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Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Canadian Open 2015 - Canadian Closed 2015
A Canadian Closed has to held in time to submit a name for the next World Cup. Last time around the bid from Quebec came the year prior to the World Cup. This time it looks like the Closed will be held in the year of the World Cup. I would also bet pretty good money there will be a Canadian Open next year.
Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Canadian Open 2015 - Canadian Closed 2015
Yesterday, reading all the complaining about the recent CFC elections and the boasting of all the money people have donated and raised for Canadian Chess, I thought to myself "Why haven't we had any international tournaments in ages, other than the Canadian or Quebec Opens or Edmonton?" I know the money is going to the olympiad team or the Canadian Closed, but never a series of tournaments that would help our talent develop. Toronto has a vibrant chess scene, norm hunters who would be willing to play and pay, and lots of people who could billet foreign players. Finger notes of titled players on the ICC say all the time that they are interested in playing in events anywhere. I think we should crowd source and see if we can raise the few thousand dollars to run such a tournament. Also, if you run a rated tournament as a second section, those players entry fees can help to finance the top section.
Yesterday, reading all the complaining about the recent CFC elections and the boasting of all the money people have donated and raised for Canadian Chess, I thought to myself "Why haven't we had any international tournaments in ages, other than the Canadian or Quebec Opens or Edmonton?" I know the money is going to the olympiad team or the Canadian Closed, but never a series of tournaments that would help our talent develop. Toronto has a vibrant chess scene, norm hunters who would be willing to play and pay, and lots of people who could billet foreign players. Finger notes of titled players on the ICC say all the time that they are interested in playing in events anywhere. I think we should crowd source and see if we can raise the few thousand dollars to run such a tournament. Also, if you run a rated tournament as a second section, those players entry fees can help to finance the top section.
Yesterday, reading all the complaining about the recent CFC elections and the boasting of all the money people have donated and raised for Canadian Chess, I thought to myself "Why haven't we had any international tournaments in ages, other than the Canadian or Quebec Opens or Edmonton?" I know the money is going to the olympiad team or the Canadian Closed, but never a series of tournaments that would help our talent develop. Toronto has a vibrant chess scene, norm hunters who would be willing to play and pay, and lots of people who could billet foreign players. Finger notes of titled players on the ICC say all the time that they are interested in playing in events anywhere. I think we should crowd source and see if we can raise the few thousand dollars to run such a tournament. Also, if you run a rated tournament as a second section, those players entry fees can help to finance the top section.
In the late 80th - early 90th there were International Chess tournaments in Mississauga, very well organized by the Croatian Chess Club. Nava and I were hosting many Soviet (at that time, later former Soviet) GM's, taking care of all their needs, driving them back and force from our house in Thornhill all the way to Mississauga. That was fun! BTW, that was my input in organized Canadian Chess!
Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Canadian Open 2015 - Canadian Closed 2015
The Croatia Club tournaments were fantastic! Croatians, Soviets, Brits, Americans and a host of Canadian IMs. Then Montreal took over with a similar annual event in the late 90s and 2000s.
If we could get 5 billets, a venue, a qualifying event to raise money for the big event and a little crowd sourcing, it should be doable.
Start modest, build up a reputation of a good event where players are treated well and then build.
President Vlad - I will look into the crowd sourcing option.
Who shall pay for these tournaments? Can the "first Saturday" scheme survive in Canada?
The best way is to attract sponsors. CMA has sponsored several chess futurity events, to provide international title norm opportunities for promising young Canadian players.
From my experience the cost of playing in a US norm tournament is approx. USD 2000 (travel and accommodation for 2 people plus the entry fee). This is the average from 4 Continental Chess Association tournaments (North American Open in Las Vegas, Chicago Open, Philadelphia Open and World Open in Washington). If you skip the Las Vegas tournament and you're willing to sit in a car for 7-8 hours the cost is around USD 1000 per tournament. The chances of getting a substantial prize money in these tournaments are low because they only have U2500 prizes (no more U2400 in the open section).
The entry fees in a First Saturday GM tournament are from EUR 250 to EUR 500 (depending on rating) plus EUR 6 (license to play in Hungary) plus EUR 15 (FIDE fees).
I'd prefer to pay an entry fee of CAD 500 in a GM norm tournament organized in Toronto or GTA instead of going to US.
The best way is to attract sponsors. CMA has sponsored several chess futurity events, to provide international title norm opportunities for promising young Canadian players.
From my experience the cost of playing in a US norm tournament is approx. USD 2000 (travel and accommodation for 2 people plus the entry fee). This is the average from 4 Continental Chess Association tournaments (North American Open in Las Vegas, Chicago Open, Philadelphia Open and World Open in Washington). If you skip the Las Vegas tournament and you're willing to sit in a car for 7-8 hours the cost is around USD 1000 per tournament. The chances of getting a substantial prize money in these tournaments are low because they only have U2500 prizes (no more U2400 in the open section).
The entry fees in a First Saturday GM tournament are from EUR 250 to EUR 500 (depending on rating) plus EUR 6 (license to play in Hungary) plus EUR 15 (FIDE fees). I'd prefer to pay an entry fee of CAD 500 in a GM norm tournament organized in Toronto or GTA instead of going to US.
I understand what you are saying Rene (and it seems clear how this shakes out) but I wonder how many other norm seekers would be willing to pony up $500 entry fee?
By the way, what sort of prize structure would you be looking for in a norm tournament with a $500 entry fee (assuming some reasonable sponsorship went along with the entry fees?). Some sort of annual norm tournament in Canada (well, Toronto or Montreal) sounds like something that could get some sponsorship awakening - "young bucks" versus "old guard" sort of thing... The games would be fascinating for certain!
Re : Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Canadian Open 2015 - Canadian Closed 2015
A $500 entry fee won't change much for an organizer.
Organizing a round-robin GM norm tournament can cost about $15 000. There are spots for probably 3 or 4 norm seekers willing to pay such an entry fee. Sure, a $500 entry fee covers some of the expenses, but the organizer still needs to find sponsors. And sponsors have little interest in a tournament of 10 players.
Organizing a Swiss GM norm tournament is even harder. It can cost well over $30 000.
A $500 entry fee won't change much for an organizer.
Organizing a round-robin GM norm tournament can cost about $15 000. There are spots for probably 3 or 4 norm seekers willing to pay such an entry fee. Sure, a $500 entry fee covers some of the expenses, but the organizer still needs to find sponsors. And sponsors have little interest in a tournament of 10 players.
Organizing a Swiss GM norm tournament is even harder. It can cost well over $30 000.
Felix, I agree with you. I was using First Saturday as an example that's how I got to the $500 entry fee. In Canada this won't work because is much more expensive to find "available" GMs compared to Europe.
I'm pretty sure that the Edmonton International is sponsored and the organizers don't rely on entry fees to cover their costs.
By the way, what sort of prize structure would you be looking for in a norm tournament with a $500 entry fee (assuming some reasonable sponsorship went along with the entry fees?).
First Saturday tournaments have no prizes. The GMs get paid for playing (appearance fee).
Felix, I agree with you. I was using First Saturday as an example that's how I got to the $500 entry fee. In Canada this won't work because is much more expensive to find "available" GMs compared to Europe.
I'm pretty sure that the Edmonton International is sponsored and the organizers don't rely on entry fees to cover their costs.
Yes, this is unfortunately the problem. To organize GM norm tournaments, we need GMs and to get GMs we need GM norm tournaments (and strong candidates)...
There's also a good reason for which the tournaments are possible in Hungary. Euros are worth a lot there, as the cost of life is relatively low... It's also why there are so many players from Cuba at the Canadian Open ; winning a reasonable prize could represent a full year of rent for them (but not even a month in NYC...).
Last edited by Felix Dumont; Thursday, 17th July, 2014, 11:19 AM.
Re: Re : Re: Re : Re: Canadian Open 2015 - Canadian Closed 2015
As a teenager I always thought the North Bay tournaments looked cool, and I wanted to be good enough to play in them (IIRC you needed to be 2000 or 2200 just to get a FIDE rating at the time).
It's also why there are so many players from Cuba at the Canadian Open ; winning a reasonable prize could represent a full year of rent for them (but not even a month in NYC...).
Actually, a Cuban IM wrote to the FQE to ask if he might be invited to the Quebec Open and to the Canadian Open...
Incidentally, he also asks when and where will be held the Canadian Open... does anybody know now?
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