Occupy Wall Street protest

[Bob Gillanders]

Have you heard about the protest?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSn-I...eature=related

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

Have you heard about the protest?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSn-I...eature=related

I have just been hearing about this the past few days. Just today I saw footage showing what looked like a parking lot on Wall St. or nearby (for some reason it had lots of small trees in it) that looked like a county or state fair.

Of course, one might expect that many of the campers there might be playing chess during the day... God help any of them that might be playing Monopoly! :D

I've been wondering where all the anger is with the vast majority of Americans that have been suffering the death of a thousand cuts in the past few years. I have an ominous feeling that these growing events (around the country now, not just on Wall St.) have the potential to become outlets for what must be some very pent-up anger.

What I've always believed is that it doesn't take elections to change behavior or trends. [Elections can help, for sure: the Republican party is now investing heavily in unseating Obama and holding or increasing their majority in Congress, but a failure to do that in 2012 would really knock them off their feet.]

But in addition to elections, there is a much greater power in what people do with their money. One obvious thought in that respect is a tax revolt, but that's not what I'm getting at. I'm referring more to the everyday, almost trivial ways, and the larger less trivial ways, in which people spend and allocate their money en masse.

Here's a specific example: in 2008 / 2009 when the subprime mortgage crisis hit and banks were under pressure and the stock market was plunging, I saw the very first case of my idea in action: Americans in unbelievable numbers stopped buying cars and trucks. Not just for a week or a month, but for many months in succession. It wasn't an organized movement, it was just unorganized herd behavior as people en masse feared for their economic future.

The result was that after less than a full year of this behavior, the government had to step in and bail out GM and Chrysler. Failure to do so would have shut down such a huge segment of the auto industry that the crisis would have become a Depression with unforseeable consequences. Even a Republican government would have taken this step, although they would never admit to it.

What I believe is that people that are against such things as the domination of Wall Street or of big corporations or of banks can change the landscape by organizing en masse and changing their money habits. In the case of Wall Street, this would be a tough nut to crack because Wall Street profits on trading, which is an activity primarily supported by wealthy conservatives. But many, if not most, wage-slave Americans have not insubstantial amounts of their savings locked up in mutual funds. A mass redemption into cash of such funds by all the working class in organization could cause an impact. It would cost them money in terms of tax penalties and lost investment income, and it is precisely this that acts as a buffer against such an organized activity.

Not only that, but if such a mass redemption into cash took place, then that cash is going into bank deposits and now you're enslaving yourselves to the banking industry -- jumping from the frying pan into the fire. Perhaps then the cash redemptions need to be moved into physical assets, such as gold, platinum, silver.

But history has proven that even this, if it were to occur, isn't a way to guarantee a change in the landscape. I don't know when it occurred, but there was a time in the past when the American govt decreed that private holdings of gold were illegal, and confiscated all such holdings.

So you see, there is no "peaceful" way to change something that is ingrained into human civilizations all throughout history: control of the masses by the very wealthy. It is pervasive and it is everywhere. It doesn't matter if you have in control Republicans or Democrats, Conservatives or Liberals or NDP or Green Party, socialism or capitalism or any other -ism: if you find a way to disrupt that control by legal means.... good luck to you, those means will be made illegal in a hurry and your "rights" will be revoked.

My idea (which I don't claim original ownership to) is a dangerous one. I dont recommend it to anyone because it just might work... for a little while. What comes after that little while is where the danger lies.

I guess my -ism is fatalism. There is just nothing short of a truly supernatural event or the total collapse of everything we've built up that is going to break the consistent behavior and characteristic of all human civilizations throughout human history.

Bob I hope you're not losing any sleep over all this. Sorry if by posting this I've become "Debbie Downer". Fatalism is just my -ism, it needn't be yours. Optimism is good for the soul! Egalitarianism is worth saving for!

Oh wow..... that last line..... I can't believe I came up with that!

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

Have you heard about the protest?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSn-I...eature=related

If you get all your news from the mainstream media then you deserve what you (don't) get.

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

If you get all your news from the mainstream media then you deserve what you (don't) get.

Agreed, the mainstream media is pathetic. They chase after sensational stories and celebrity garbage and ignore the important events. Shame on them.

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

I guess my -ism is fatalism. There is just nothing short of a truly supernatural event or the total collapse of everything we've built up that is going to break the consistent behavior and characteristic of all human civilizations throughout human history.

Bob I hope you're not losing any sleep over all this. Sorry if by posting this I've become "Debbie Downer". Fatalism is just my -ism, it needn't be yours. Optimism is good for the soul! Egalitarianism is worth saving for!

Oh wow..... that last line..... I can't believe I came up with that!

Well, I was sleeping okay until I read your post! LOL
Thankfully I am not quite as fatalistic as you. Things can be done to improve the situation, like putting a few bankers in jail. The financial meltdown is such an outrageous example of systemic fraud and corruption throughout the banking and government institutions in the USA that it is good to see that the protests have finally begun.

Establishing effective financial regulation and limiting the political influence of wall street money is essential. It can and needs to be done if democracy in the USA (what little they have left) is to be saved.

I am grateful to live in Canada. :D

[Jonathan Berry]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

I am grateful to live in Canada. :D

Mr. Harper is bullish on turning it into something more like our southern cousins. Take, for example, the omnibus crime legislation.

On another facet, if you put occupy wall street into the search engine at the Globe and Mail, you get two relevant hits. One is a video and the other a photo collection. Words, it seems, fail.

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

... I am grateful to live in Canada. :D

Don't worry. After the Canadian housing bubble pops, things are going to look a lot different. ;-)

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

Don't worry. After the Canadian housing bubble pops, things are going to look a lot different. ;-)

How about putting an approximate date on that?

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

I cannot predict the madness of crowds.

Check out the graph:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repor...rticle2183671/

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

I cannot predict the madness of crowds.

Check out the graph:

If they are right they say:

"Nothing says prices need equalize, but a gap of more than 2:1 is not sustainable. Three ways it can narrow: a) the C$ falls, b) U.S. prices recover, or c) Canadian prices drop. Or, some of the above, or all of the above."

The graph uses U.S. Median home prices and Canadian Average home prices. It's really apples and oranges. Also, would you explain to me what difference the Canadian home prices on the graph being seasonally adjusted and raw median U.S. home prices has on the figures?

I don't understand the mathematics on all this BUT I do know the difference between an average price and a median price.

Also, the C$ has dropped from around 1.08 and the U.S. prices are starting to recover in at least some areas of the U.S.

The current low interest rates should help keep our housing market stable, in my view.

[Christopher Mallon]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

Perhaps then the cash redemptions need to be moved into physical assets, such as gold, platinum, silver.

But history has proven that even this, if it were to occur, isn't a way to guarantee a change in the landscape. I don't know when it occurred, but there was a time in the past when the American govt decreed that private holdings of gold were illegal, and confiscated all such holdings.

If you are interested, it was in the very early 70s, after Nixon took the USA off the Gold standard. Gold was worth about $30 or $35 an ounce before that, but once only banks could own gold, it shot up to something like $80 an ounce in months.

Conspiracy of the Rich - interesting book to read!

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

The protest is now getting some mainstream media attention. Too big now to ignore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_Wall_Street

The Lang and O'Leary report interviewed one of the protesters yesterday. The host Kevin O'Leary tried to ridicule the guest with insults and painting him as a left wing nutbar. The protestor gave an excellent coherent answer and made O'Leary look stupid. If I can find the clip, I will post it.

[Kerry Liles]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

The protest is now getting some mainstream media attention. Too big now to ignore.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupy_Wall_Street

The Lang and O'Leary report interviewed one of the protesters yesterday. The host Kevin O'Leary tried to ridicule the guest with insults and painting him as a left wing nutbar. The protestor gave an excellent coherent answer and made O'Leary look stupid. If I can find the clip, I will post it.

I don't think it is hard to make O'Leary look stupid (he isn't, but it is easy to bait him). Amand Lang on the other hand is brilliant and elegant ...

[Ken Craft]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

O'Leary doesn't need any help looking stupid.

[Brad Thomson]

Re: Occupy Wall Street protest

Insofar as the list of demands from these "demonstrators" contains precisely what the globalists are trying to implement, it is safe to assume that these "occupations" are being staged.