Time Increments

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

In the early 70's, a club membership included purchasing a CFC membership at our club.

When the CFC reorganized and hired a business manager and started publishing a magazine, when there was already a good one in Canada, then the CFC membership dues went up.

Right now what is needed, in my opinion, is a doubling of the CFC portion of the membership dues so they have more money for programs. The foundation has the money and the president has the headaches the way it looks to me.

Hi Gary

The RA club in Ottawa has had many CFC-rated club events during the year (along with a small number of theme event or simul nights in recent years) for decades. Hence CFC membership in effect is all but required.

With inflation and the cost of living having gone up since the 1970s, the CFC is probably well overdue for a fee hike. The problem is most people also seem to be tight, especially since we are in the midst of an unofficial depression IMHO. Hence the CFC might lose at least half its members if it doubles its membership fee, especially if there are no additional services provided to members.

In so many ways, the CFC seems to be 'stuck' in the status quo (as usual), and with the CFC lacking much room to maneuver itself financially, and distracted by unwelcome eventualities, as is often the case, there's probably little will on the CFC Governors' part at the moment to attempt any sort of radical change.

What I see as one big problem, as I pretty much alluded to already, is that even if organizers do publicize events more widely, and do have special events or sections for newbies (with very cheap entry fees), many newbies who might want to give organized chess a try, just to see if they like it, will be stopped in their tracks by the price of a full-year CFC membership or even a tournament membership fee. Hence few newbies come into organized chess at the moment, and likely that would remain the case.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

I don't get it why you need to mention the foundation and the president with your offer of doubling.

What part of the relationship between the president and the foundation which I wrote do I have wrong?

Does the foundation not have the money and the president not have the headaches of trying to implement programs on a very limited budget? Could the president not implement more programs if he had more money?

Besides, it seem every time I bring up the low membership fees more members buy life memberships. Paul probably applauds me. :) Funny how that works.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

Hence the CFC might lose at least half its members if it doubles its membership fee, especially if there are no additional services provided to members.

I don't understand how you come to that conclusion.

The last published numbers of May 1st 2014 showed a total membership of 1866. Of that number 455 are either life members or honorary members. I doubt they will quit. That's almost a quarter of your membership right there. The junior membership will likely stay in the normal range because the CFC dues are very small compared to the tournament entry fees.

There were 928 adult members and even if you lose a couple of hundred, which I doubt, the increase more than makes up for that.

Here's my reference numbers.

http://chess.ca/membership-stats

There are so many chess players in Canada and so few CFC members.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

'Might' was speculation on my part. A worst case scenario that the Governors no doubt would be afraid of (besides, there may also a desire to have as many members as can be safely kept or acquired, rather than coming out further ahead on the balance sheet). A membership decline overall would include those (especially adults) who decide not to join (or re-join after more than a year off) besides those who might not renew. Historically roughly a third of a year's members are from those not renewing from the previous year.

IMO, the CFC Constitution really ought to say that one of its primary goals is to have as many CFC members as possible, rather than just encouraging the play etc. of chess in Canada (which millions do casually now and then, at any given time). Such words might well not improve a single thing, but at least there would be zero potential for confusion.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

'Might' was speculation on my part. A worst case scenario that the Governors no doubt would be afraid of (besides, there may also a desire to have as many members as can be safely kept or acquired, rather than coming out further ahead on the balance sheet).

That's probably because you have never doubled membership dues and grown a chess organizations membership. I have. The biggest impact was many of the players who often silently withdrew from events didn't renew their membership and that was a big plus.

The most useless post I've ever held, in or outside chess, was that of CFC governor. It was like being a member of The Borg.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

That's probably because you have never doubled membership dues and grown a chess organizations membership. I have. The biggest impact was many of the players who often silently withdrew from events didn't renew their membership and that was a big plus.

The most useless post I've ever held, in or outside chess, was that of CFC governor. It was like being a member of The Borg.

One thing that has been mentioned by yourself and others that could be a CFC-provided service is a chess server. If not that, then I'd hope for at least a fair deal with an organization providing one - the CFC was looking at such a deal about a year or so before now, but I don't know what became of it. A shame, because I seem to recall there wasn't going to be a big cost to the CFC.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

I recall suggesting a chess server before they got the new web page. Something as part of the page. They could have run events for players who don't go to clubs but would buy a membership to play on the server and pay an entry fee.

In any case, it was rejected.

I'd think with the aging population a chess server which a player could use without leaving home would be popular. I know I access one of them for entertainment. Something called Social Chess on my Ipad.

As a point of interest, I got my printed magazine from the CCCA the other day. They say they have to increase fees and life memberships would have to pay $10. because of the large increase in postage cost. So I'll send them a couple of years worth of increases plus a donation.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Time Increments

What part of the relationship between the president and the foundation which I wrote do I have wrong?

Would doubling fees reduce foundation monies and headaches of the president? Would you renew your lapsed membership too if it would be doubled, tripled? You don't play the CFC rated events for 40 years.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

Would doubling fees reduce foundation monies and headaches of the president? Would you renew your lapsed membership too if it would be doubled, tripled? You don't play the CFC rated events for 40 years.

Doubling fees would not reduce foundation monies but should reduce headaches for the president.

No, I would not renew my membership. I promised myself not to play when I passed 70 years of age, although I'm considering some correspondence on the server. My health does not allow me to regularly go to chess clubs and play in events.

The CCCA gave me a life membership decades ago so I send them donations but, unfortunately, I have had to decline invitations to play in events the past couple of years.

In the 40 years you mention, I have played many times in the correspondence chess Olympiads, Pan Am Games on board 1, North Atlantic Team Event, etc. You probably understand most European nations make sure they are represented and some players have to play those events. For me playing in over the board events and correspondence events do not mix. The bad habits from over the board, such as the cheapoes one sets up in time trouble and faulty traps, simply don't work in correspondence chess where time is not a big factor. Not to mention that for around 10 years of the 40 you mentioned I was the membership secretary, tournament director and for 5 years I was the bulletin editor.

If there was one thing I was good at that was selling chess memberships and increasing the membership.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

I can't think of what improvement to programs/services the CFC could offer to me any time soon that would make me feel I'm getting good value for renewing if the CFC doubled its annual fee. While I was still interested in any sort of regular online play, the CFC rating of chess server games might have been an interesting extra service for me. For me, basically pretty much the only service I need at the moment is just the CFCs core one, namely rating over-the-board events. Even at the present cost of a membership fee, I imagine there's still potential players who ask what's in it for them to be CFC members. Still, if the CFC arbitrarily increased its fee by any amount, I'd hope it would help at least some members by way of improved programs/services, or to improve membership levels somehow (which may or may not help out my tournament scene locally).

In any case, doubling the CFC fee portion of an annual membership could be substantially more in actual dollars than, say, doubling a $10 fee to $20 (don't what a correspondence player's membership actually cost in the day). If the CFC doubled its fee without providing clear compensation of some sort to at least some members, I might pay a bit grudgingly, but others may see it simply as a cash grab and refuse. Even I might not be extravagant enough to pay triple, even with a few new services provided.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

In any case, doubling the CFC fee portion of an annual membership could be substantially more in actual dollars than, say, doubling a $10 fee to $20 (don't what a correspondence player's membership actually cost in the day). If the CFC doubled its fee without providing clear compensation of some sort to at least some members, I might pay a bit grudgingly, but others may see it simply as a cash grab and refuse.

I suggested doubling the membership fees to put money toward programs. At least some members would benefit. On the other hand, if the money was simply used to increase the compensations currently being paid, it's not what I'm suggesting.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

I suggested doubling the membership fees to put money toward programs. At least some members would benefit. On the other hand, if the money was simply used to increase the compensations currently being paid, it's not what I'm suggesting.

By 'compensations' I had in mind a service like the electronic newsletter, which all members are entitled to receive if they can go online. Another would be if a discount of some sort was offered to CFC members if they used a server that the CFC had a deal with (that once was the case some years ago). Another form of compensation might be if hotels or transit gave CFC members discounts (can't recall for sure if that ever happened in the past, but I think it may have). The CFC might decide to spend at the least somewhat less on such compensating services for members than it might obtain in additional revenue if it doubles membership fees.

'Program' is a word that has been used at times in the CFC Handbook. In the past the CFC used such to include things like the 'Local Tournament Incentive Program', by which the CFC offered grants to organizers of tournaments that were held in small population centres. That's up to a maximum amount per year on a first-come-first-serve basis, I recall.

Then again, a common use of 'program' I think is understood to include the general aim of improving some aspect of chess in Canada, such as elite or junior chess. I'll be happier in a few years once I'm classed as senior as far as chess is concerned (60 and over) if there has been progress made as far as program(s) for senior chess in Canada.

With either meaning of 'program' I've used above, the CFC can naturally also decide to spend up to (or at the least somewhat less) on programs the extra revenue it might bring in if membership fees are doubled, I think as you suggest.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

This is like when Clinton wanted a definition of sex.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Time Increments

Hopefully he learned what he wanted to. :)

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Time Increments

Y'know, Kevin, the way it went is like this. I replied to Egid. You replied to that and mentioned a chess server. So I replied to you.

The reply to that was you not understanding what constitutes a program and compensation. Chess servers cost money. Are you a CFC governor?