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CCC Discusses Chess - Posts of Interest = Bye in Last Round
Should a bye be allowed in the last round of a chess tournament, provided the bye is requested in advance = before the last round?
The player has an appointment he could not cancel.
Your opinion is needed. Thanks.
Requested in advance = before the start of the tournament, for a half-point bye if allowed under the published rules of the event. But if not, no problem, a zero-point bye also works.
In France, and some other places, there are no half point byes. All requested byes are zero points.
Should a bye be allowed in the last round of a chess tournament, provided the bye is requested in advance = before the last round?
The player has an appointment he could not cancel.
Your opinion is needed. Thanks.
Join us in our discussion board in Facebook.
Definitely not. The last rounds are much harder than the first ones, so it would be quite unfair to see a player winning a prize with a last round bye. Of course, there should be no byes allowed after the start of the tournament...
Re: Re : CCC Discusses Chess - Posts of Interest = Bye in Last Round
Here was organizer John Erickson's rule at the recent Niagara Falls Open:
" Byes: Two 1/2 points available - Rounds 1-3 only. "
Is this too severe? OK?
Certainly John allowed no last round " byes ", according to this. So does it not seem that Erwin could NOT apply for the bye he was requesting in Rd. 5?
Here was organizer John Erickson's rule at the recent Niagara Falls Open:
" Byes: Two 1/2 points available - Rounds 1-3 only. "
Is this too severe? OK?
Certainly John allowed no last round " byes ", according to this. So does it not seem that Erwin could NOT apply for the bye he was requesting in Rd. 5?
Bob
Interesting choice of event to use as an example. I was unable to play in the fifth round, and notified John weeks in advance. His ruling (also in advance) was that I would have to withdraw after four rounds, which I did. Personally, I would have preferred to get a zero point bye; withdrawing in such circumstances just feels odd to me. Obviously my final score would have been the same either way.
Just to be clear, I don't mean to impugn John in any way. I enjoyed playing!
Re: Re : CCC Discusses Chess - Posts of Interest = Bye in Last Round
Can anyone refer us to any FIDE rule on this?
In a FIDE-rated tournament, can the organizer offer a 1/2 pt. " bye " in the last round of a tournament ( generally with the restriction that the bye must be requested before the start of the first round )?
Bob
Last edited by Bob Armstrong; Thursday, 19th April, 2012, 12:43 AM.
Requested in advance = before the start of the tournament, for a half-point bye if allowed under the published rules of the event. But if not, no problem, a zero-point bye also works.
In France, and some other places, there are no half point byes. All requested byes are zero points.
That's very true as I just found out when I entered the www.lucopen.fr
To tell you the truth I think it's a better system.
In a FIDE-rated tournament, can the organizer offer a 1/2 pt. " bye " in the last round of a tournament ( generally with the restriction that the bye must be requested before the start of the first round )?
I found only a rule for the first rounds:
"if the player's notified time of arrival is in time only for the start of the second (or third) round, then the player is not paired for the rounds which he cannot play. Instead, he receives no points for unplayed rounds," http://www.fide.com/fide/handbook.ht...3&view=article
Posted on the Cooperative Chess Coalition ( CCC ) FB chess discussion group, " CCC - Chess Posts of Interest ", by Joe Fatula, USA tournament organizer/director, and CCC member:
" this isn’t the definitive answer - insufficient time to research at the moment. Being a member of the USCF I did review an announcement for the upcoming World Open--which has historically been among the best attended of the open Swiss tournaments. It’s held yearly in America usually in Philadelphia--one of the largest cities in America.
It states that half point byes are available for all rounds. In the Open section they must be requested before Round 2; in other sections the deadline is before Round 4. This suggests at least the possibility of a FIDE rule situation ....
The tournament has a history of many international players in the Open section. In the past players have received ratings and earned FIDE norms. "
Bob, CCC Coordinator
Last edited by Bob Armstrong; Thursday, 19th April, 2012, 11:53 AM.
Posted on the Cooperative Chess Coalition ( CCC ) FB chess discussion group, " CCC - Chess Posts of Interest ", by Joe Fatula, USA tournament organizer/director, and CCC member:
" this isn’t the definitive answer - insufficient time to research at the moment. Being a member of the USCF I did review an announcement for the upcoming World Open--which has historically been among the best attended of the open Swiss tournaments. It’s held yearly in America usually in Philadelphia--one of the largest cities in America.
It states that half point byes are available for all rounds. In the Open section they must be requested before Round 2; in other sections the deadline is before Round 4. This suggests at least the possibility of a FIDE rule situation ....
The tournament has a history of many international players in the Open section. In the past players have received ratings and earned FIDE norms. "
Bob, CCC Coordinator
Chesstour tournaments, including the World Open, are probably the worst example you can find. For instance, you can hear lots of cellphone ringings, a lot of people talking , etc. People play in these events for the prizes or for the experience, definitely not for the professionalism of the tournaments. I've seen the arbiters do inconceivable things such as pairing together people from different sections and changing some pairings after the games started...
They even write their games in notebooks, consult the other games and write their moves before they play them! Definitely, the U.S. should not be a good example of how a tournament should be organized...
The fact that the World Open allows last round byes was widely discussed not so long ago, and many people criticized this practice...
Here was organizer John Erickson's rule at the recent Niagara Falls Open:
" Byes: Two 1/2 points available - Rounds 1-3 only. "
Is this too severe? OK?
Certainly John allowed no last round " byes ", according to this. So does it not seem that Erwin could NOT apply for the bye he was requesting in Rd. 5?
Bob
Bob ;
The reason for the byes only in Rds 1-3 was that the time control was faster and a feww do not like playing three games in one day.
John Erickson actually took byes in Rd 4 & 5 to accomodate odd # of players and he received 0 pt byes.
Our tournaments are small and giving a person a bye in the fourth round would case lots of complaints so we won't do it.
Also if Ewrin was worried about the last Round he should not have been as 4 Points won First.
I think sometimes players want to get optimum deals for no consideration for other players. So a 5 Rd allows 2 Byes we just choose where they go.
I was unable to play in the fifth round, and notified John weeks in advance. His ruling (also in advance) was that I would have to withdraw after four rounds, which I did. Personally, I would have preferred to get a zero point bye; withdrawing in such circumstances just feels odd to me. Obviously my final score would have been the same either way.
Just to be clear, I don't mean to impugn John in any way. I enjoyed playing!
There is a difference between a zero-point bye and withdrawing. A player who withdraws is not eligible to win a prize. That is why a player who has 5-0 can't just take his prize instead of having to play one of those tied for second with 3.5-1.5 in the last round of a 6-round Swiss. Given that you had advised in advance of the tournament, withdrawing you was rather strict of the TD.
The half-point requested bye concept is very North American, you'd want to explain it carefully to an arbiter from elsewhere in the world, as noted earlier. And some North American organizers do not allow it at all, which is perfectly their right, too.
Re: CCC Discusses Chess - Posts of Interest = Bye in Last Round
I actually did give Walter De Jong a zero point bye for the last round. I didn't withdraw him as I said. I realized that would be the right way to go. Sorry for any confusion this may have caused.
I was the floater for the tournament. I received .5 for any rounds I didn't play in the first 3 rounds and zero point byes for rounds 4 and 5. Every tournament I have played has stated that you would receive zero point byes for the last round and sometimes for the last two or more rounds, depending on the length of the tournament. If you are scheduled for a bye because of an odd number of players, then you receive a 1 point bye. I have seen this give someone a prize because of sub sectional prizes. I don't think that is fair and that is why I am the floater in the tournament.
A 5-round swiss tournament advertised, " no byes after Rd. 3; byes to be requested prior to start of Rd. 1 ".
You are the TD, and before the 5 round swiss starts, Player Z asked for a Rd. 5 " bye " of either 1/2 or 0 points, but said under no circumstances would he accept being treated as withdrawing ( = " U " on the crosstable, rather than 1/2 or 0 ). Player Z threatens not to play if you give him a " U ". What would you do?
Are there any different consequences if you treat it one way or the other? In other words, for example, is there any difference if you put " 0 " under Rd. 5 on the crosstable, to indicate a " last round bye " OR if you put " U ", to indicate a " last round withdrawal "?
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