Don't play with time controls!

[Larry Bevand]

When I use to run adult tournaments, I learned 3 things:

1) People choose to play in your event because...they want to play chess in a well run event..priority number 1.

2) people attract people (success breeds success)

3) don't fool around with time controls!

The Chess'n Math Association (CMA) will kick off publicity on the CMA 2012 Superfest this weekend in Quebec City at the St. Jean tournament. We then go to the CYCC followed by the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open. We will also have our tables set up for the sale of chess books and equipment at these events.

Someone on this board suggested that we use a faster time control so that everyone can take advantage of the resort where the event is being held. The suggested time control was 60 minutes per player with 30 second increments after each move.

The norm in Canada these days (based on the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open this summer) is 40 moves in 90 minutes plus 30 second increment after each move...followed by game 30 with 30 second increment.

If I follow what I thought I (should have) learned in the past...I should go with the latter...did I come to the correct conclusion

Your feedback is appreciated at this stage...before anything is written in stone. If you do not like to post on these boards, please send me an e-mail : bevand@chess-math.org

Thanks!

Larry

[Evan Frangakis]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

Hi Larry,

I think you are absolutely correct. We have to be cautious about this tendency to accelerate games. Based on my experience, anything less than a 2.5 hr max per game/per player is overly quick and takes away from the pleasure (and quality) of the game.

This said, what typically happens at tournaments is that the majority of games tend to end within about 3 hrs. and very few go beyond 4 hrs. This is not excessive for any serious player.

Players who wish to play speed/blitz chess can do so under separate arrangements, if the demand is there.

Good luck with all your projects!

Evan

[Jean Hébert]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

Someone on this board suggested that we use a faster time control so that everyone can take advantage of the resort where the event is being held. The suggested time control was 60 minutes per player with 30 second increments after each move.

The norm in Canada these days (based on the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open this summer) is 40 moves in 90 minutes plus 30 second increment after each move...followed by game 30 with 30 second increment.

If I follow what I thought I (should have) learned in the past...I should go with the latter...did I come to the correct conclusion

Your feedback is appreciated at this stage...before anything is written in stone. If you do not like to post on these boards, please send me an e-mail : bevand@chess-math.org

You are not going to get any kind of consensus on this. Personally I believe that the consistency that should be kept is:
1) two time controls;
2) 40 moves to play for the first time control, not 30 as we now see too much of;
3) 30 seconds increment.

Now the thing left to discuss is the "meat": should it be 90 minutes and 30 min afterwards or 75 min + 30 min, or 60 min + 15 min, or 90 min + 15 min or 75 min + 15 min ? Personally I believe that for "recreational chess" which includes all weekenders, 90 min + 30 min + 30 seconds incrementation is still way too slow for two game a day events. For a one game a day event it is OK.

[Roger Patterson]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

YMMV.

Game/90 + 30 sec works just fine for the Grand Pacific Open with 6 games over 4 days.

From the point of view of a relaxing event, two (potentially) 4 hour games a day is enough for most people :-). Two (potentially) 5 hour games, not so much. (not to mention those 3 game Saturdays) A big problem for many people is that weekend tournaments are so tiring and suck up so much time with no chance to get a proper meal. Insisting on slooow time controls is part of the problem.

In general, I think any time control that is x move in y time followed by a secondary control is passe.

[Fred McKim]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

When I use to run adult tournaments, I learned 3 things:

1) People choose to play in your event because...they want to play chess in a well run event..priority number 1.

2) people attract people (success breeds success)

3) don't fool around with time controls!

The Chess'n Math Association (CMA) will kick off publicity on the CMA 2012 Superfest this weekend in Quebec City at the St. Jean tournament. We then go to the CYCC followed by the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open. We will also have our tables set up for the sale of chess books and equipment at these events.

Someone on this board suggested that we use a faster time control so that everyone can take advantage of the resort where the event is being held. The suggested time control was 60 minutes per player with 30 second increments after each move.

The norm in Canada these days (based on the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open this summer) is 40 moves in 90 minutes plus 30 second increment after each move...followed by game 30 with 30 second increment.

If I follow what I thought I (should have) learned in the past...I should go with the latter...did I come to the correct conclusion

Your feedback is appreciated at this stage...before anything is written in stone. If you do not like to post on these boards, please send me an e-mail : bevand@chess-math.org

Thanks!

Larry

Larry: If you are still thinking of running an unrated tournament, as well, I would run it at G/60.

You could always try running a few of the rounds (choose morning or evening for this option) with a choice of G/60 or 5 hour game.

[Larry Bevand]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

Quality posts to-date! Thanks!

One of my ideas was to give folks the option to play 3 official games from Aug 15-17...in otherwords...we schedule 5 rounds during this period...you can play anywhere from 3-5 games...and you take your top 3 results into the weekend...all games you play are rated...

Comments?

Larry

[Alan Baljeu]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

I'm not one to balk at any time control. Whatever is chosen, I'll go with it. But it's good to standardize. Yet I much prefer the FIDE standard incremental clock, over the flat time or the Bronstein time.

Still, it's good to standardize. According to FIDE, practically all tournaments are played with the following time controls. The per move increment never goes over 30s. It is never 0.

FIDE recommends
Major events
"There is a single time control for all major FIDE events: 90 minutes for the first 40 moves followed by 30 minutes for the rest of the game with an addition of 30 seconds per move starting from move one."

Rapid
4. Each player will have 25 minutes plus 10 seconds per move.

Blitz
8.1. For all competitions each player will have 3 minutes plus 2 seconds per move, starting from move one (G 3’+2”).


Other common time controls
Candidates matches: 120 minutes for the first 40 moves, 60 minutes for the next 20 moves and then 15 minutes for the rest of the game plus an additional 30 seconds per move starting from move 61.

90 min + 30 seconds per move
60 min + 10s (2 games/day)
15 min + 10s
10 min + 10s, then 5 min + 3s (World cup blitz playoff)

[Larry Bevand]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

Other common time controls
Candidates matches: 120 minutes for the first 40 moves, 60 minutes for the next 20 moves and then 15 minutes for the rest of the game plus an additional 30 seconds per move starting from move 61.

90 min + 30 seconds per move
60 min + 10s (2 games/day)
15 min + 10s
10 min + 10s, then 5 min + 3s (World cup blitz playoff)

I have received a lot of feedback on time controls...it is still a hot topic. The one that is gaining popularity is:

Game in 90 minutes with a 30 second increment


The feeling is that this will allow for ample time to play and enjoy the surroundings. Comments are appreciated.

Larry

[Christopher Mallon]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

I've only ever once been in time pressure at 90+30 - but maybe that's just me.

For high-level games you want more so you can see ... a high level game.

I've never been a particularly big fan of the multi time controls as a chess fan - so many grandmaster games have wasted moves from 35-40. However as an arbiter and having done events in 120+30 as well as a multi-control at relatively high level, I'm definitely a fan of the multiple time controls as it tends to actually lead to shorter games.

One particular game I remember from 120+30 was on move 15 at the four hour mark. Then they switched to active mode.

[Roger Patterson]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

I've only ever once been in time pressure at 90+30 - but maybe that's just me.

For high-level games you want more so you can see ... a high level game.

I've never been a particularly big fan of the multi time controls as a chess fan - so many grandmaster games have wasted moves from 35-40. However as an arbiter and having done events in 120+30 as well as a multi-control at relatively high level, I'm definitely a fan of the multiple time controls as it tends to actually lead to shorter games.

One particular game I remember from 120+30 was on move 15 at the four hour mark. Then they switched to active mode.

yeah, there is an issue for single time controls of certain people who will use all of their time as you say to get to move 15. Can be a problem for a quickly moving player who has to wait forever for such an opponent to decide on obvious moves. This can be alleviated by using a longer increment with less initial time [game/80 + 1 minute is very civilized] but this has the drawback for the organizer that it is difficult to determine when the game will end (so as to schedule the next round and/or get out of the facility).

Multi-time controls bring their own problems - all those issues about figuring out if you have made 40 moves or not - or missed a move in your recording so you are actually at 41. Also, I would think a desirable characteristic of a time control is that it not affect the result. If you look in one of the big databases for statistics on length of game, you see a big spike at move 40 - and one can conclude that this is an artifact of the time controls. [also, most games finish by ~move 35 so that a time control at move 30 definately does not make sense.]

[Larry Bevand]

Re: Don't play with time controls!

I really appreciate the feedback!

I will be at the Canadian Open and the Quebec Open this summer...so folks can feel free to chat with me on this issue....and anything else that you want :).

Anyone who says to me...I saw your post on chesstalk...and makes a suggestion...will receive a little token of our appreciation :)

Here is what I am looking for feedback on at this time:

- a 7 round swiss.
- Time control: 40 moves in 90 minutes plus 30 second increment after each move...followed by game 30 with 30 second increment.
- we offer 9 round times in this 7 round event...Wednesday 6pm, Thursday and Friday 10am and 6 pm (You can play anywhere from 3-5 games...all your games are rated...your top 3 results count for the mandatory part of the event...which happens Saturday and Sunday...2 rounds on Saturday at 10 am and 4 pm and Sunday at 10 am and 4 pm....Everyone has to play these rounds....or they can take a 0 point bye.

You can change your mind up to 1 hour before the round as to which games you will play on Wednesday, Thursday or Friday.

Comments please!

Larry