Canadian Open dates...

[Hugh Brodie]

I noticed that the Canadian Open starts and ends mid-week (July 15-22). This does cause a problem for those who work and must take full-week vacations - forcing them to take two weeks off rather than the expected one. I'm sure this is the first time this has been done. Better was the traditional Saturday-Saturday (or Sunday) with a maximum of one two-game day.

Entry fees of $175-$250? And that's before March 2. As a former Canadian Open regular, numbers like that eliminate me immediately. I know the cost of living is higher in Toronto than in Montreal - but the Quebec Open is less than $100 for the lower sections.

[Kerry Liles]

Here is a link to the tournament website: https://elevatemychess.com/co/

Wow, those entry fees are steep. And by the way, the venue is in Mississauga not Toronto - but that is nitpicking :) and still doesn't justify the fees in my view.
In another thread the fees were slammed for another Elevate My Chess event (that conflicts with a recently announced tournament in Guelph).

I can appreciate attempts to up the level of the game or tournaments - especially National level events,
but I wonder if these high fees will simply mean the event is a failure and another organizer bites the dust?

I cannot justify the time commitment and the fees are just an additional weight on the NO side of the balance.

edit: seems 52 registered already, so perhaps enough people are ok with time and fees??

[Hugh Brodie]

edit: seems 52 registered already, so perhaps enough people are ok with time and fees??

Free entry for the 10 GM's and IM's (and the CFC prez?). It looks like a lot of the other players are CYCC players that are sticking around.

[Roger Patterson]

I noticed that the Canadian Open starts and ends mid-week (July 15-22). This does cause a problem for those who work and must take full-week vacations - forcing them to take two weeks off rather than the expected one. I'm sure this is the first time this has been done. Better was the traditional Saturday-Saturday (or Sunday) with a maximum of one two-game day.

Entry fees of $175-$250? And that's before March 2. As a former Canadian Open regular, numbers like that eliminate me immediately. I know the cost of living is higher in Toronto than in Montreal - but the Quebec Open is less than $100 for the lower sections.

A little late to be carping about the tournament details. It is what it is.

Having organized a Canadian Open and knowing what peoples expectations are generally, the entry fees strike me as completely normal. The basic problem is that you don't agree with what people's expectations are for the Canadian Open so don't like paying for fulfilling those expectations. In any case, the entry fee per hour of play is a very reasonable entertainment price.

[Ian Findlay]

A little late to be carping about the tournament details. It is what it is.

Having organized a Canadian Open and knowing what peoples expectations are generally, the entry fees strike me as completely normal. The basic problem is that you don't agree with what people's expectations are for the Canadian Open so don't like paying for fulfilling those expectations. In any case, the entry fee per hour of play is a very reasonable entertainment price.

Well said Roger. Being retired, I can appreciate how the entry fee seems high, but to play in the World Open, $308 by 4/13, $318 by 5/13, $328 by 6/27, $350 until 2 hours before round 1 all in US dollars. Thanks for the heads up on the Quebec Open, which is a distant memory for me, but a great tournament. Sounds like a bargain. For the Banff Open, I do use price discrimination by giving discounts to juniors, seniors, woman, 1st time CFC players, woman players, FM's.

[John Brown]

I agree with Hugh. Why change up a National event by changing the format and causing a reduction of local players because they cannot work and play. The Entry fees are a cash grab. The organizers have already made their money off the junior tournament so why gouge the National event..
I live in Brampton so I do not have to stay in a hotel or motel but the times of Rounds would even make me to lose work or have to takes byes.

I think because this is the Canadian Open the Rounds etc should be formatted that you cannot change that. Organizers have to fit into a mould and get sites based on that mould. If they cannot do that THEN DON'T BID>
Saskatoon was in my opinion a flop because of their Round schedules. I know 6 players including myself who would have either had to take byes !/2 + 0 pts .Or ask for have non paid holidays.
Let's Make the Canadian Open Uniformed. The past Cdn opens were successes with a tired an true scheduling. The old saying what ain't broke don't try to fix or tinker otherwise you lose big time.
This Cdn Open is a cash grab for organizers and I hope they don't lose their shirts because of it. But they won't see me entering this Canadian Open.

[Hugh Brodie]

My comments on Ian's and John's comments: Can you name anyone who went to the World Open who wasn't going there for the prize money? You're not going to pay $300+ and say you're playing for the sheer enjoyment of it? I've played in the Canadian Open for the enjoyment of playing; of seeing a new city (for me); and seeing people I haven't seen for a long time. Thus - I'm not going to pay a lot of money for an event in which I don't expect to win anything.

I agree with John - there should be a fixed schedule - starting and ending on weekends, so that travelling is made easier.

Back in the "prime years" of the Open, you could expect it to be held on a university campus (e.g. Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg), with reasonably-priced nearby accommodation and food. I would spend my free time exploring the "host" city. Unfortunately - this year's Mississauga site is not within walking distance of the suggested hotels, and any points of interest for a visitor without a car are a long way off. The ideal Open was that of 1977 in Fredericton NB (Fred McKim?). Cheap accommodation on campus, also meals, and the site a short walk away. A few simuls, a blitz tournament, and a closing "banquet". And a beautiful city to walk around.

A major cost for organizers is foreign GM's. Let's forget about the foreigners and pay some Canadian GM's to show up; Alternatively - don't pay anyone. Let everyone pay an entry fee - if the GM's don't show, it's more money for the rest of us.

[Roger Patterson]

Can you name anyone who went to the World Open who wasn't going there for the prize money?

.

Yeah, me. Plus also everybody I've ever travelled with to the world open (although it's been a few years).

I agree with John - there should be a fixed schedule - starting and ending on weekends, so that travelling is made easier.
.

Well, it's easier for working people playing in the one event. For those going to multiple tournaments, starting in the middle of the week is probably ideal. That way you don't have to kill 5 days (mon-friday) between two consecutive events.

There are a lot of moving parts in setting the dates:
- availability of the venue space. Perhaps this was what they could get.
- for some venues, summer Saturdays are expensive. A venue may not wish to give you two consecutive Saturdays when they can sell that space for a big wedding that is catered. With this schedule, the organizers are only needing one Saturday. And seeing as you seem to be price sensitive, maybe you would appreciate that.
- coordination with other large events. As I mentioned above, a mid week start and end probably makes that easier

As for the idea that the CFC enforce a particular schedule, I guess that means in your and John's view, the perfect schedule has been found and that nobody should ever dare to experiment and try anything new. I can't say that I agree with the idea that new things can't be tried.

A major cost for organizers is foreign GM's. Let's forget about the foreigners and pay some Canadian GM's to show up; Alternatively - don't pay anyone. Let everyone pay an entry fee - if the GM's don't show, it's more money for the rest of us.

and a major reason for some players to go (if not you), is the presence of foreign GMs.

[Fred McKim]

The ideal Open was that of 1977 in Fredericton NB (Fred McKim?). Cheap accommodation on campus, also meals, and the site a short walk away. A few simuls, a blitz tournament, and a closing "banquet". And a beautiful city to walk around.

Thanks for the plug Hugh, but Waldemar Friesen pretty well single handedly managed all aspects of that fantastic event, that featured Abe Yanofsky, Kevin Spraggett and Yasser Seirawan. Professionally directed by Larry Bevand, prior to CMA "fame".

For Sackville in 2001, we thought a good plan was to get 3 GM's that were well known and who would appeal to the general population, and we got Christiansen, Miles, and Spraggett (who eventually withdrew before the start of the event). We drew 169 players to a small University town of about 6,000, having no CFC members to draw players from.

[Bob Armstrong]

As to the terms of the 2020 Canadian Open - Organizers for weekend (and longer) tournaments are important - and it is nice to see more taking the private enterprise plunge in the GTA....without them, we plebs would just be sitting home drinking beer and getting drunk because there were no tournaments in which to play.

So I tend to favour supporting local organizers, despite perhaps wishing some of the tournament terms were different. I often play in the Quebec Open (Family there) as my longer summer tournament now (Though in the past I flew across the country to play in the Canadian Opens). But because the tournament in in Mississauga (Which I think is considered in the GTA), I am choosing to play in the CO (Not the COQ, in which I could well have played had I chosen it). I have already registered and paid. I hope my early entry may encourage some of my chess friends to also consider the tournament.

What I do like to see though, despite trusting that often organizers make a below minimum hourly wage for their organizing efforts, is a full financial statement of expenses, prizes and profit.

This transparency encourages local support of organizers.....chess players can see if the profit % is reasonable, and thus entry fees were reasonable for this specific tournament.

I know the rabid capitalists in the chess community say no private company has to do this publicly.......I can only point to comments in this thread that imply that the poster believes this organizer is ripping off the chess community in this particular tournament - maybe nothing would satisfy them.....but I think organizer transparency would generate less criticism, and more local support.

Bob A

[Aris Marghetis]

Thanks for the plug Hugh, but Waldemar Friesen pretty well single handedly managed all aspects of that fantastic event, that featured Abe Yanofsky, Kevin Spraggett and Yasser Seirawan. Professionally directed by Larry Bevand, prior to CMA "fame".

For Sackville in 2001, we thought a good plan was to get 3 GM's that were well known and who would appeal to the general population, and we got Christiansen, Miles, and Spraggett (who eventually withdrew before the start of the event). We drew 169 players to a small University town of about 6,000, having no CFC members to draw players from.

You are too humble Fred, MANY people recall the Sackville CO very fondly, I just loved it, thanks!!

[Hugh Brodie]

What I do like to see though, despite trusting that often organizers make a below minimum hourly wage for their organizing efforts, is a full financial statement of expenses, prizes and profit.

This transparency encourages local support of organizers.....chess players can see if the profit % is reasonable, and thus entry fees were reasonable for this specific tournament.

Bob A

Agreed. I remember when Doug Burgess and Terry Fleming always had a financial report on the wall before the last round of their Ottawa RA tournaments.

Yes, Aris. Sackville was another Open I remember well - but Sackville was a little too small for me (as was Edmunston NB a few years earlier). There was no way I was going to Kapuskasing. :-)

[Tom O'Donnell]

Thanks for the plug Hugh, but Waldemar Friesen pretty well single handedly managed all aspects of that fantastic event, that featured Abe Yanofsky, Kevin Spraggett and Yasser Seirawan. Professionally directed by Larry Bevand, prior to CMA "fame".

For Sackville in 2001, we thought a good plan was to get 3 GM's that were well known and who would appeal to the general population, and we got Christiansen, Miles, and Spraggett (who eventually withdrew before the start of the event). We drew 169 players to a small University town of about 6,000, having no CFC members to draw players from.

Sackville was really nice. Probably my second favourite Canadian Open after Vancouver 1982.

[Serge Archambault]

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[John Brown]

Hugh is 100% correct. This is the Canadian Open not the World Open. We don't need to pay appearance fees
for Foreign players. If they want to play then come and play.
With all due respect to Roger. I do not think that elevate your chess is in this tournament to cut costs to give more prizes , they are out to make money. They really don't care about what is best for players they are looking what is best for them.
Changing the format of the Canadian open to save money is a real lame excuse. If they are trying to save money by changing a format then entry fees should be reasonable not excessive.