Recognize Chess as a Sport in Canada

[Brad Thomson]

I would rather discuss Paul Bonham and his fictional alter ego Pargat Perrer.

I do not wish to upset or offend anyone, but for what it may or may not be worth, I have long shared Vlad's suspicion that Pargat may be Paul. (Not that it really matters.)

[J. Crowhurst]

I asked him why, and pointed out that if he won the game he won the money. He said he knew that but was more concerned with thinking about his rating. The dude would prefer to have been 1325 and broke rather than risking falling all the way to 1295 while taking a crack at some nice cash. This remains one of the stupidest things I can ever recall witnessing.

This is where the future of chess promotion lies. I get the thought that it's stupid, certainly from an adult's point of view. But we (well, you all...) are trying to sell a product, and this guy Brad spoke to is a consumer who said exactly what it is he's willing to buy. Once we accept that there are people, like him, who aren't that interested in cash prizes, it opens a lot of doors in terms of retaining customers.

One of the lasting memories I have from my chess career is a trophy that I didn't win. It was spectacular, especially for the 1980's, difficult to describe but as much a work of art as much as anything else. I lost it on the tie-break, and I haven't forgot that, 35 years later. You want to keep people coming back? You need the kind of rewards that the winners will treasure, and more importantly, that non-winners will keep chasing. Trophies are awesome. A picture and perhaps brief in the Provincial chess online magazine, similarly, awesome. More coverage for new players, young players, and... shall we say, improving players. As for the titled players, I'm sure the last thing they need is another trophy. So, give them their cash, give them their trophy, then buy it back from them at a discount to use again next time, if they are willing.

One more thing. It has never been cheaper or easier to produce a 22 or 44 minute video which would be suitable for telecast, even if on a fringe channel. A summary of a local weekend swiss could be made that combines footage from the playing floor, some commentary, player interviews, and the presentation of prizes. There are takers out there for content, particularly Canadian content. Even if it's on at 3am, people can PVR it. You think people play for rating points? Get chess on TV, and you'll never lose those people who are interested in that kind of recognition.

[Tom O'Donnell]

As for the titled players, I'm sure the last thing they need is another trophy. So, give them their cash, give them their trophy, then buy it back from them at a discount to use again next time, if they are willing.

The golden age of trophy recycling, c.1986-88 in BC.

[Tom O'Donnell]

I do not wish to upset or offend anyone, but for what it may or may not be worth, I have long shared Vlad's suspicion that Pargat may be Paul. (Not that it really matters.)

I sent Vlad and one other poster here my suspicion. I think it was Spring 2020.

[Vlad Drkulec]

I sent Vlad and one other poster here my suspicion. I think it was Spring 2020.

I would have given you credit but wasn't sure that you wanted it known that you were the unmasker. There has been little evidence to counter your hypothesis since it was advanced and much to support the idea.

[Pargat Perrer]

Additional taxpayer funding because of the structure/platform or rather courses which develop learning. In a qualified manner. That's why from the get go of this shinning thread I recommend partnering with CMA.

If it were me, as King of Chess in Canada, I'd take that fresh funding and drop it all on someone like IM O'Donnell who could, with his decades of experience in teaching chess, structure this entire national effort.

Ok, so you want funding not just to get children learning the rules of chess and playing some fun games to improve their visualization skills, but you want also to teach the children in school, funded by the province and by local taxes, to become GOOD chess players. Wrong answer! I am NOT in favor of that. I am against trying to turn future scientists, engineers, doctors, nurses into professional chess players, touring the world like Hambleton and Hansen, playing meaningless games..... and I am especially against using tax money to do that.

[J. Crowhurst]

The golden age of trophy recycling, c.1986-88 in BC.

What’s old becomes new again!

Man, it was such an ordeal to find organized chess back then, even if you were looking for it. At my school we played a friendly match against the chess club at Churchill Secondary, and a couple of their guys had heard rumours of these tournaments held out at UBC, but knew no details. If Jason Feng hadn’t figured out where and when, I don’t know if I ever would have played in one. I certainly wouldn’t have found them myself.

[Pargat Perrer]

If you argue with an idiot, there are two idiots arguing.

I would rather discuss Paul Bonham and his fictional alter ego Pargat Perrer. Every poster has his own signature, a series of tells that they can overcome only with great difficulty and a certain skill which I am afraid you are sorely lacking. A dog returns to his vomit and you are unable to rise above your previous work and are fond of returning to past lines of attack.

When making up a character it is best to create a whole new character going through a similar process to that of an author creating a character for a work of fiction. The person can even be based on a real person that you know really well. Its best if you don't share an IP address.

So you would rather talk about some ghost in your head who used to post here on ChessTalk rather than talk about a fairly big issue for someone in your position, public funding of chess. Perhaps blood sugar levels are the least of your health concerns.

When Mr. Bonham used to talk to me about this site, he never mentioned any names. He always told me that if I joined, he wanted me to find my own way here and someday we would compare notes about some of the different characters here. I must assume that you and he butted heads here, perhaps quite often. I've avoided going back to read any of his past posts because I really don't see the need to know.

If I post here similar opinions to Mr. Bonham, I can tell you we were like blood brothers and we stayed up late many nights talking about our mutual interests: chess, chess variants, poker, philosophy, math, computers, U.S. politics and karma. We thought so much alike on these topics, and so yeah, I probably do sound a lot like him, although I think he was even more into chess variants than i was. When he was pushing Option Chess as an anti-computer version of chess, I did get involved with that. I think I recall even sending one poster here a rules document, or maybe it was some annotated games ... can't remember for sure now.

I really don't care who thinks what regarding myself and Mr. Bonham. It all just makes me chuckle.

But what's clear is that you, Mr. Drkulec, are offering Olga no support whatsoever on taxpayer funding for chess. The only thing i don't know is if you put her up to it in the first place, as I suggested with my mention of the Life cereal commercial .... "Let Olga do it, she'll try anything!' LOL

[Vlad Drkulec]

So you would rather talk about some ghost in your head who used to post here on ChessTalk rather than talk about a fairly big issue for someone in your position, public funding of chess. Perhaps blood sugar levels are the least of your health concerns.

Arguing with a sock puppet on chesstalk will hardly advance that agenda. Please refer to my admonition about arguing with idiots. Also see Miyamoto Musashi's advice to do nothing which is of no use.

And Neal, yes it is a cesspool.

[Neil Frarey]

Ok, ... to become GOOD chess players.

No! Don't care about their playing ability.

There's a difference.

Use Chess to become gooder at logic skills, at lateral thinking skills. Gooder at english?

Prolly not, ha!

[Neil Frarey]

Ok, ... to become GOOD chess players.

Here's a small slice of what I'm talkin' about concerning ... Quebec + CMA (Chess'n Math Association) + Chess = ...

Which province in Canada scores the highest math grade?

There's prolly a ton of specific evidence of just where in Quebec that chess is taught in which particular schools that leads to Quebec's top national grade in Math, but Pargat give me break, I'm already on my [strike]second[/strike] third beer ... you know what I mean?

peace,
n.



.

[Pargat Perrer]

Here's a small slice of what I'm talkin' about concerning ... Quebec + CMA (Chess'n Math Association) + Chess = ...

Which province in Canada scores the highest math grade?

There's prolly a ton of specific evidence of just where in Quebec that chess is taught in which particular schools that leads to Quebec's top national grade in Math, but Pargat give me break, I'm already on my [strike]second[/strike] third beer ... you know what I mean?

peace,
n.



.

That's ok, Neil, I am sure that the learning of chess does improve math scores. But a dedication to chess instead of to math or science or engineering or medicine / bioscience, that is what I am against. What good are improved math scores if the youth all go into professional chess?

I think chess should be taught, but in a way that says this will improve your thinking skills and visualization, and so use that in your math and science and engineering studies in university and your career, and DO NOT take up chess professionally because it is a waste of your mind, and a mind is a terrible thing to waste.

[Pargat Perrer]

Arguing with a sock puppet on chesstalk will hardly advance that agenda. Please refer to my admonition about arguing with idiots. Also see Miyamoto Musashi's advice to do nothing which is of no use.

And Neal, yes it is a cesspool.

Ok, I didn't realize we were about to argue, but since you say that, it indicates to me that you are in support of public funding for chess. Which means you are ok with yourself waiting up to 45 hours for medical attention in an ER, as long as there is money to have some high number of titled chess players in Canada.

That is an interesting advice, do nothing which is of no use. Doesn't chess fall into that category? I'm not referring to the learning of chess, but to the dedicating your entire life to it and the funding of it to create titled players. Of what use to humanity is that? Chess should be a side interest only, just as all sports should be amateur only. If we had plenty of doctors, nurses, engineers and scientists, things would be different, but we are too deficient in all of those.

[Vlad Drkulec]

That's ok, Neil, I am sure that the learning of chess does improve math scores. But a dedication to chess instead of to math or science or engineering or medicine / bioscience, that is what I am against. What good are improved math scores if the youth all go into professional chess?

I think chess should be taught, but in a way that says this will improve your thinking skills and visualization, and so use that in your math and science and engineering studies in university and your career, and DO NOT take up chess professionally because it is a waste of your mind, and a mind is a terrible thing to waste.

And that is why you fail, Paul Bonham.

The point is not to make a large number of professional chess players. The point is to prepare you to compete and gain strategic skills in larger areas of life.

Lets look at the girls that competed in the 2013 CYCC under 14 girls in Ottawa.

https://www.chess.ca/en/ratings/t/?i...07028&p=152636

The first place finisher Qiyu Zhou became a world champion one year later. She has published academic papers, she has created courses for chessbase, she has been on our Olympiad team several times and is part of an e-sports team and has an online following.

The second and third place players both from the Windsor area and students in my Friday Chess advanced class Erica Forshaw (also my first or second private student along with now IM Rohan Talukdar who both asked me to coach them privately on the same night) and Rachel Tao (daughter of youth coordinator Christina Tao) went on to gain entry into Canada's best engineering school at the University of Waterloo in chemical engineering and nanotechnology respectively. I believe that both are doing very well. Rachel landed a very nice high paying job in California at one of the tech giants. I haven't talked to Erica or her family lately but I am told that she was doing well also.

Agniya Pobereshnikova (tied for fourth with Ashley Tapp and Kristen Li) also started in engineering at Waterloo and was Rachel Tao's roommate. She later transferred into a program in theoretical physics. So the class of 2013 resulted in one top woman player for Canada and at least three girls that made it into Canada's top engineering school. Engineering (and theoretical physics as well) is a profession that tends to be dominated by men but the girls who compete in chess tend to compete in other areas of life successfully as well.

The story does not end there. Ashley Tapp is a student at the University of Toronto. Kristen Li is at Wharton. Janet Peng may have been at Carnegie Mellon studying chemistry or chemical engineering (though may be mixing her up with her sister Jackie who was recently featured in a documentary that spent a few hours giving background information for).

Minya Bai also from Windsor and a member of our Friday chess class at Sobeys got into McGill university.

For the ones that we have been able to keep track of, there have been excellent results in their academic careers and this is typical of chess players both male and female. There are few poor outcomes in this bunch and in most of the young chess players.

[Hans Jung]

Lovely to see Vlad and thats not the minority. I have similar success stories I could post but the point is well taken.