Mississauga Chess Club is #1

[Bob Armstrong]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

Bob G:

I have alerted the SCC executive to this thread, since no one from the executive has yet responded to it.

Bob A

[Erik Malmsten]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

Now here's a golden opportunity to promote chess in a big way. Suppose that we get an agreement from the two clubs to stage a bragging rights match in the courtyard of Toronto City Hall - about half way between the Scarborough Chess Club and the Mississauga Chess Club - to be played on 100 boards. Score cards (showing 1 - 0, 0 -1, or 1/2 - 1/2) to be displayed on the individual tables as well as an over-all scoreboard showing

Scarborough CC xx
Mississauga CC xx

Next to the scoreboard, a representative of each club to hand out promotional material on their club. Not only would the two clubs benefit from the publicity but chess in general may attract the eyes of potential sponsors. Of course 100 chess games in a row would attract TV coverage.

This reminds me of the historic East vs West matches, i.e. east or west of Yonge St. When the City had an annual Yonge St festival I was going to approach them about putting out tables inviting westenders to sit on one side, eastenders on the other, but the city discontinued that festival because of costs. I guess we could have tried it on one of the days of the recent Canadian Opens at the foot of Yonge St. Today could have a Toronto 416 (or Postal code M) versus 905 suburbs.

Some of the historic matches:

1947, May 19 at YWCA WEST 26-16 East

1946 EAST 41.5 - 28.5 West

1931, Jan 30 TCC EAST 12-10 West

1926, Jan 1 YMCA EAST 58-50 West (individuals played multiple games)

1925, Nov WEST 8.5-7.5 East

1924, Oct 4 YMCA EAST 8.5-4.5 West
1924, Jan 1 YMCA Open House, WEST 14-8 East (Board 1 Fox 1-0 Morrison) West had Judean CC, East had Beaches CC

1922, Mar 24 East 5.5-5.5 West (West had 2 ladies playing)
1922, Jan 1 at YMCA EAST 9.5-2.5 West

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

This is all we need to know from the MCC - you say you can't likely get a 100 players out - end of story.
On the other hand what you say is a 'reality check' for you is not necessarily
reality for others - that is why I asked what your official position is with the MCC. You did not answer.
Now if the MCC had over a hundred avid chess players, I can see the 100 number could be met. But if as you say 100 for a road trip is next to impossible that ends the project. Is it that the MCC is only part chess club but mostly a day care with a chess motif? Then I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for a chess day trip.
So good luck with any interclub match you may organize.

For whatever reason, you seem to need an answer as to my official position at the MCC. You could have looked it up on our website, but nevertheless, I am the Club Treasurer. As for our Junior Program, it is a team effort. Paul, Vince, and myself have been at it the longest. Junior Coordinators John, Robert, and Lynda have joined the team along the way, and recently we have added several high school student volunteers who earn community credit hours. Humility prevents me from describing myself as the team quarterback. ;)

Characterizing our Junior Club as "mostly a day care" is just wrong. The kids don't come for milk and cookies (which we don't serve), nor do they come for nap time (which would be impossible without earplugs), they come to play chess. As any visitor will tell you, they clearly do not lack enthusiasm. But as any chess club official will tell you, getting club players of any age to participate in "on the road" club events is difficult.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

[QUOTE=Egidijus Zeromskis;57986]

Canada sends 30-50 kids to the WYCC every year with less worry.

Is it Canada, the CFC or the Parents who are sending the kids? Your post leaves me with this question.

[Aman Hambleton]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

I do know that if I want to play at any event. I go no matter what the costs may be. But of course I like playing chess.

Why are you. using so many. goddamn periods.

[John Brown]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

I think the main thing is setting up the site.
Once any location is secured, then you set up your event.

People who want to play show up.
Chess players are cheap so if you want more to come you have to
create a cheap expense event.

I do know that if I want to play at any event. I go no matter what the costs may be. But of course I like playing chess.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

[QUOTE=Paul Bonham;57985]

Not sure if this crossed your mind, Vlad, but when you talk kids and road trip, the one thing you have to think about is insurance. And then there's also the question of what happens if 100 kids go to Toronto City Hall, and it comes time to leave, and 1 or more kids are missing. You've got to have enough adults to keep an eye on all the kids at all times. It could be a logistical impossibility, and that could be what Bob is referring to.

Canada sends 30-50 kids to the WYCC every year with less worry.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

[QUOTE=Vlad Dobrich;57982]

Vlad, you sound irritated. How dare anyone suggest alternatives to your grand scheme! Did somebody piss in your corn flakes? But seriously, how about we do a reality check, compare and contrast the three proposals.

1: Can we get 100 players from each club to participate?

Mississauga
At MCC clubhouse, yes!
At Square One, difficult but not impossible!
At SCC clubhouse, next to impossible!
At Toronto City Hall, next to impossible!

This is all we need to know from the MCC - you say you can't likely get a 100 players out - end of story.
On the other hand what you say is a 'reality check' for you is not necessarily
reality for others - that is why I asked what your official position is with the MCC. You did not answer.
Now if the MCC had over a hundred avid chess players, I can see the 100 number could be met. But if as you say 100 for a road trip is next to impossible that ends the project. Is it that the MCC is only part chess club but mostly a day care with a chess motif? Then I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for a chess day trip.
So good luck with any interclub match you may organize.

Not sure if this crossed your mind, Vlad, but when you talk kids and road trip, the one thing you have to think about is insurance. And then there's also the question of what happens if 100 kids go to Toronto City Hall, and it comes time to leave, and 1 or more kids are missing. You've got to have enough adults to keep an eye on all the kids at all times. It could be a logistical impossibility, and that could be what Bob is referring to.

[Vlad Dobrich]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

[QUOTE=Bob Gillanders;57973]Vlad, you sound irritated. How dare anyone suggest alternatives to your grand scheme! Did somebody piss in your corn flakes? But seriously, how about we do a reality check, compare and contrast the three proposals.

1: Can we get 100 players from each club to participate?

Mississauga
At MCC clubhouse, yes!
At Square One, difficult but not impossible!
At SCC clubhouse, next to impossible!
At Toronto City Hall, next to impossible!

This is all we need to know from the MCC - you say you can't likely get a 100 players out - end of story.
On the other hand what you say is a 'reality check' for you is not necessarily
reality for others - that is why I asked what your official position is with the MCC. You did not answer.
Now if the MCC had over a hundred avid chess players, I can see the 100 number could be met. But if as you say 100 for a road trip is next to impossible that ends the project. Is it that the MCC is only part chess club but mostly a day care with a chess motif? Then I can understand the lack of enthusiasm for a chess day trip.
So good luck with any interclub match you may organize.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

With the annual Winnipeg - Minneapolis team match, we used to meet halfway. A resort in Minnesota.

[Zeljko Kitich]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

Bob G,

Why don't you just take the step of talking to your membership to see how much interest there may be? With the various options possible. Unless you have already done that. Unless you have not and are presuming on behalf of your membership. You may find a number of your members don't actually live in Mississauga and may in fact live in Toronto or be on a subway line readily. I have never known Mississauga people to be that reluctant to go to Toronto. Many of them or their parents may work in Toronto for example. I trust that Bob A knows not just to talk to his exec but to all the SCC members. That's the kind of fellow he is.

Also why don't you agree to discuss what the rules will be before hand rather than just insisting on your own rules. Unless of course that was just a joke on your part. Also don't you think it's rather odd to insist on that on the basis of your being the host club? Usually hosts are considerate of visitors. I haven't been in Canada for a while now but it can't have changed that much.

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

You would expect all your players to go ALL THE WAY TO SQUARE ONE MALL!! And you clearly could not expect them to go all the way to Scarborough! I know you don't say as much - you use the excuse that the Scarborough CC isn't large enough to hold 100 games. And you don't feel they would undertake the expense to go to downtown Toronto even though I'm offering a paid chartered bus trip. Instead, you propose a Mississauga vs The World match provided a sponsor stepped forward and the players came to play in your sandbox. Such a promotion would benefit only one group - the Mississauga Chess Club.
You give the impression that you are the spokesman for the Mississauga CC - what exactly is your position with the club, if I may ask?
What my original suggestion involved was the creation of a massive chess spectacle at a location where it would draw mainstream news coverage and hence would be of great benefit to chess, as well as to a number of chess organizations and to the two clubs involved.

Vlad, you sound irritated. How dare anyone suggest alternatives to your grand scheme! Did somebody piss in your corn flakes? But seriously, how about we do a reality check, compare and contrast the three proposals.

Proposal 1 - MCC vs. SCC at Toronto City Hall
Proposal 2 - MCC vs. SCC at their respective clubhouses
Proposal 3 - MCC vs. The World at Square One (Mississauga)

1: Can we get 100 players from each club to participate?

Mississauga
At MCC clubhouse, yes!
At Square One, difficult but not impossible!
At SCC clubhouse, next to impossible!
At Toronto City Hall, next to impossible!

Scarborough
At SCC clubhouse, maybe yes!
At Square One, next to impossible!
At MCC clubhouse, next to impossible!
At Toronto City Hall, next to impossible!

2: Facilities

MCC has a spacious room that could hold 200 players easy, with a second room for overflow (but it is two floors away). SCC did have capacity issues when they were at the Jack Goddard Community Centre. But I see they are now at larger facilities at the Birkdale Community Centre. What is their capacity now?
Square One or Toronto City Hall would both be expensive venues. Of course, there is the possibility of donated space.

3: Travel, parking

MCC clubhouse - some costs involved, either pay lots of passes.
SCC clubhouse - possible free parking?
Square One - free parking.
Toronto City Hall - very expensive parking and traffic nightmares. To be fair, you seem to have now upgraded your previous offer of "Now if half of the 100 players of each club were willing to make their own way, the other 50 could be transported by bus for which expenses could be raised by personal sponsorships (some of which I could solicit)" to a more substantial offer of "I'm offering a paid chartered bus trip." Have you costed out this commitment?

4: You stated " Instead, you propose a Mississauga vs The World match provided a sponsor stepped forward and the players came to play in your sandbox. Such a promotion would benefit only one group - the Mississauga Chess Club." Well, whatever. Are you not motivated yourself to hold it in downtown Toronto to benefit the chess community there? As for the CFC, OCA, GTCL, CMA, they are all welcome to participate at the Square One event and benefit from the media publicity generated. Square One is a commercial /retail centre, Mississauga's answer to the West Edmonton Mall. IMHO, it offers greater pedestrian traffic and media attention that Toronto City Hall.

Vlad, I too would like to see "a massive chess spectacle" that could garner media attention, but our biggest challenge is to get enough players involved. A big 100 board match between MCC and SCC is a potential hook to attract media attention. If we hype up a big event, take sponsors money and then turnout is poor, we instead have a media disaster on our hands. A stepping stone to the big event would be to try a dress rehearsal between MCC and SCC at their respective clubhouses. That will help tell us how many players we can realistically get. If SCC is interested, I will see about reserving a date on the MCC 2013 calendar for a club match at our club meeting in December.
Bob A - can I leave it to you to speak to the SCC executive?

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

Despite all evidence to the contrary! I will let our numbers speak for themselves. Although, we did only get 140 players last night, so I hope that isn't a trend.

Anyhow, convincing 100 players from each club to travel to downtown Toronto in very unlikely to succeed. Better to spend our efforts on projects more likely to succeed. A home and home match is more plausible. However, as I understand it, SCC facility can't hold 200 players.

Another idea maybe to hold a 100 board match: Mississauga vs. The World. We could hold it at the Square One Mall, a very busy and big mall in Mississauga, guaranteed mega visibility. Any sponsors? :D

Hi Bob

While not trying to refute Vlad's points myself, I would point out that it might not be necessary to rule out the possibility that, if you settle on a home and home matchup, one of the matches at one club's location on one of the days of play could have fewer boards with games being played on than on the other day of play, if necessary. It could happen for available table space reasons, as you've similarly alluded to, or if fewer players from one club than the other are available for play to begin that day's match with. The latter was the case with the two relatively recent RA-Gatineau home and home matches.

[Vlad Dobrich]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

Despite all evidence to the contrary! I will let our numbers speak for themselves. Although, we did only get 140 players last night, so I hope that isn't a trend.

Anyhow, convincing 100 players from each club to travel to downtown Toronto in very unlikely to succeed. Better to spend our efforts on projects more likely to succeed. A home and home match is more plausible. However, as I understand it, SCC facility can't hold 200 players.

Another idea maybe to hold a 100 board match: Mississauga vs. The World. We could hold it at the Square One Mall, a very busy and big mall in Mississauga, guaranteed mega visibility. Any sponsors? :D

You would expect all your players to go ALL THE WAY TO SQUARE ONE MALL!! And you clearly could not expect them to go all the way to Scarborough! I know you don't say as much - you use the excuse that the Scarborough CC isn't large enough to hold 100 games. And you don't feel they would undertake the expense to go to downtown Toronto even though I'm offering a paid chartered bus trip. Instead, you propose a Mississauga vs The World match provided a sponsor stepped forward and the players came to play in your sandbox. Such a promotion would benefit only one group - the Mississauga Chess Club.
You give the impression that you are the spokesman for the Mississauga CC - what exactly is your position with the club, if I may ask?
What my original suggestion involved was the creation of a massive chess spectacle at a location where it would draw mainstream news coverage and hence would be of great benefit to chess, as well as to a number of chess organizations and to the two clubs involved.

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Mississauga Chess Club is #1

If you want to spend zero on promotion, you will get zero return.

Despite all evidence to the contrary! I will let our numbers speak for themselves. Although, we did only get 140 players last night, so I hope that isn't a trend.

Anyhow, convincing 100 players from each club to travel to downtown Toronto in very unlikely to succeed. Better to spend our efforts on projects more likely to succeed. A home and home match is more plausible. However, as I understand it, SCC facility can't hold 200 players.

Another idea maybe to hold a 100 board match: Mississauga vs. The World. We could hold it at the Square One Mall, a very busy and big mall in Mississauga, guaranteed mega visibility. Any sponsors? :D