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Dark Knight / Le Chevalier Noir
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It's for the greater good of the tournament to not have any forfeits and I think the organizer (Not the on floor Arbiter) should try everything to get absent players to the hall. If not a 30 second phone call/text then sending a volunteer to knock on their hotel room door.
I'm only talking about trying to call one or two people, if more are missing, that's a bigger problem.
Sure you can fine them - screw them - but they have already screwed your event. Call the police, amber alert, drag them into the playing hall.
Thanks for making me laugh!
But now that I think of it, EVERY ONE of this year's forfeits was NOT staying at the hotel. Another reason to make the hotel deal even more attractive!
I'm also thinking of HIRING floaters, especially in the top section, which could entail norms. Not for forfeits (that ship has set sail) but vs. forced byes.
P.S. and yeah, in Canadian chess, the Organizer helps on the floor!
P.S. and yeah, in Canadian chess, the Organizer helps on the floor!
It would be nice to always have somebody on the organizer's team who is free to leave the playing hall for, example, liaisoning with the hotel for more drinking water or toilet paper or noise complaint or adjusting the thermostat. Or for making photocopies or picking up coffees. . . Organizers are also responsible for collecting money, signage, cleaning the skittles room, escorting the sponsors and press, and greeting entrants upon arrival, maybe even picking a player up from the airport or bus station.
Anyways, the important thing in a norm event is to get all players on board in advance about not forfeiting, how to communicate a WD asap.
Maybe email/text all players early on (like the day of round 1) with the tournament rules and stating that this is the number to contact if you want a zero-point bye or to withdraw. That way they won't even have to write down the phone number (searching for it later).
Aris, just to expand on your understanding of whether the CFC rates forfeits:
The hand book article regarding this is still valid. If the TD scores the game as a win for one player and a loss for the other, it is rated.
If the TD scores the game as a forfeit, as you stated the game is not rated.
Paul Leblanc
Rating Auditor
We had several forfeits at this year's Grand Pacific Open. As usual, they were in the first and last rounds.
They were scored as wins and rated since none of the offending players notified anyone or gave any excuse.
Aris, just to expand on your understanding of whether the CFC rates forfeits:
The hand book article regarding this is still valid. If the TD scores the game as a win for one player and a loss for the other, it is rated.
If the TD scores the game as a forfeit, as you stated the game is not rated.
Paul Leblanc
Rating Auditor
Thanks Paul. I must admit, like Alex, I am hesitant to record forfeits as played games. I guess that's my FIDE background coming out.
Maybe email/text all players early on (like the day of round 1) with the tournament rules and stating that this is the number to contact if you want a zero-point bye or to withdraw. That way they won't even have to write down the phone number (searching for it later).
I don't think solutions should be any more work-intensive for organizers than is absolutely necessary. Except in the case of legitimate extenuating circumstances (i.e. the player can argue for reinstatement to good standing, after the tournament, with a CFC committee set up for that purpose), it's a player's responsibility to be there, or provide sufficient (defined by organizer) notice, or suffer whatever penalty is within the organizer's discretion (e.g. like Aris' proposal).
Last edited by Peter McKillop; Sunday, 28th April, 2019, 04:23 PM.
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I don't think solutions should be any more work-intensive for organizers than is absolutely necessary. Except in the case of legitimate extenuating circumstances (i.e. the player can argue for reinstatement to good standing, after the tournament, with a CFC committee set up for that purpose), it's a player's responsibility to be there, or provide sufficient (defined by organizer) notice, or suffer whatever penalty is within the organizer's discretion (e.g. like Aris' proposal).
Thanks Peter, well said. I have no problem with valid reason, where I would be compassionate.
I don't think solutions should be any more work-intensive for organizers than is absolutely necessary. Except in the case of legitimate extenuating circumstances (i.e. the player can argue for reinstatement to good standing, after the tournament, with a CFC committee set up for that purpose), it's a player's responsibility to be there, or provide sufficient (defined by organizer) notice, or suffer whatever penalty is within the organizer's discretion (e.g. like Aris' proposal).
I can't disagree that it is the player's responsibility, and even so they are all masters, four players still forfeited. I don't know the circumstances or what communication the organizer did or not did, but perhaps it would have been fewer with more reminders.
It would be terrible for a player to lose an IM or GM norm because of a forfeit. A $100 fine won't get that norm back perhaps more communication would have prevented the forfeit.thsts the player I'm concerned about.
I don't think 15 minutes of work over the tournament by the organizer is asking for too much.
I can't disagree that it is the player's responsibility, and even so they are all masters, four players still forfeited. I don't know the circumstances or what communication the organizer did or not did, but perhaps it would have been fewer with more reminders.
It would be terrible for a player to lose an IM or GM norm because of a forfeit. A $100 fine won't get that norm back perhaps more communication would have prevented the forfeit.thsts the player I'm concerned about.
I don't think 15 minutes of work over the tournament by the organizer is asking for too much.
Your proposed "solution" confirms that you are uninformed as to why any of those forfeits actually happened. But whatever, I'll put an extra 15 minutes into my deposit idea. Thanks everyone.
Why do you think anyone should gain or lose rating points for an unplayed game? The rating system attempts to measure performance. It's not a reward-and-punishment system.
On an unrelated note, if people think that forfeits may influence the obtaining of norms:
1) Don't allow anyone who forfeited a game in this year's Closed to play next year.
2) Make the tournament ten rounds instead of nine.
Why do you think anyone should gain or lose rating points for an unplayed game? The rating system attempts to measure performance. It's not a reward-and-punishment system.
On an unrelated note, if people think that forfeits may influence the obtaining of norms:
1) Don't allow anyone who forfeited a game in this year's Closed to play next year.
2) Make the tournament ten rounds instead of nine.
I think Tom is right, we can't rate an unplayed game, or at least we shouldn't, and I personally choose to honour that understanding. I guess every Organizer is free to decide for themselves.
Tom, thanks for your other ideas. #1 seems harsh to me, as I would like to give people a chance to change. As for #2, I believe that 10 rounds would add an extra hotel night, which I fear would drop overall numbers. I'll try my deposit idea next year, which in a nutshell is: if someone forfeited this year, they need to add a refundable deposit to their registration next year. They would lose that deposit only if they forfeited again, with at least half that deposit being gifted to the winner of the forfeit. I THINK that strikes a good situational balance, but what do YOU think of this Tom?
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