how to handle players who forfeit

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  • how to handle players who forfeit

    Hi there, I have almost completed (for the RA Winter Open) the wall charts and prize distributions, but I have been distracted by a couple of emails tonight, questioning my handling of players who forfeit. To hopefully reduce any problems, here is how I see it.

    I would be interested in any contradictory feedback, especially from any IAs, or other experienced TDs. In addition, As you read the following, please rest assured that my priority is, as usual, to support the regular player who never causes me extra effort! ;)

    First, please note this excerpt from Section 6 (Pairing Rules) of the CFC Handbook :
    616. ... Any game defaulted because of a player's failure to appear ... is scored as one point for the winner and zero for the loser, and the defaulting player is not paired for the succeeding rounds without an excuse acceptable to the director.

    In my humble opinion, this also makes common sense. Why would the TD re-pair a player who just forfeited? I feel that the forfeiting player is the single person who bears the responsibility to make things right before they are welcomed back into the tournament.

    In addition, it seems inappropriate to me for a forfeiting player to ask for a refund. Note that every paired player costs the same amount of rating fees, regardless of how many games they actually play. I must admit that I cannot bring myself to charge players who honour their pairings, more than players who just do not show up without prior notice! :(

    If anyone disagrees with any of my approaches described above, I really would like to know. The purpose of this post is just to ensure that the vast majority of players agree with me, and that the couple of emails I received tonight represent exceptions, right?!

    If you would rather comment privately, please send to arismarghetis at rogers dot com

  • #2
    Re: how to handle players who forfeit

    I agree a hundred percent with this approach.

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    • #3
      Re: how to handle players who forfeit

      Ditto.

      Esp. "the forfeiting player is the single person who bears the responsibility to make things right before they are welcomed back into the tournament."

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: how to handle players who forfeit

        I agree completely. As it happens, I was one of the forfeits Friday evening. As a result of an accident, I was unable to play and while I emailed Aris 1 1/2 hours before the event he understandably did not open it until too late. Pity, but thems the breaks. My opponent tells me he offered to score it as a 1/2 point bye for both players but Aris, again quite reasonably, declined and awarded me a big fat zero.
        All quite appropriate in my view.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: how to handle players who forfeit

          Originally posted by Aris Marghetis View Post
          If anyone disagrees with any of my approaches described above, I really would like to know. The purpose of this post is just to ensure that the vast majority of players agree with me, and that the couple of emails I received tonight represent exceptions, right?!
          Though I think there is nothing wrong with your approach, in considering the situation while trying to sleep, I suggest the following alternative:

          - The player loses $RF + $OC + 1/R * $EF

          e.g. if the $RF/Rating Fee is $3 per player
          the $OC/Overhead Costs (room rental fee, TD fee, etc.) is $10 per player the $EF/entry fee is $60 for a (R) five-round event, the player loses:

          $3 + $10 + $12 (1/5 * $60) = $25, so gets back $35.

          The TD organizer keeps $13, while the player who received the forfeit win gets $12 (or 1/5th of the other player's EF). After all, the player who won was presumably paying to actually play a chess game and they didn't get what they paid for. I know you really work hard to make sure everyone gets a competitive game every round, using floater players for example, but some things are just out of your control...

          It does make more work for you in keeping track of these weird totals.

          BTW, even without the natural lighting, I still preferred the room we used for this event over the one upstairs.

          Edit: Just to clarify, the above refers to people who forfeit and don't come back. For instances like the one Gordon refers to above, then simply take 1/5 of the forfeiter's EF and give it to his opponent.
          Last edited by Tom O'Donnell; Monday, 25th January, 2010, 10:43 AM.
          "Knowledge illuminates visible possibilities" - http://wisdomofchopra.com/

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          • #6
            Re: how to handle players who forfeit

            You still have the question of rated/unrated forfeits. In cases such as Gordon's, it would be an unrated forfeit. Forfeit-yes - but it should not be rated - he had a reasonable excuse. But can the TD determine if all other forfeited games should be rated (e.g. "My alarm didn't go off" - and other such excuses)?

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            • #7
              Re: how to handle players who forfeit

              All these strange numbers could very well be transposed in numbers of whips.

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              • #8
                Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                Originally posted by Gordon Ritchie View Post
                I agree completely. As it happens, I was one of the forfeits Friday evening. As a result of an accident, I was unable to play and while I emailed Aris 1 1/2 hours before the event he understandably did not open it until too late. Pity, but thems the breaks. My opponent tells me he offered to score it as a 1/2 point bye for both players but Aris, again quite reasonably, declined and awarded me a big fat zero.
                All quite appropriate in my view.
                Gordon, and anyone else reading, please rest assured that Gordon was NOT in any way a problem player this weekend. He had an accident, and couldn't get a hold of me, and he was very appropriate about it afterwards, towards both his opponent and to myself. I would say that there was no better way that Gordon could reasonably have handled it.

                However, there were 2 other players who either asked for money back, never really apologized, and are questioning how I managed their forfeit situations. Aside from a fantastic chess weekend, those 2 forfeit situations bugged me, NOT Gordon's. In the end, and Tom mentioned it because he knows what makes me tick, it bothered me most that I was not advised so that I could adapt, and had to leave 2 players (1 each over different rounds) sitting there without getting a game that they came ready to play!

                Tom, thanks for your idea, but to be honest, I don't want to add more work for myself! Actually, thanks to everyone for your feedback, which seems largely to corroborate my approaches. Maybe just making this discussion more public will sensitize players who might need to miss a game, to go that extra step to at least give the TD the chance to change the pairings to exclude him. My floater this weekend didn't have a car, putting him about an hour away, but in all of the forfeit situations this weekend, the forfeiting player had known more than an hour beforehand that they would not be making it ...

                I'm working on the RA Spring Open flyer right now, and will have it posted later today.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                  Originally posted by Aris Marghetis View Post
                  ...
                  While I agree with Aris's approach in general ... did these forfeits take place in the first round? If so, that at least gives us something to talk about!

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                  • #10
                    Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                    Hi Jonathan, I'm OK letting it go now, especially because I would prefer that readers do not deduce who the forfeiting players were. Gordon was in the first round, but like I explained in a previous post, his handling of it was very gentlemanly. Maybe one way I could bullet-proof my events would be to try and get floater players who would come onsite for every round, even if it looked like they would not get a game, and stay until all players arrive. Even with free entry, that's gonna be tough, but I'm brainstorming! ;)

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                    • #11
                      Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                      Originally posted by Aris Marghetis View Post
                      Hi Jonathan, I'm OK letting it go now, especially because I would prefer that readers do not deduce who the forfeiting players were. Gordon was in the first round, but like I explained in a previous post, his handling of it was very gentlemanly. Maybe one way I could bullet-proof my events would be to try and get floater players who would come onsite for every round, even if it looked like they would not get a game, and stay until all players arrive. Even with free entry, that's gonna be tough, but I'm brainstorming! ;)

                      Did any of the three indicate to you they would like to play in the following round?

                      My experience with chess players, and I've directed hundreds at a time from all over the world by mail and some over the board, is they don't take kindly to an approach which reminds one of a heavy handed proctologist.

                      Do you figure you lost any participants permanently?
                      Gary Ruben
                      CC - IA and SIM

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                        Originally posted by Gary Ruben View Post
                        Did any of the three indicate to you they would like to play in the following round?

                        My experience with chess players, and I've directed hundreds at a time from all over the world by mail and some over the board, is they don't take kindly to an approach which reminds one of a heavy handed proctologist.

                        Do you figure you lost any participants permanently?
                        Hi Gary, I agree about not being heavy-handed (nor a proctologist, LOL), and I sure hope that is not the impression that I am giving here. My priority in such situations is taking care of the poor guy (who might have spent a lot of time and money travelling in) who is stuck waiting for his forfeiting opponent, to play a decent/replacement game.

                        As for your questions, if a forfeiting player asks to be paired for the next round, then I do, which I believe is the correct approach. One player from the weekend felt that I should have paired him again without notification, risking another forfeit (but not a third time!). I disagree, as that is contrary to the letter and spirit (IMHO) of how to run an event, as again, I feel my priority should be the players who do appear on time, etc.

                        Therefore, I might lose that player, but at the same time, I have protected at least one of my regular players, so my conscience is happy with that. Wouldn't you do the same, i.e. uphold the handbook quidelines regarding forfeits rather than risk 2 forfeits in a row?

                        There was also a player who forfeited and wanted his money back, but I had already announced the prize fund, and quite simply could not afford to personally cover his registration, rating fees, etc. I understand that things can come up, so if someone can no longer make the event, I gladly offer the option of deferring their registration to a future event, but all I ask is that they advise me before the event starts. It doesn't seem right to ask for a refund only after you've forfeited, or am I missing something?

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                        • #13
                          Re: how to handle players who forfeit

                          Since you are pairing those who ask to be paired in the following round, I have to agree with you. No reason people who show up should have to wait out a forfeit from a player who did it in the previous round.

                          Sometimes when I was pairing a large correspondence event I would get lucky. There would be enough problem players to pair them together in one section. I used to privately call them "survivor" sections. :) With the big events, they were usually qualifiers for another round or higher event and only one or two players would advance from each section.
                          Gary Ruben
                          CC - IA and SIM

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