Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

[Wayne Komer]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

December 1, 2016

The Morning After

This morning there was a piece in The Guardian by Stephen Moss on the finish of the Match. Among other things it said:

Just after Magnus Carlsen had defeated Sergey Karjakin to retain his world chess championship, at 1am UK time on Thursday morning, I looked at the Guardian home page and was astonished and delighted to see that the liveblog on the world championship was the third-most read item on its website. For a moment chess – ignored, marginalised, even derided by some – finally had its place in the sun.

The four rapidplay tie-breakers which decided the match, after 12 classical games had finished all-square, were one of those rare moments when all the stars aligned, creating a truly memorable event. It was Carlsen’s 26th birthday; rapidplay – where each player has about half an hour for all his moves – is fast enough to be exciting but provides sufficient time for “proper” chess to be played; Karjakin defended doughtily in a terrible position in game two and the Norwegian missed a win; and then, best of all, Carlsen found the most beautiful checkmate in the final game to secure the title.

That coup de grâce contained something that is akin to the holy grail in chess – a queen sacrifice. Except it wasn’t quite a sacrifice because the Russian, realising the game was up, didn’t take it. He resigned instead, shook Carlsen’s hand, and in the press conference that followed said that at 26, he was far from done in his pursuit of the world title.
I tweeted immediately after the game that Carlsen’s beautiful move would be to chess what Ian Botham’s heroics at Headingley in 1981 were to cricket: an indelible memory, something that makes you continue to believe in the sport even in the bad times. Carlsen was already winning the game and only needed to draw to keep his title, having already won game three of the tie-breakers. He could have played safe and ground out a draw. But he looked deeper and found this lovely move, calculating – despite having just two minutes left on his clock – that mate was inevitable. It was bold, brave, brilliant.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...ergey-karjakin

At the press conference after the last game Carlsen said, "I pretty much knew this was going to happen when we made the draw in the 11th game. My strategy was to go for the tiebreak and try my luck there."

"I didn't actually know what my score against him was in rapid," Carlsen replied. "I felt that it was an advantage for me that I didn't have to think as much about game 12 and he did. And I felt my head was working better than it was [before]...Playing four games instead of one seemed like a very good idea. Besides, it was very refreshing to play a bit faster after all these weeks."

Karjakin took the match much longer than GM Viswanathan Anand could. In 2013, Carlsen needed 10 games to wrest the title, then in 2014, he needed 11 games to retain it. Both matches were against the former Indian champion.
Carlsen necessarily called it his toughest world championship test and compared it to the 2013 Candidates' Tournament "where I barely got through."

Yesterday after a mostly equal opener, round two produced a massive opportunity for Carlsen, who could not convert despite several winning moves. Karjakin was universally lauded for defending a worse position for 84 moves, many of them with less than 10 seconds on his clock.

The challenger found a multi-move drawing combination, fantastically sacrificing all three remaining pawns and his rook! Pundits were once again mystified how Carlsen could fail at yet another conversion.

"I would shoot myself in Magnus's place," commentator GM Judit Polgar said.

https://www.chess.com/news/view/carl...mpionship-7236

In Game 3, Karjakin ran his clock below five seconds and then played 38.Rxc7 and resigned.

In Game 4, being behind, Karjakin brought out the Siclian and traded blows with Carlsen but spent precious minutes on his moves and succumbed to the beautiful checkmate mentioned above.

Karjakin said at the press conference that he suffered from the transition to rapid from classical time controls.

Karjakin said he was so immersed in chess that he didn't know many other events from the last three weeks.

"I'm going to ask my wife what actually has happened," he said. Later, he said that fatherly milestones are waiting for him -- his son is currently taking his first steps.

Where do the players go from here? Well, they both plan to play the World Rapid and Blitz Championships in Qatar in December. But on a more long-term level, Karjakin said he will fight again for the top honor in chess. Not surprisingly, he plans to accept his invitation to the next Candidates' Tournament.

The tournament structure was also discussed. Agon director Ilya Merenzon shared some impressive statistics: More than 10 million viewers watched the official website (90 percent on smartphones); more than 10,000 watched in person (possibly a record, he's checking on Chennai 2013); and more than 400 accredited media covered the match.
________

Online Comments

- Hats off to Karjakin, he played an amazing match and shows he thoroughly deserved to be the challenger.

- 10 million viewers, is that 1 million viewers and 9 million attempted re connections ?

- It was a great match all in all...very tough for both players and much more tense than the last two WCC matches.

Congrats to Sergey who turned out to be a truly worthy opponent for Magnus in every respect, a very modest and sympathetic person and a graceful loser.

Apparently Agon and Fide with their corrupt club of clowns will run official chess for the coming years, but then again there is no need to support them if you have sites like this one and Jan & Peter commenting on chess24

- Karjakin's impossible defense at Rapid Round #2... Before the world championship, I thought Caruana vs Carlsen would be a better match-up. But after this enormous fight, I KNOW that Karjakin was a very tough candidate, very very tough. He put his all to the fight, and shown one of the best defences I've ever seen. Therefore, I congratulate Sergey for his effort and coming so close to winning the championship

- The best WC ever ending with the best mate ever!

The rapid ending was brilliant and so was Carlsen. Impressive how Karjakin defended against the constantly attacking Carlsen - It looked like a winning strategy for a long time...and in the end the best player won.

- These tiebreaks perfectly showed that this thing shouldn't be allowed in classical chess. One of the players couldn't readjust his way of play and games were very one-sided. And i don't really think that we can blame Karjakin for this too hard - he played 12 classical games on the highest level possible, some of them lasted for many hours. I think that the best format is 16-18 games and the champion holds the title if drawn. If people love rapid/blitz maybe we can see increasing number of blitz/rapid events in the future but where is no necessity in bringing world championship match to it.

- The Classical World Championship match should be 16 games (12 are too short to provide a definitive winner; 24 are too long/expensive for sponsors), with the champion retaining the title in the event of an 8 - 8 result. Rapid and Blitz games (not to mention an Armaggedon game) should have nothing to do with determining the Classical World Champion. Those games belong in tournaments/matches for the World Rapid and World Blitz Championship titles, respectively.

- Sergey will always be remembered. The second game of yesterday will go down in history as THE IMMORTAL DEFENSE.

- "Giving a queen to mate by force is giving mate."

Of course it's a sacrifice, even if it's for mate. You are "giving a queen" is just another way of saying "sacrificing a queen." If Magnus didn't get anything in return, it would be called "blundering the queen."

Anyway, it was a spectacular way to end the match. People will be looking at that move for decades to come. I thought it was a great finale. Kudos to both players for a tense match and an exciting finish.

- In the end the best man won, i was very impressed with both players high class and sportsmanship in the final press conference with Carsen given high praise to Sergey and Karjakin wishing Magnus a happy birthday, it was really so polite and nice, wish it was like this in all sports

[Wayne Komer]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

December 1, 2016

GM Jonathan Tisdall sums up the match in a long article in Matt & Patt (in English)

http://mattogpatt.no/2016/12/01/happy-birthday-magnus/

It contains these provocative paragraphs:

Carlsen was winning every opening battle. Maybe not in the way we used to think of winning the opening, by unveiling some novel path to advantage. But he was never surprised and was generally the one posing questions. The only opening that arguably went wrong was the fateful game 9, but even there Team C steered the opening course, it was just a very poor choice, especially for the match situation. With Team K unable to dictate the battlefields, the path to eventual gradual punishment was short.

Where the million dollar preparation from Team K went remains an enigma. Maybe a whole series of unlucky candidates are going to find this out in March 2018. But Carlsen appeared the better prepared.

One other question occurred to me during all this musing – what will the effect of this match be on future Carlsen challengers? Will they feel encouraged by the apparent tarnishing of the champion’s greatest weapon, or is he just evolving as a player? Magnus often appeared to be playing – differently. He clearly had a policy of aiming for positions of greater complexity often, choosing sharper play – not just when growing frustrated during the match proper, but also at a critical juncture in the second rapid game, when he could have settled for a very comfy and ‘typically Carlsen’ grind. It often appeared that he preferred his chances vs Sergey in messy rather than technical play.

To my mind, Magnus has been very methodically expanding his playing style over the past few years, more and more ready to play theoretical variations, and happier to play sharper and sharper positions. This year, especially in some rapid events, and even more so when angry, he has produced games and performances that remind me of the kind of extra level Fischer achieved over his near peers at the height of his powers, and which I thought signaled a looming quantum leap in strength.
________

To appreciate the whole argument Tisdall makes, see the original article.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

December 1, 2016

GM Jonathan Tisdall sums up the match in a long article in Matt & Patt (in English)

http://mattogpatt.no/2016/12/01/happy-birthday-magnus/

It contains these provocative paragraphs:

Carlsen was winning every opening battle. Maybe not in the way we used to think of winning the opening, by unveiling some novel path to advantage. But he was never surprised and was generally the one posing questions. The only opening that arguably went wrong was the fateful game 9, but even there Team C steered the opening course, it was just a very poor choice, especially for the match situation. With Team K unable to dictate the battlefields, the path to eventual gradual punishment was short.

Where the million dollar preparation from Team K went remains an enigma. Maybe a whole series of unlucky candidates are going to find this out in March 2018. But Carlsen appeared the better prepared.

One other question occurred to me during all this musing – what will the effect of this match be on future Carlsen challengers? Will they feel encouraged by the apparent tarnishing of the champion’s greatest weapon, or is he just evolving as a player? Magnus often appeared to be playing – differently. He clearly had a policy of aiming for positions of greater complexity often, choosing sharper play – not just when growing frustrated during the match proper, but also at a critical juncture in the second rapid game, when he could have settled for a very comfy and ‘typically Carlsen’ grind. It often appeared that he preferred his chances vs Sergey in messy rather than technical play.

To my mind, Magnus has been very methodically expanding his playing style over the past few years, more and more ready to play theoretical variations, and happier to play sharper and sharper positions. This year, especially in some rapid events, and even more so when angry, he has produced games and performances that remind me of the kind of extra level Fischer achieved over his near peers at the height of his powers, and which I thought signaled a looming quantum leap in strength.
________

To appreciate the whole argument Tisdall makes, see the original article.

Kasparov was short but right in his tweet. Just in one sentence he described what you (or Jonathan Tisdall) just wrote in many paragraphs LOL
"Congratulations to Magnus! His lack of preparation angered the goddess Caissa, but not enough to drive her into the drab Karjakin's arms."

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

I was pretty disappointed in this match. Karjakin never really deserved to win a single game imo and Carlsen could have won as many as six (including TB games).
To me Karjakin's performance is about on par with Kasparov's vs Kramnik back in 2000.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

.....Qh6+ was a spectacular shot all the same......

Yes.... But did anyone bother to ask Carlsen after the game whether he saw when he played 45.Qxf4 the mate using the Queen sacrifice?

You see, 47.Qxf4 was not the best move at that point in the game. Here's how Stockfish 8 saw it to a search depth of 32 plies:

1 32 +6.64
47.Rc8+ Bd8 48.h6 b5 49.Qb2 gxh6 50.Rh5 Qe7 51.Rxh6 f6 52.Kf1 Kg7 53.Rh3 Qe5 54.Qg2+ Qg5 55.Qxg5+ fxg5 56.Rxd8 Ra6 57.Rb8 Ra1+ 58.Ke2 Ra2+ 59.Kd3 g4 60.Rh4 gxf3 61.Rxf4 Rxh2 62.Rxf3 Rb2 63.Rf5 Rb3+ 64.Kd4 b4 65.Kd5 Rb1 66.Rf3 Rb2 67.Kxd6 Kg6 68.Rg8+ Kh7

2 32 +2.73
47.Qxf4 Qxf4 48.Rxf4 Bf6 49.Rc8+ Kh7 50.Rf5 Bd4 51.Kg3 Bc5 52.Rb8 g6 53.hxg6+ fxg6 54.Rff8 Kg7 55.Rg8+ Kf6 56.Rbf8+ Rf7 57.Kg4 Rxf8 58.Rxf8+ Kg7 59.Rb8 Kf6 60.h4 Bd4 61.Rf8+ Ke7 62.Ra8 Kf6 63.Rc8 Bc5 64.Rf8+ Kg7 65.Rb8 Kf6 66.Rd8 b5 67.Rf8+ Ke6 68.Kg5 d5 69.Rf6+ Ke5 70.Kxg6 dxe4

So this is very important: 47.Rc8+ is way superior to 47.Qxf4..... +6.64 compared to +2.73.

HOWEVER..... is it possible that in playing 47.Qxf4 Carlsen USED PSYCHOLOGY?

Because as you see above, the natural reply for Karjakin would have been to trade off the Queens on f4. Stockfish sees that because Stockfish sees that while 47....Ra2+ followed by 48....Qf2, has mate threats for Black, it leads to the 49.Rc8+ and 50.Qh6+ mating combo for White.

Stockfish sees this, but it was very likely that Karjakin, BECAUSE HE IS DESPERATE TO WIN THIS GAME, would NOT see it and would instead go for the 47....Ra2+ and 48....Qf2 line, seeing all those Black mating threats. And he would lose to the mate that was played.

Did Carlsen anticipate that Karjakin would, in his desperate state to win the game, make this exact fatal error? And did that cause Carlsen to play 47.Qxf4 and lead Karjakin along the path to his doom?

I wish someone had asked Carlsen this after the game. Perhaps the question can still be put to him. It would make 47.Qxf4 a stunning psychological ploy! Sure, Carlsen could have won with 47.Rc8+, but did he DELIBERATELY choose the more psychological (and much quicker) path to victory? Or did Carlsen simply not realize that 47.Rc8+ was a much better move technically.... did he actually make a bad move and extricate himself by finding Qh6+ which was the one saving move?

If he saw it all at 47.Qxf4, then I would call that move one of the most brilliant psychological moves in perhaps decades, even if it wasn't necessary to win. The only move I recall that compares was Anand's ....h6 against Topalov in an early game in their WC match (whatever year that was), which psychologically compelled Topalov to launch a Kingside attack that Anand calculated would fall short and broke that match open for Anand. The situation was similar in that Anand's ....h6, if Topalov did NOT launch the Kingside attack, would have been a pretty lame move and Topalov could have found ways to secure a long term advantage. But Anand made the ....h6 move, psychologically calculating Topalov would not be able to resist the Kingside attack. Anand talked about that after the game.

[Mathieu Cloutier]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

+3 or +6 doesn't really matter in that position. Both moves are clearly winning and it's just a matter of taste. No need to overanalyze this.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

+3 or +6 doesn't really matter in that position. Both moves are clearly winning and it's just a matter of taste. No need to overanalyze this.

Ha ha! What a howler! The very person who posted this:

"Qh6 by Carlsen might seem simple from the comfort of our seats, with the engine running and all.

But we have to appreciate that it had to be planned well in advance. Because it is, literally, the only winning move. Without it, white is losing."

is now saying

"+3 or +6 doesn't really matter in that position. Both moves are clearly winning and it's just a matter of taste."

That person is now in disagreement with.... HIMSELF!

Mathieu.....YOU WROTE that it had to be well planned in advance. YOU WROTE that without 50.Qxh6+ Carlsen is lost. And you were CORRECT on the second point, not necessarily on the first. And it's not "overanalyzing" when a move is made that can only be justified as a +3 move IN THE CONTEXT of finding the saving move 50.Qxh6+. If Magnus didn't see that mating line, or if it turned out not to work because of some tiny overlooked detail, Carlsen blunders away winning the WC and they have to go to blitz games. And we'd all be asking what kind of breakdown Magnus had!

Overanalyze THAT!

Meanwhile, ignoring the troll, I have to wonder if anyone else out there appreciates what happened and wonder if Carlsen actually SAW the saving move when he played 47.Qxf4 instead of the much stronger (technically speaking) 47.Rc8+.

If not for 50.Qxh6+, then 47.Qxf4 would be the LOSING move (because 47....Ra2+ FORCES 48.Kh1 and 48..... Qf2 forces desparado moves from White, starting with 49.Rc8+ .... a move that is useless if not for the follow-up 50.Qh6+).

Now the troll is calling that overanalyzing! It's the difference between winning and losing if the saving desparado line wasn't there! And seeing the saving mate was extremely difficult at move 47 (for a human player, not for Stockfish).

As Kerry pointed out, even seeing it at move 50 is difficult, helped if you know that there IS a saving mate there for White. Also helped by realizing Black has half a dozen immediate mates for which no defensive move helps, including 50.Qg3.

The question remains, did Magnus see that saving mate when he made his move 47? Or was his move 47 actually a blunder that was only saved by a miracle mate that Magnus didn't even see until he HAD to see it to save his game?

With all the people analyzing this game online, didn't anyone bring this question up? It's YUGE!

I wonder if at this stage Carlsen would even admit to his move 47 being a "saved blunder" if that's what it was..... only he knows for sure.

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

If not for 50.Qxh6+, then 47.Qxf4 would be the LOSING move (because 47....Ra2+ FORCES 48.Kh1 and 48..... Qf2 forces desparado moves from White, starting with 49.Rc8+ .... a move that is useless if not for the follow-up 50.Qh6+).

What makes you think 49.Rc8+ is forced or that 47.Qxf4 would be otherwise losing? In the game White could have played pretty much any move that guards the g2-square on move 49 and still be fine. True 50.Qh6+ was forced but he obviously saw that at the very least when he played 49.Rc8+

[John Coleman]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

If not for 50.Qxh6+, then 47.Qxf4 would be the LOSING move (because 47....Ra2+ FORCES 48.Kh1 and 48..... Qf2 forces desparado moves from White, starting with 49.Rc8+ .... a move that is useless if not for the follow-up 50.Qh6+).
With all the people analyzing this game online, didn't anyone bring this question up? It's YUGE!

Harder to calculate is the forced mate after 49. Rc8+ Bf8 50.RxB KxR 51.Rxf7+ etc

[Wayne Komer]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

December 2, 2016

The so-called Sesse Supercomputer analyzes all of Carlsen’s games as they are being played. At the moment it has the position after 49…Kh7 and the analysis of every possible move after that

http://analysis.sesse.net
_________

Evidently Steinar H. Gunderson has the alias Sesse. He is a Norwegian computer scientist and software engineer, who worked in Switzerland for Google, Inc.

It is perhaps a good idea to bookmark the site and refer to it when Carlsen is playing a match!

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

What makes you think 49.Rc8+ is forced or that 47.Qxf4 would be otherwise losing? In the game White could have played pretty much any move that guards the g2-square on move 49 and still be fine. True 50.Qh6+ was forced but he obviously saw that at the very least when he played 49.Rc8+

Ok, last night I did realize that and that's why I wasn't talking in terms of Magnus losing the game.

In my post today, I forgot about that and got thinking the stakes were far greater. My mistake under goading by a troll. I'm sure the troll will be happy, but my original thoughts were correct, so just a minor misstep on my part. I'll just remember not to respond to his goading any further.

So my original question remains and is still fascinating. Did Magnus, with his 47th move of Qxf4, make a psychological decision to goad Karjakin into the mating line that got played? And as I stated last night, if so it would be the best psychological move (that I know about) since the Anand-Topolav match.

The troll says the choice of 47.Qxf4 was a matter of taste, even though objectively it was almost 4 points worse than 47.Rxc8. Would you agree with that, Tom? Do you think Magnus may have just made a snafu (not as serious as an outright blunder) and then had to adjust and didn't see the mating line until move 49?

If he saw it all at move 47, that would make it impressive, and all the more so given the line John Coleman gave, which beginning at move 49 is mate in 8:
49.Rc8+ Bf8 50.Rxf8+ Kxf8 51.Rxf7+ Ke8 52.Rf8+ Kd7 53.Qf7+ Kc6 54.Rc8+ Kb5 55.Qc4+ Ka5 56.Ra8#

[Mathieu Cloutier]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Ha ha! What a howler! The very person who posted this:

"Qh6 by Carlsen might seem simple from the comfort of our seats, with the engine running and all.

But we have to appreciate that it had to be planned well in advance. Because it is, literally, the only winning move. Without it, white is losing."

is now saying

"+3 or +6 doesn't really matter in that position. Both moves are clearly winning and it's just a matter of taste."

And in your quote, you conveniently left out the fact that we're talking about different moves...

[Mathieu Cloutier]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Harder to calculate is the forced mate after 49. Rc8+ Bf8 50.RxB KxR 51.Rxf7+ etc

That mate is very easy to calculate. You don't even bother calculating it until the end. It's just obvious that black is geting mated there.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

That mate is very easy to calculate. You don't even bother calculating it until the end. It's just obvious that black is geting mated there.

Except that by abandoning your own first rank, any miscalculation where Black has an extra escape square you forgot about means you fall short and suddenly have to defend a few mate-in-1's against you. I think that was John Coleman's point. Doh!

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: Games of the Carlsen-Karjakin W.C.C. Match

Ok, last night I did realize that and that's why I wasn't talking in terms of Magnus losing the game.

In my post today, I forgot about that and got thinking the stakes were far greater. My mistake under goading by a troll. I'm sure the troll will be happy, but my original thoughts were correct, so just a minor misstep on my part. I'll just remember not to respond to his goading any further.

So my original question remains and is still fascinating. Did Magnus, with his 47th move of Qxf4, make a psychological decision to goad Karjakin into the mating line that got played? And as I stated last night, if so it would be the best psychological move (that I know about) since the Anand-Topolav match.

The troll says the choice of 47.Qxf4 was a matter of taste, even though objectively it was almost 4 points worse than 47.Rxc8. Would you agree with that, Tom? Do you think Magnus may have just made a snafu (not as serious as an outright blunder) and then had to adjust and didn't see the mating line until move 49?

If he saw it all at move 47, that would make it impressive, and all the more so given the line John Coleman gave, which beginning at move 49 is mate in 8:
49.Rc8+ Bf8 50.Rxf8+ Kxf8 51.Rxf7+ Ke8 52.Rf8+ Kd7 53.Qf7+ Kc6 54.Rc8+ Kb5 55.Qc4+ Ka5 56.Ra8#

1) I don't think he saw the mating line when he played Qxf4 though I wouldn't say the chances are 0%.

2) I agree with Matthieu. I think it is a matter of taste. Remember, Carlsen only needed to draw the game so for him anything that safely maintains his advantage is fine. I have never played a GM who in the post-mortem talked about +3 or +6 or whatever positions. Mostly if they find something really strong they play it. I would think in a relatively fast game the tendency to play the first strong move you see is even more pronounced. I know it's true for me in my games.

3) I don't know when he saw the mating line, but even if he only saw it just prior to actually playing Rc8+ it is still fine for him. On the Chess24 broadcast when Qh6+ was pointed out to Svidler, he thought that Magnus would just play something safe like Qg3 with big advantage for White with - very importantly! - very little risk.