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Dark Knight / Le Chevalier Noir
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---- Nous avons besoin d'un traduction français!
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If I serve my guests dog food and yet they keep coming back for more, is it my fault or the guests? Perhaps my guests think that they deserve nothing better...
If you still like chess the way I think you do, how can you blame a chess player to play the game he loves, even in sub-optimal conditions ? Put the blame where it belongs. The women beaten up by his husband may have a degree of responsibility but the wife-beater is certainly the main problem.
And saying that players keep coming back is largely false. About 70% of the participants in this years Closed were below 25. It means that along the years many older masters (you and many more) have quit and have been replaced by youngsters that don't know better. Can't blame them, they play with limited, short term goals: ratings, norms, titles. But this goes to show that you don't change things by quitting. You are then simply forgotten.
In a year or two there will be another Closed. Players will still sign up. They will still pay an entry fee. The CFC will still let almost anyone in with a pulse. They will continue to run tournaments this way because players allow themselves to be treated this way.
I don't know you, but from your writings I have to think that either you haven't been around long or you just don't understand about chess at the top in Canada.
Understand? You are probably right. I realize that I forgot to build the list of advantages in doing tournaments that way. And this is the first step to understanding.
When this will be done, I will be able to teach next generation why we must proceed this way.
If you still like chess the way I think you do, how can you blame a chess player to play the game he loves, even in sub-optimal conditions ? Put the blame where it belongs. The women beaten up by his husband may have a degree of responsibility but the wife-beater is certainly the main problem.
And saying that players keep coming back is largely false. About 70% of the participants in this years Closed were below 25. It means that along the years many older masters (you and many more) have quit and have been replaced by youngsters that don't know better. Can't blame them, they play with limited, short term goals: ratings, norms, titles. But this goes to show that you don't change things by quitting. You are then simply forgotten.
I think of it more like a person parking their car in a rough neighbourhood with the stereo system in full view. They know they are going to get robbed but they do it anyway. Most of the players my age who played in tournaments have quit playing in the Closed. That is true. In fact, I was talking to a friend of mine and he pointed out that you were almost the only elite Canadian-born player from prior to 1975 who participated. The ones who are playing now haven't known any better. They were primed via the travesty that is the CYCC, so for them it is par for the course. I feel sorry for them, but que sera sera.
There is a world of chess beyond the Canadian borders. I am saving my money up so that I can retire in roughly 10 years (maybe sooner) and can give my chess the attention it deserves from me. But it won't happen much in Canada, and it certainly won't be in tournaments like the "Swiss-style, we let anyone in, and don't forget the entry fee" Canadian Closed. Sorry, but to play in events that are lousy and complain about them is not my style. I can't multi-task very well. ;-)
Next year you should talk to the guys in Calgary about their semi-closed international in May. Good conditions and a nice playing site. Very professional.
"Tom is a well known racist, and like most of them he won't admit it, possibly even to himself." - Ed Seedhouse, October 4, 2020.
I think of it more like a person parking their car in a rough neighbourhood with the stereo system in full view. They know they are going to get robbed but they do it anyway. Most of the players my age who played in tournaments have quit playing in the Closed. That is true. In fact, I was talking to a friend of mine and he pointed out that you were almost the only elite Canadian-born player from prior to 1975 who participated. The ones who are playing now haven't known any better. They were primed via the travesty that is the CYCC, so for them it is par for the course. I feel sorry for them, but que sera sera.
There is a world of chess beyond the Canadian borders. I am saving my money up so that I can retire in roughly 10 years (maybe sooner) and can give my chess the attention it deserves from me. But it won't happen much in Canada, and it certainly won't be in tournaments like the "Swiss-style, we let anyone in, and don't forget the entry fee" Canadian Closed. Sorry, but to play in events that are lousy and complain about them is not my style. I can't multi-task very well. ;-)
Next year you should talk to the guys in Calgary about their semi-closed international in May. Good conditions and a nice playing site. Very professional.
Why don't you simply say: Chess, love, children, even our lives are a complete waste of time and money.
Finally, thanks to Hal Bond for running the Closed, warts and all, when nobody else would.
Obviously many people in Ontario and elsewhere in Canada consider the Canadian Championship a burden, rather than a golden opportunity to promote the game. I thus propose that from now on for a period of ten years the FQE and Quebec organizers take on the task of holding this championship. It is not that we are so good, it is that we are not that bad.:)
I very well see Canadian Closed in Montréal, LaBaie, Montmagny, Sherbrooke and Trois-Rivières with the tremendous positive fallouts that are to follow if things are done properly. If really nobody in the rest of Canada sees the opportunity and wants to organize it properly, I personally vow to do what I can so that this opportunity takes permanent residence in Quebec. :)
Sorry, but to play in events that are lousy and complain about them is not my style. I can't multi-task very well. ;-)
Your position is completely reasonable. Your live according to your own rules which is fine but hopefully you also realise that you don't contribute to changes by not playing. Quite the opposite actually because most of the youngsters replacing you don't know better and can be satisfied with very little.
I think of it more like a person parking their car in a rough neighbourhood with the stereo system in full view. They know they are going to get robbed but they do it anyway. Most of the players my age who played in tournaments have quit playing in the Closed. That is true. In fact, I was talking to a friend of mine and he pointed out that you were almost the only elite Canadian-born player from prior to 1975 who participated. The ones who are playing now haven't known any better. They were primed via the travesty that is the CYCC, so for them it is par for the course. I feel sorry for them, but que sera sera.
There is a world of chess beyond the Canadian borders. I am saving my money up so that I can retire in roughly 10 years (maybe sooner) and can give my chess the attention it deserves from me. But it won't happen much in Canada, and it certainly won't be in tournaments like the "Swiss-style, we let anyone in, and don't forget the entry fee" Canadian Closed. Sorry, but to play in events that are lousy and complain about them is not my style. I can't multi-task very well. ;-)
Next year you should talk to the guys in Calgary about their semi-closed international in May. Good conditions and a nice playing site. Very professional.
Tom, I'm a little puzzled by your comments here. On many other threads, you've mentioned your belief that so many Americans and Canadians have bene living beyond their means, borrowing to obtain what they can't truly afford, etc, etc. And you freely predict that even tougher times are coming.
Yet here, you seem to be saying that chess, a mere board game, beautiful as it may be, somehow deserves a prominent place in which, as Jean Hebert points out, corporate sponsors are involved, paying entry fees for the elite and near-elite players. Doesn't this conflict with your other beliefs above?
Chess tournaments such as the Closed may have had, again as Jean points out, much better conditions in the past complete with corporate sponsorship. But you simply can't expect that any more, unless you know some rich benefactors willing to lose some money but keep chess tournaments looking spiffy. The North America economy is indeed headed for further strains, dark ominous clouds are gathering, and the storm is coming. Advertising dollars are getting fewer and further between. Jean laments this condition and points his finger at Hal Bond, and declares that he (Jean Hebert) will dedicate himself to righting this condition, in Quebec if need be. Well, in Quebec, perhaps chess can be given a prominent place by fiat of the government, thus making it a forced taxpayer-supported event. Jean's entry fee and many others will be paid, notwithstanding that some poor Quebec farmer will be helping to pay for it come tax time. To Jean, this is somehow proper.
You should all get real. You play a meaningless, albeit beautiful, game. If this game had appeal to the general public such that they were WILLING to come to the events and and pay hefty charges to observe the action, then fine. But the general public has no taste for chess, and never will. When consumers were spending freely with borrowed money, corporations could and did support chess for advertising exposure even if the exposure was to small numbers of people, mostly other chessplayers not in the tournament. That just can't go on any more. Or do you have some other opinion on this, which somehow goes hand in hand with your other expressed beliefs above?
P.S. a year or maybe two from now, depending on the patience of the Chinese, none of us will give a damn about the playing conditions at a bleeping chess tournament. Believe it or not.
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
>>> Since that english is not my mother's tongue, you do come up at times with words I hardly know like "asshole" and "anonomously". However this does not convince me that your questions are "pertinent", that you are entitled to answers from me or anybody else and that you actually care about those answers. <<<
It's not me who is entitled to these answers. When you criticize someone as you have criticized Hal, questions such as these need answered for everyone involved. If you had walked up to Hal and sucker punched him, you'd be before a judge and believe me, you'd have to answer his or her questions! Just who the eff do you think you are?
>>> My only task during that event, like all the other players, was to play chess as well as I could. <<<
What a cop-out. You claim to be so deeply disturbed about the conditons, yet you somehow manage to ignore it while there's prize money on the line. Face the fact: you are upset that you had to pay an entry fee. That is ALL you are upset about because you are an elitist bastard. The rest is a smokescreen to make it look like you care so deeply about chess in Canada. Bullcrap! You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all the people all of the time.
>>> According to Mr Bond...the sponsors he didn't approach failed to show up. <<<
Did Hal Bond himself say that he didn't approach any sponsors? I'd have to check this entire thread to find out, but if he didn't say that, he should sue you for defamation! Sorry if that's a word you don't know, but it basically means you made false claims to make his character look bad to others.
I don't give a rat's ass who you are in the chess world, Mr. Hebert, and I didn't know anything about you before this thread, but just based on what you've done here and your attitude, I'd have to say you are a disgusting representative of the chess community. Anyone who says otherwise is just hanging on to your coattails.
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
I did not get into discussions with Hal during the event about the shortcomings of his organizing duties for two good reasons.
Jean, when you are dealing with PEOPLE, and not with inanimate chess pieces, YOU HAVE TO CONSIDER FEELINGS. You probably during the event chatted with Hal as if you were best friends, or at least as if nothing about his organizing was on your mind. Then a week or two after the event, you come out and trash him. That's just not right and I'm sure Hal was surprised and probably even hurt. You say it's not personal, but you totally ignore Hal Bond the person.
This is part of what I mean when I say that too much chess brings out the worst in people. You treat everything, even people, as if they are wooden chess pieces. Wrong, wrong, wrong!
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
Tom, I'm a little puzzled by your comments here. On many other threads, you've mentioned your belief that so many Americans and Canadians have bene living beyond their means, borrowing to obtain what they can't truly afford, etc, etc. And you freely predict that even tougher times are coming.
Yet here, you seem to be saying that chess, a mere board game, beautiful as it may be, somehow deserves a prominent place in which, as Jean Hebert points out, corporate sponsors are involved, paying entry fees for the elite and near-elite players. Doesn't this conflict with your other beliefs above?
No, but that's my fault for not making my position clear. I don't think that government should sponsor chess. Nor should government build hockey rinks or soccer pitches. Let people who are interested in those things finance them. I don't really see how companies could consider sponsoring anything but children's chess to be a net plus.
To the Closed itself. When I speak of "lousy" events, I am not referring to sponsorship, nor am I thinking of things like whether signs are posted or whether it is convenient for spectators to watch. I don't give a flying #### whether spectators are watching or not - in fact, if I am paying an entry fee of $250 and the spectators are watching for free I would prefer that they go away or pony up some bucks, thanks.
I am not even talking about the prize fund. I realized long ago that there was almost no money and almost no interest in the Closed outside of the participants and a few diehard organizers. But at least in the 80s and early 90s you got a serious event. Everyone was strong. Everyone played everyone. The guy who won went through everyone and it was serious business. Thinking back to Windsor 1988 my first Closed, I finished 4th-5th out of the 16 player RR. Won I think $150. Chickenfeed. But the competition was fierce and every game was serious business. Now what do you have? Half the field are borderline masters - some not even that! - and that's with rating inflation. No Charbonneau, no Spraggett, no Zugic no Roussel, and the list goes on and on.
My suggestion: make the Closed a RR. If not 16 players, then at least 12. Have a few qualification tournaments for spots and give young players who are under-rated a chance to get in that way. Make it a serious event where qualifying is tough and an honour, not some rinkydink joke for people who have $250 burning a hole in their pocket.
"Tom is a well known racist, and like most of them he won't admit it, possibly even to himself." - Ed Seedhouse, October 4, 2020.
>>> Since that english is not my mother's tongue, you do come up at times with words I hardly know like "asshole" and "anonomously". However this does not convince me that your questions are "pertinent", that you are entitled to answers from me or anybody else and that you actually care about those answers. <<<
It's not me who is entitled to these answers. When you criticize someone as you have criticized Hal, questions such as these need answered for everyone involved. If you had walked up to Hal and sucker punched him, you'd be before a judge and believe me, you'd have to answer his or her questions! Just who the eff do you think you are?
>>> My only task during that event, like all the other players, was to play chess as well as I could. <<<
What a cop-out. You claim to be so deeply disturbed about the conditons, yet you somehow manage to ignore it while there's prize money on the line. Face the fact: you are upset that you had to pay an entry fee. That is ALL you are upset about because you are an elitist bastard. The rest is a smokescreen to make it look like you care so deeply about chess in Canada. Bullcrap! You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can't fool all the people all of the time.
>>> According to Mr Bond...the sponsors he didn't approach failed to show up. <<<
Did Hal Bond himself say that he didn't approach any sponsors? I'd have to check this entire thread to find out, but if he didn't say that, he should sue you for defamation! Sorry if that's a word you don't know, but it basically means you made false claims to make his character look bad to others.
I don't give a rat's ass who you are in the chess world, Mr. Hebert, and I didn't know anything about you before this thread, but just based on what you've done here and your attitude, I'd have to say you are a disgusting representative of the chess community. Anyone who says otherwise is just hanging on to your coattails.
We all went in Championships and we know how to judge an organizer. This one did a very bad job and the tournament was a shame. This is no defamation this is INFORMATION.
I have been in such a tournament with no signs, no advertissement, no nothing only chess set. 50% of the players did not show up and prefered to play in their club even if it was a Quebec Chess Youth Championship. There was no pictures and no report on the website so nobody in the community was informed. Take 15 kids in a Tim Horton and the Championship would have been more a success. This tournament did not help the next year participation and then the next year... there was no Championship at all for kids in long game in the whole province.
You need to have a long term vision. Jean Hébert is a reference in the Chess Community, a star and a model for my kids at home. I have been to some of his presentation and he is fantastic. He was not there to make friends, he was not there for money, he was there to communicate PASSION and he did to all the participants.
Please cool down, Jean want profesionnalism and quality, not elitism. He wants competition and competitors in front of him, not elitism. He promote every week chess among kids in Quebec and he was upset to see only old timers in the top Quebec Chess Championship in january and since then he motivated the whole community in Quebec to do even more for kids.
This is the Jean Hébert I know and I know him more than this thread. He is no "bastard" but for sure is "a star".
Carl
Last edited by Carl Bilodeau; Monday, 24th August, 2009, 10:04 AM.
First of all, FIDE has set minimum standards for zonal tournaments but has allowed (for political reasons not for the good of the game) one country zones such as Canada to bypass them.
...
Hi Jean! Do you (or anyone else reading this) have a link to the minimum standards for zonal tournaments? would someone mind posting them?
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