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Dark Knight / Le Chevalier Noir
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---- Nous avons besoin d'un traduction français!
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The Hart House Chess Club is a University of Toronto Club that is entirely paid for by student funds and run by students, specifically elected student executives - these are the people that make the decisions for the HHCC. Alex, you have no authority here and I don't know why you are speaking for them because it is not your place or right. Anything you say on behalf of the club has no weight because it is a student club and you are not a student or an executive. This is honestly out of control and I will personally speak with the warden. This is a club that receives its money from students and has free space because once again, it is a University of Toronto club. It is not your personal chess club.
The Hart House Chess Club is a University of Toronto Club that is entirely paid for by student funds and run by students, specifically elected student executives - these are the people that make the decisions for the HHCC. Alex, you have no authority here and I don't know why you are speaking for them because it is not your place or right. Anything you say on behalf of the club has no weight because it is a student club and you are not a student or an executive. This is honestly out of control and I will personally speak with the warden. This is a club that receives its money from students and has free space because once again, it is a University of Toronto club. It is not your personal chess club.
Websites show Sanja is indeed the Secretary for the HHCC. Unfortunately, I have to question the professional nature of the decision to publically chastise Alex before any real decision is made from HHCC, assuming they will take up the matter. Pretty embarrassing stuff all around. Why would Sanja do this before a decision was made? I had a look at Sanja's website for HHCC at the following address:
U of T, like many universities, is subject to powerful leftist agendas and indoctrinations that distort reality. I caution people not to jump on board with someone who is so concerned to overturn the male dominance of chess. It's a bit ridiculous to create enmity in the fashion Sanja clearly speaks to in the link. I think this is the kind of anti-male agenda that we should not accept as the norm - anywhere. Woman can do whatever they want, just stop trying to belittle men in the process. Do not make a war where there is none. We absolutely appreciate and love the women who play chess, without patronizing them. There are several strong players I have had the opportunity to lose badly to along the path to reaching expert (Alina Svirdovitch (aged 10!) immediately comes to mind). More women in chess is a great thing - there is no imaginary war.
I have the utmost respect for Alex as a T.D., and for him as a centered and focused human being. We should not support attacks like this that are meant to belittle men, as opposed to promote women. Its complete garbage.
If Alex is stepping out of bounds, surely this internal matter could be settled first? The only reason to post now is to humiliate him. Not acceptable.
Sanja was the secretary of the club 4 years ago. Her term finished in 2014, and she has not been involved with the club since.
What I post on chesstalk on behalf of the Hart House Chess Club, is with the approval of the current executive. I am also a student and member of the chess club, and volunteer my time to help the club when I can.
Sanja was the secretary of the club 4 years ago. Her term finished in 2014, and she has not been involved with the club since.
What I post on chesstalk on behalf of the Hart House Chess Club, is with the approval of the current executive. I am also a student and member of the chess club, and volunteer my time to help the club when I can.
Alex Ferreira
So is this just a hacked account or someone having fun with you?
Websites show Sanja is indeed the Secretary for the HHCC. Unfortunately, I have to question the professional nature of the decision to publically chastise Alex before any real decision is made from HHCC, assuming they will take up the matter. Pretty embarrassing stuff all around. Why would Sanja do this before a decision was made? I had a look at Sanja's website for HHCC at the following address:
U of T, like many universities, is subject to powerful leftist agendas and indoctrinations that distort reality. I caution people not to jump on board with someone who is so concerned to overturn the male dominance of chess. It's a bit ridiculous to create enmity in the fashion Sanja clearly speaks to in the link. I think this is the kind of anti-male agenda that we should not accept as the norm - anywhere. Woman can do whatever they want, just stop trying to belittle men in the process. Do not make a war where there is none. We absolutely appreciate and love the women who play chess, without patronizing them. There are several strong players I have had the opportunity to lose badly to along the path to reaching expert (Alina Svirdovitch (aged 10!) immediately comes to mind). More women in chess is a great thing - there is no imaginary war.
I have the utmost respect for Alex as a T.D., and for him as a centered and focused human being. We should not support attacks like this that are meant to belittle men, as opposed to promote women. Its complete garbage.
If Alex is stepping out of bounds, surely this internal matter could be settled first? The only reason to post now is to humiliate him. Not acceptable.
Mavros
Maybe what's worse than someone having these views is that no one rises against them. I questioned why a non student and non executive feels that he can speak on behalf of a student run organization. That is all that I did. It was signed Alex Ferreira, The Hart House Chess Club and not Alex Ferreira on behalf of the executive of the Hart House Chess Club.
I was not simply the secretary of the HHCC who has not been involved in four years. I was the first female president in 118 years of the HHCC in 2013/14 and during that year the club had thirty (30) registered female members. During this year the club was more active than it had been in thirty years and included more women and minorities than at anytime in its entire history. I believe in women and equity in chess. This is dismissed as a leftist, anti male, man hating agenda and a warning that I would like to overturn the male dominance of chess.
Women have been silenced and pushed around throughout history. It is 2018. My heart broke when I read this message and breaks when I see little girls play in tournaments and what awaits them.
Maybe what's worse than someone having these views is that no one rises against them. I questioned why a non student and non executive feels that he can speak on behalf of a student run organization. That is all that I did. It was signed Alex Ferreira, The Hart House Chess Club and not Alex Ferreira on behalf of the executive of the Hart House Chess Club.
I was not simply the secretary of the HHCC who has not been involved in four years. I was the first female president in 118 years of the HHCC in 2013/14 and during that year the club had thirty (30) registered female members. During this year the club was more active than it had been in thirty years and included more women and minorities than at anytime in its entire history. I believe in women and equity in chess. This is dismissed as a leftist, anti male, man hating agenda and a warning that I would like to overturn the male dominance of chess.
Women have been silenced and pushed around throughout history. It is 2018. My heart broke when I read this message and breaks when I see little girls play in tournaments and what awaits them.
No one rose against Mavros's message.
See how quickly the target is shifted: Alex, to me, to all "people" who did not speak. This ridiculous victim mentality is completely false. We are all oppressors according to Sanja's message. The fact Sanja is not getting a flood of positive responses may have to do with several factors, one of which is the chess playing public is not dominated by people who do not think. Both men and women who play chess aim for critical thinking.
A great argument by Heather MacDonald against victimhood, as portrayed in American colleges (catching up to Canadian Leftists), can be found here:
If anyone wants, I can also send a link for the disaster that happened at Laurier when a young female student was badgered to the point of crying for questioning gender pronouns by three members of Laurier's board of bullshit. It's not about gender, race or religion. It's always about being leftist and playing the victim. Sanja has her micro-aggression and she will run with it: "it broke my heart".
Note that Sanja is also claiming Alex is not a student, and Alex already wrote saying he is. Alex also wrote saying he has the support of the executive. Sanja has not acknowledged Alex's statements, which are in conflict with her own. The reason I might choose to believe Alex could be because he is a man, and there is a huge man conspiracy, or it could be because I've met him? Toss a coin?
If you are a woman who plays chess, awesome. Who cares if you want to spread the victim mentality of the left that you have learned in your undergrad indoctrination?
Spare all the residents of chesstalk, men and women, this harmful agenda of playing the victim.
You and I are equal, let's play chess.
This kind of grandstanding is very effective in the world of Universities like U of T, but critical thinking isn't going to jump to your aide. Too bad Universities have abandoned critical thinking and now chase victimhood and micro-aggression lies as their primary goals.
It's really quite simple. If Mr. Ferreira is not authorized to speak on behalf of the club, the executive of the club should come on here and set the record straight. If Mrs. Vukosavljevic has concerns about Mr. Ferreira's behaviour, she should bring it to the attention of the club's executive and let them take whatever action they deem necessary.
Anyone's personal opinions on gender politics aren't relevant here, and the discussion should be taken elsewhere.
Also the slippery slop argument for not paying for advertising is pretty ridiculous. Either the service offered is good value for the club at the current price or it isn't. The decision should be made on that basis.
It's really quite simple. If Mr. Ferreira is not authorized to speak on behalf of the club, the executive of the club should come on here and set the record straight. If Mrs. Vukosavljevic has concerns about Mr. Ferreira's behaviour, she should bring it to the attention of the club's executive and let them take whatever action they deem necessary.
Anyone's personal opinions on gender politics aren't relevant here, and the discussion should be taken elsewhere.
Also the slippery slop argument for not paying for advertising is pretty ridiculous. Either the service offered is good value for the club at the current price or it isn't. The decision should be made on that basis.
It's really quite simple. If Mr. Ferreira is not authorized to speak on behalf of the club, the executive of the club should come on here and set the record straight. If Mrs. Vukosavljevic has concerns about Mr. Ferreira's behaviour, she should bring it to the attention of the club's executive and let them take whatever action they deem necessary.
Anyone's personal opinions on gender politics aren't relevant here, and the discussion should be taken elsewhere.
Also the slippery slop argument for not paying for advertising is pretty ridiculous. Either the service offered is good value for the club at the current price or it isn't. The decision should be made on that basis.
There you go, critical thinking from Patrick. Not copying in the slightest either opinion so far.
I disagree completely, and believe Patrick is trying to oversimplify the issues.
Sanja's claim there is so few women in chess is an attack stating that women have been somehow excluded from chess, as opposed to lacking interest. So she keeps reiterating HHCC's past with so few women. To brush it off or ignore it would be the biggest mistake you could make in response. Instead, it's important to see where a young mind is getting these ideas from. She is challenging us with what she has learned and what she believes.
I believe there is merit in defending someone who has been needlessly shamed or attacked. There was no reason to attack Alex in this fashion. It was meant to shame him, and also seems to be along the line of shaming men. Part of what makes this attack acceptable to some is that they agree women are victims. I disagree. Women are not victims, they are not weak as the victim mentality reinforces them to be.
Chesstalk is absolutely the place to address gender discrepancies in chess (if they are relevant). Unless a fee starts appearing for this?
If there really is a problem preventing women from participating in chess, it is good to address it here. However this to me is just undergrad grandstanding. She is clearly trying to make a mark for herself - perhaps even at U of T - by attacking with the idea women are victims. Her own perceived merit seems to lie more in pointing out the imaginary problems then actually getting women to play chess by example. Think of Yuanling Yuan's "Chess in the Library" and how strong a chessplayer she is. Yuanling has to be a real role model, and a very strong player at that.
Finally, Alex's argument is entirely legitimate as he may be anti-capitalist and trying to make a statement against the advertisement fee derivation. So simply saying yes or no to Larry's offer is less good than entering a discussion. Alex is never uncivil or even rude, I have found.
If there really is a problem with the fee, then a better discussion or ongoing discussion should be held, again chesstalk is the ideal place for this. As long as the discourse is civil.
The title of this thread is "Hart House & Chesstalk Advertising." Nothing about feminism or politics. If you want to discuss these issues, take it elsewhere, it shouldn't be in this thread.
You know what's really amusing? Watching none of the Hart House Chess Club's current executive drop by and clears this up.
:)
Somebody's gettin' played.
From my ongoing knowledge of Alex's involvement with HHCC for many, many years, I think the reality is that on the executive or not, and officer or not, the Executive rely on Alex' volunteer position, with their approval, as the "CT Contact".
But I do agree, it would be helpful to ending part of this debate, for one of them to appear and simply confirm this, and their confidence that Alex always presents an accurate view of HHCC Executive judgments to CT.
But I do agree, it would be helpful to ending part of this debate, for one of them to appear and simply confirm this, and their confidence that Alex always presents an accurate view of HHCC Executive judgments to CT.
If you look for current HH execs, you would see that none of them are active posters (even members) on chesstalks.
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