the RA club ran 2 Active events last year on thursdays, while there were also 4 weekend Active events held. In any case, a rating boon/correction similar to the one made for regular CFC ratings would improve everyone's Active rating, no question. Throw in participation points as well.

If the CFC is going to offer Active ratings, it should do the job right and not offer an inferior (deflated) service for a fee that's so high relative to, say, CMA's. In fact aside from regular and Active ratings, the CFC doesn't offer much in the way of services these days, have you noticed .

[Zeljko Kitich]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

You have a lot of good points.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

Thanks.

At the risk of sending this thread too much off topic, your previous post reminds me of a much greater concern of mine for Canadian chess: membership levels and regular/Active tournaments being held have been down for years, at least outside of Eastern Ontario. I used to be a Governor, becoming one because I thought somehow I could help boost membership/tournament levels in the rest of Canada if only just the right policies came to be enacted :o.

Well that's partly true, but the CFC accomplishing it is another matter. The other half of the story is that local organizers, such as they are, have to get their act together. In Ottawa organizers have been careful to teach their successors the tricks of the trade, and so there has not been a shortage of organizers (or consequently members or tournaments).

Having left as a Governor, partly out of pique with the CFC's financial cataclysm that I saw coming on at the time, my only recourse now for motivating many organizers outside of our golden kingdom here in Eastern Ontario is to point out that all provinces' membership levels have declined since 2004, and use negative motivation: you guys should know who you are, and you suck!

2004-2009 CFC Membership stats:

http://www.chess.ca/MemStats.htm

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

With my previous post I tried to be as provocative as I can, and still nobody seems to give a damn...

I guess I need to present more of a target by suggesting solutions to help many organizers get out of the malaise they find themselves in.

First of all, don't just blame the CFC for being inept. It's a convenient excuse that the CFC has basically nothing to offer for it's perceived high membership fee now, other than its rating services. That may be why some old members were lost, but at least from now on a sales pitch could be that the price of CFC memberships, and playing in organized chess tournaments, is still very cheap compared to other activities.

In any case, until the CFC gets its act together, an organizer must work harder to recruit more players, such as by advertising events in more places (including chess message boards), and (as should have always been the case) by recruiting other organizers in his area. Those who do the job only half-heartedly should get out of the way. Otherwise people who might become organizers (and do a good job) might simply say to themselves that they don't appear to be needed. Besides that, players appreciate good organizers, but suffer from those who create the conditions for poorly attended tournaments and consequently low prize funds. Volunteers are taking on responsibility to do a good job, or they shouldn't volunteer. Praise is good, but don't expect immunity from criticism like some sort of a sacred cow. My sister-in-law praises me when I do what she likes, but is a total @#$%& when I don't. Such is life.

Raise entry fees as high as the local economy will take, and home in on the optimum fee. In Ottawa events the fee for typical weekend events was raised from $50 in a previous season to $90 for an event or two, and was judged to be too high. Now it's around $70 or $75 and attendence is good. That's with an amateur fee option (for those who don't know, it's a cheaper fee than normal, paid in exchange for waiving the right to win any prize money). While I'm at it, I'll return to the subject of Active chess. Offer cash prizes at such events too.

[Tony Boron]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

In Winnipeg, we hold several Active events per year and they tend to be our best attended events. Why ?

We don't require CFC membership-> we thus have more players participate-> we don't have to build in $ 3 per for rating, and we can get it done in 7 hours in one day.

I haven't heard anyone complain about Active ratings and non-rating of Active events here. We just want to play !

[Jason Lohner]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

Here in BC it is the same, there is far more active non-CFC events then there are CFC events. I would say that cost is the major factor.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

As I mentioned earlier, at least some people do care about their CFC Active ratings, or at least they are not very happy with them. It may depend how high one's regular CFC rating is. It's annoying for me that my CFC regular rating is at an all-time high, while my CFC Active rating is at an all time low, thanks to uncorrected deflation of CFC Active ratings. There is almost a 300 point difference in my case. I'm within distance of a weak IM level CFC regular rating, so it kind of ticks me off. Especially since I pay a $3 rating fee per Active event for the indignity. If there were cash prizes at CFC Active events in my area it would be easier to take.

It would be interesting to know whether non-CFC Active events in Winnipeg and/or B.C. offer cash prizes. In Ottawa I used to play at CMA (Strategy Games) Active events and gift certificate prizes were offered, as I mentioned in an earlier post. Entry fees (including CMA's rating fees) were relatively cheap compared to regular CFC events, but not CFC Active events, that were held in Ottawa at the same time. The difference, of course, is that a CFC membership is also required. I play in many regular CFC events in a typical year, so that is not a deterrent for me.

For those who think the CFC is still sinking (or don't care), there could be an opening for a new chess organization specializing in Active and/or speed chess, including extremely cheap memberships/ratings, if someone takes the time to set it up. I'm sort of surprised the CMA didn't pursue that, but Larry may have it in mind for down the road anyway.

[Jason Lohner]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

http://wcjc.blogspot.com/2009/05/may-active.html

http://www.chess.bc.ca/events.shtml

There are the entrance fees and prize money for various BC active non-cfc events.

[Lucas Davies]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

What? How much is the rating fee? Who even cares about active ratings?

[Jean Hébert]

Re : Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

For those who think the CFC is still sinking (or don't care), there could be an opening for a new chess organization specializing in Active and/or speed chess, including extremely cheap memberships/ratings, if someone takes the time to set it up.

Why would anyone invest time to promote an activity if it is aimed at people expecting "extremely cheap memberships/ratings" and thus condemned from the start to make no money and be hardly self-sustainable ? Or is it that people are willing to pay a reasonable entry fee for a quality active event but not for services with dubious value such as CFC membership and ratings?

[Jason Lohner]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

What? How much is the rating fee? Who even cares about active ratings?

The 'tournament membership' for a one day active CFC active event is $20 extra. If you look at the BC events they are $12 to enter... now add the CFC portion and it is no wonder that they are now all non-cfc events. From what I can see these events have their own rating system as well. Does anyone care about their active rating? obviously :) that's what this topic is about :)

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Re : Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

Why would anyone invest time to promote an activity if it is aimed at people expecting "extremely cheap memberships/ratings" and thus condemned from the start to make no money and be hardly self-sustainable ? Or is it that people are willing to pay a reasonable entry fee for a quality active event but not for services with dubious value such as CFC membership and ratings?

I did say that there "could" be an opening to promote such - not being a businessman, I tried to cover my assets :).

Seriously, if people are playing non-CFC Active chess in droves in B.C. and Winnipeg, but not CFC Active (or slow?) chess, that might indicate there is a big potential market for cheap Active (or speed?) events nationally, though some organization/individuals could confine themselves to serving one or more cities for the time being.

As you yourself have observed in the past, plenty of people do not have a whole weekend to spare to play in slow chess events, and so Active/speed events that take up far less time may have a larger market potential based on the reduced time consumption alone, never mind cheap Active entry fees compared to slow chess.

Yes, a high membership fee for an organization like the CFC reduces the potential market if people plan to play in only one or two events a year. Including Active ones, for those who have trouble sparing even half a weekend.

Why would anyone pay for even an extremely cheap membership and/or rating fee for an organization to organize Active/speed events? And how could such an organization be sustainable?

First of all, if the CFC didn't have so much overhead, it could drastically lower it's own membership and Active rating fees. It can't seem to put itself in a position to do so any time soon, so I suppose that eliminates it as the organization of choice for making Active chess a cheap proposition.

With that out of the way, a healthier organization like the CMA, for example, is able to provide ratings for something like a 25 cent fee, if memory serves. True, it remains to be seen whether enough people are willing to pay even that much if Active events held by others are requiring no rating fee, but I would guess that if non-CFC Active chess became as widespread as slow chess, many/most people would want there to be a non-CFC Active rating system, if only to make for more accurate pairings. Especially if cash prizes were to become large. People like Tom who want no rating systems at all could console themselves that the average class player has more of a chance upsetting a master in a fast time control game like Active or (particularly) speed, and so fewer average players may be deterred from continuing to play by obtaining poor Active/speed ratings.

Based on what I wrote earlier, Active/speed chess marketed correctly MIGHT have a much larger market potential than regular chess ever will. If so, that would make an organization that offered cheap membership and rating fees sustainable based on having a huge membership (remember Lawrence, I seem to recall, once pointed out that Argentina's chess federation had million(s) of members because it's membership fee was pennies). Incidently Active/speed chess is tailor-made for TV and fits right in with the internet, much better than slow chess.

Again, why would anyone join an Active/speed chess organization that charges even a cheap membership fee? Well, if a player wants an Active/speed rating, assuming there is a rating system offered, the player would have to be a member. However, the main reason could be that such an organization would recruit organizers who insisted that players in their Active/speed events be members of that organization. In return the organizers would try to do a better job than CFC organizers, or the handful(?) of others who are providing Active/speed events for cheap entry fees, with no sort of membership fee.

A lot of ifs and buts in all this, but sorry, it's the best argument I can think of at the moment.

[Lucas Davies]

Re: My Boycott of CFC Active events continues...

The 'tournament membership' for a one day active CFC active event is $20 extra. If you look at the BC events they are $12 to enter... now add the CFC portion and it is no wonder that they are now all non-cfc events. From what I can see these events have their own rating system as well. Does anyone care about their active rating? obviously :) that's what this topic is about :)

Does your normal CFC membership not allow you to play in active events? Never heard of anybody caring about their active rating at all. Find this to be quite bizarre.