Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

[Digeng Du]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

@Song:
My post was in sarcasm...

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

The Niagara Falls tournament has always been a "go against the norm tournament."

Hey John, was that a deliberate play on words? Either way, it's priceless! :D

[Mark Biong]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

The Niagara Falls Open has completed 3 rounds and it is represented by players from 3 countries: Canada, USA and Cuba.

Razvan Preotu, Roman Sapozhnikov and Lee Hendon are tied for first with 3 points. There are 5 players at 2.5.

Round 4 starts at 10 am and may the best man/woman win.

John Erickson
TD

You made an earlier report about the results and standings after day 2. Well and good, to make it even better, you should have posted a tentative pairing for round 4 as experienced TDs do. My question for you now is, why did you not have time to post the final results before you went for your scheduled surgery? Are you obligated? Of course not, but you made an initial report and update about your ongoing tournament. Your chess fans were expecting your final report. If you make an initial report, make sure to make a follow up with your final report upon conclusion of your chess tournament. Furthermore, you were able to submit your tournament results to CFC on time as evidenced by the linked cross tables from CFC website. Now, you tell us, you're back after 9 days? Common dude?! You can have all excuses in this world, but you showed your weakness. I only asked for the cross table and nothing more and even used the magic word "PLEASE" post the cross table which I think is more detailed. Am I attacking you, for asking something politely?! You mentioned that you have been running this tournament for 13 years or more and complained about losing money?! Your assistant also claimed that if a strong player registered late, he/she is only interested for a cash grab?! And lately, he is asking “Did you make carbon copies of the games to give to Hugh”?!

[Bob Gillanders]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Your chess fans were expecting your final report.

Nope. Not worried about any final report. Only non participants complaining about that.
We expected another friendly well run NFO tournament, and that was what we got.
Mark, you have made it clear that you find the $48 CFC membership dues outrageously expensive. So why should John worry about your comments? You're never going to play in his tournament.
They take care of their paying customers. Excellent.

[Mark Biong]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Nope. Not worried about any final report. Only non participants complaining about that.
We expected another friendly well run NFO tournament, and that was what we got.
Mark, you have made it clear that you find the $48 CFC membership dues outrageously expensive. So why should John worry about your comments? You're never going to play in his tournament.
They take care of their paying customers. Excellent.

Well, when I played in the US in 2008, they provided 12 free monthly subscription of Chess Life magazine worth $6 now for an annual membership of $40 and I consider it more than a return. That's for me is a practical return for my annual membership from USCF. What tangible return can you provide for CFC members? A newsletter in PDF format where you need a machine to open it! By the way, you did not even bother providing a final report for your recent tournament?! You are not obligated for reporting the final report. I understood, because, you are now obligated to keep the CFC website to keep it running for that $18,000 spent by CFC membership for a crappy website.

[Kerry Liles]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Well, when I played in the US in 2008, they provided 12 free monthly subscription of Chess Life magazine worth $6 now for an annual membership of $40 and I consider it more than a return. That's for me is a practical return for my annual membership from USCF. What tangible return can you provide for CFC members? A newsletter in PDF format where you need a machine to open it! By the way, you did not even bother providing a final report for your recent tournament?! You are not obligated for reporting the final report. I understood, because, you are now obligated to keep the CFC website to keep it running for that $18,000 spent by CFC membership for a crappy website.

If you aren't a paying member of the CFC you have no standing to complain about anything to do with CFC or CFC events.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

They take care of their paying customers.

You never know who will be your future customers. A customer is always right LOL

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

If you aren't a paying member of the CFC you have no standing to complain about anything to do with CFC or CFC events.

Maybe he is protesting :)

imho^2, there was no need for organizers to go into a super defensive mode. Just say "Thank you. We'll consider that", and move on.

[Francis Rodriguez]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Maybe he is protesting :)

imho^2, there was no need for organizers to go into a super defensive mode. Just say "Thank you. We'll consider that", and move on.

Exactly!
:-)

[John Brown]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

You made an earlier report about the results and standings after day 2. Well and good, to make it even better, you should have posted a tentative pairing for round 4 as experienced TDs do. My question for you now is, why did you not have time to post the final results before you went for your scheduled surgery? Are you obligated? Of course not, but you made an initial report and update about your ongoing tournament. Your chess fans were expecting your final report. If you make an initial report, make sure to make a follow up with your final report upon conclusion of your chess tournament. Furthermore, you were able to submit your tournament results to CFC on time as evidenced by the linked cross tables from CFC website. Now, you tell us, you're back after 9 days? Common dude?! You can have all excuses in this world, but you showed your weakness. I only asked for the cross table and nothing more and even used the magic word "PLEASE" post the cross table which I think is more detailed. Am I attacking you, for asking something politely?! You mentioned that you have been running this tournament for 13 years or more and complained about losing money?! Your assistant also claimed that if a strong player registered late, he/she is only interested for a cash grab?! And lately, he is asking “Did you make carbon copies of the games to give to Hugh”?!

Who are you anyway Mark?
Never heard of you before.
I do know one thing. It is people like you that drive Organizers to stop running tournaments. Why do we need such polite requests from a non cfc member.
If you are so interested in results then do like everyone else who does not see a crosstable and go to the CFC site and look for results.
The cost to play in one tournament is $21 for an adult less for a junior so you do not even need to buy a full membership any more.
To want a paper magazine and get as much dedication that John Upper puts into a non paper magazine would cost you a mini fortune for a membership.
I think you made a great decision and a fantastic one when you stopped being a member of the CFC. You did a world of good for Organizers and I commend you for stopping to play chess.
I have nothing but praise for your decision and I trust your non participation will only better the goodness and enjoyment of competitive chess without you.
Three cheers for giving up competitive Chess Hip Hip Hooray!!!

[John Brown]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Maybe he is protesting :)

imho^2, there was no need for organizers to go into a super defensive mode. Just say "Thank you. We'll consider that", and move on.

What defense are you referring to the Snide comments of EGGI?

[Alex Ferreira]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Yes Rene it has everything to do with your post. Your son or you contacted John Erickson and asked for a discount we said there was none and the reply was thanks. We assumed Razvan was not coming.
Then you or Razvan wait till the last minute to see our field and then enter.
Maybe a good lesson should be that if IM's enter late then we structure the prize fund that U2300's are eligible for First - seventh prizes and that IM's get a top IM prize of $100.
entering an IM late in a tournament does not help us bring in more players. What it does is shows us that an IM wants to pick up some easy cash.
Sorry Rene but you say we are patzers then why the heck was Razvan even at our event, if for nothing more than reaping a cash grab.
You feel that we want to be bullied. Well sorry you came to the worst corral for bullying.

Hi John,


Like some people here, I don't quite understand what's upsetting you so much. So the Niagara Falls Open doesn't cater to elite players, totally fine approach. There's certainly something to be said about having equal (or proportionate to the number of players) prize fund in each class. Why not? I don't personally agree with this, but don't fault the approach, different views, different levels of support for each idea. However you seem to be taking this as something truly personal.
The Preotus inquired whether there was free entry for IMs (after all, many other organizers and events offer free entry to IMs, so it's a legitimate question, no harm in asking), and you are 100% entitled to say 'no'. So now, there's no incentive for the IM to register far in advance, and he can now postpone his decision on when to enter the tournament, as per the rules set by the organizer. Okay, he's an IM, therefore already favourite to be at the top of the standings. Everyone knew that when he joined.

But really, why demonize a 15 year old IM for showing up for your event? I somewhat doubt you'd make such a fuss if he hadn't won, though it's expected he'd mow down the opposition. So now he's the dirty one! Do you go on chesstalk and dash out on every participant that joins your tournament last minute, for this or previous editions of the tournament? Oh, I guess it's different if he's an IM. I guess he owes your pre-registered list prestige by joining in advance, whereas Joe Schmoe does not (!?) -- because the IM is favourite to win.

Here's a bit of an unofficial report by one of your players:

3. Witnessing (yet again) Razvan's utter love for the game. After the fourth round Razvan asked if he could join some of us in blitz. Even though we were all much weaker than him, and he knew it, he just wanted to "play chess". I found his attitude inspiring.

It seems to me like this terrible person who spent all weekend hijacking your tournament to win (what, $500?), might actually enjoy playing chess, too! Isn't that what you were advocating, people should come because they want to play? Is an IM forbidden from loving the game? I might even make the argument that the IM decided 'hey, no free entry, I want to play anyway, and the crowd is loving the chess scene, let me play with them!' and at least one person enjoyed having this opportunity to play against Razvan.

Now... unlike just about any other organizer out there who would probably say 'Hey, this was a great tournament, we even had an IM come and everybody had a good time' you take the 'This kid came to take our money' approach. Mind you, it does sound like it was a great tournament apart from this bitterness against the IM which again... I just don't understand. You are now (jokingly or not), talking about having a smaller or symbolic only prize for the top prize of the tournament, because you don't cater to elite players (fair enough) but being totally ridiculous by insinuating that these top top prizes should be less than other class prizes (because you don't like titled players, it appears). Or instead... you want to limit the participation rating at ... 2300? 2200? Preventing titled players from dropping in for a few bucks that they could make guaranteed would they work a minimum wage job anywhere (compared to the travel time and chess playing time they need to play in the tournament, assuming they'd win). And where will this stop, John? If you restrict enrollment from titled players, now all of a sudden National Masters become the big cheese. Maybe in 2020 we will have a big rant because some random top-500 player in Canada with a 2200 rating 'came last minute and took our money'. Maybe you should have a U1600-only tournament, that way YOU might be able to win 1st prize.

Please note that I am not criticizing your event. By all accounts it sounds like it was a great tournament. A couple of whiners complained on chesstalk (as if chesstalkers who are not active chess community members should even be taken into account) that some crosstable wasn't posted. Big deal, ignore them! Your people who keep coming back to your event are the ones who matter. I am just sickened by this attack you took on the one IM who attended your event. I have my doubts whether you'll have any in the future, but I guess that's the idea.


Alex Ferreira

[Hugh Siddeley]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Lest we forget, it was John Brown who complained incessantly about a big weekend event I was co-organizing at the Annex Chess Club a few years back. Prior to the start of the tournament he complained about, among other things, the lighting in the playing area, the lack of air conditioning, and that the start time of the Sunday morning round was too early because the subway wasn't in operation yet from where he was coming from (I guess he hadn't heard of the blue night bus). I suggested an alternative for him; to go play in the chess park, where he could enjoy the light of day when he played, the fresh breeze of the outdoors, and where he could show up anytime of day. I got a lot of shtick for that, and the whole episode pretty much singlehandedly killed my desire for being involved in any kind of tournament organization thereafter.

The lesson is:
If you're going to dish it out, you've got to be able to take it, which he clearly has been unable to do. It also goes to show that what goes around, comes around, hey Johnny boy? BWAHAHAHA

[Mark Biong]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Who are you anyway Mark?
Never heard of you before.
I do know one thing. It is people like you that drive Organizers to stop running tournaments. Why do we need such polite requests from a non cfc member.
If you are so interested in results then do like everyone else who does not see a crosstable and go to the CFC site and look for results.
The cost to play in one tournament is $21 for an adult less for a junior so you do not even need to buy a full membership any more.
To want a paper magazine and get as much dedication that John Upper puts into a non paper magazine would cost you a mini fortune for a membership.
I think you made a great decision and a fantastic one when you stopped being a member of the CFC. You did a world of good for Organizers and I commend you for stopping to play chess.
I have nothing but praise for your decision and I trust your non participation will only better the goodness and enjoyment of competitive chess without you.
Three cheers for giving up competitive Chess Hip Hip Hooray!!!

I just seconded you know: J. Ken MacDonald

Did I miss a final X-Table or is it coming?

Thanks!

All I could say is "You can't teach an old dog new tricks".

[John Brown]

Re: Niagara Falls Open 2015 Standings

Hi John,


Like some people here, I don't quite understand what's upsetting you so much. So the Niagara Falls Open doesn't cater to elite players, totally fine approach. There's certainly something to be said about having equal (or proportionate to the number of players) prize fund in each class. Why not? I don't personally agree with this, but don't fault the approach, different views, different levels of support for each idea. However you seem to be taking this as something truly personal.
The Preotus inquired whether there was free entry for IMs (after all, many other organizers and events offer free entry to IMs, so it's a legitimate question, no harm in asking), and you are 100% entitled to say 'no'. So now, there's no incentive for the IM to register far in advance, and he can now postpone his decision on when to enter the tournament, as per the rules set by the organizer. Okay, he's an IM, therefore already favourite to be at the top of the standings. Everyone knew that when he joined.

But really, why demonize a 15 year old IM for showing up for your event? I somewhat doubt you'd make such a fuss if he hadn't won, though it's expected he'd mow down the opposition. So now he's the dirty one! Do you go on chesstalk and dash out on every participant that joins your tournament last minute, for this or previous editions of the tournament? Oh, I guess it's different if he's an IM. I guess he owes your pre-registered list prestige by joining in advance, whereas Joe Schmoe does not (!?) -- because the IM is favourite to win.

Here's a bit of an unofficial report by one of your players:



It seems to me like this terrible person who spent all weekend hijacking your tournament to win (what, $500?), might actually enjoy playing chess, too! Isn't that what you were advocating, people should come because they want to play? Is an IM forbidden from loving the game? I might even make the argument that the IM decided 'hey, no free entry, I want to play anyway, and the crowd is loving the chess scene, let me play with them!' and at least one person enjoyed having this opportunity to play against Razvan.

Now... unlike just about any other organizer out there who would probably say 'Hey, this was a great tournament, we even had an IM come and everybody had a good time' you take the 'This kid came to take our money' approach. Mind you, it does sound like it was a great tournament apart from this bitterness against the IM which again... I just don't understand. You are now (jokingly or not), talking about having a smaller or symbolic only prize for the top prize of the tournament, because you don't cater to elite players (fair enough) but being totally ridiculous by insinuating that these top top prizes should be less than other class prizes (because you don't like titled players, it appears). Or instead... you want to limit the participation rating at ... 2300? 2200? Preventing titled players from dropping in for a few bucks that they could make guaranteed would they work a minimum wage job anywhere (compared to the travel time and chess playing time they need to play in the tournament, assuming they'd win). And where will this stop, John? If you restrict enrollment from titled players, now all of a sudden National Masters become the big cheese. Maybe in 2020 we will have a big rant because some random top-500 player in Canada with a 2200 rating 'came last minute and took our money'. Maybe you should have a U1600-only tournament, that way YOU might be able to win 1st prize.

Please note that I am not criticizing your event. By all accounts it sounds like it was a great tournament. A couple of whiners complained on chesstalk (as if chesstalkers who are not active chess community members should even be taken into account) that some crosstable wasn't posted. Big deal, ignore them! Your people who keep coming back to your event are the ones who matter. I am just sickened by this attack you took on the one IM who attended your event. I have my doubts whether you'll have any in the future, but I guess that's the idea.


Alex Ferreira

Hi Alex;
Razvan is the First to set a mold for our future tournaments. I don't give a darn that he won. We knew he'd win we actually predicted his result.
I did not like the way these threads have gone but why do you all think that our tournament has to be the dark horse when we have success after success for 13 or 14 years.
Why do people come to our tournament.
I'm sure it is not because of me as you know