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Or every square on a file occupied (e.g. Giuoco Piano types of positions on the c-file, and Colle-like positions on the f-file).
Are there any other positions that arose in actual games in which all the squares of the h1-a8 diagonal, or all squares of any file (other than the c or f-files) are occupied? (all squares on a rank are occupied many times besides the initial position) Probably there is a searching algorithm in Chessbase to do this, but I couldn't see one.
Or every square on a file occupied (e.g. Giuoco Piano types of positions on the c-file, and Colle-like positions on the f-file).
Are there any other positions that arose in actual games in which all the squares of the h1-a8 diagonal, or all squares of any file (other than the c or f-files) are occupied? (all squares on a rank are occupied many times besides the initial position) Probably there is a searching algorithm in Chessbase to do this, but I couldn't see one.
If I understand what you mean, Chess Assistant (since at least v 9 I believe)has this capability in their very powerful search.
For the h1-a8 diagonal, it found 234,000 games is less than 2 minutes
out of 4.2 million games.
a-file 255 games eg Romanishin -Howell Wijk 2009 move 21
b-file 263 games eg Romanishin-Cabrilo Lvov 1981 move 20
(would you like just Oleg games ? :))
c- has 34,445 games (Oleg has been White thrice, Black 3 times)
Or every square on a file occupied (e.g. Giuoco Piano types of positions on the c-file, and Colle-like positions on the f-file).
Are there any other positions that arose in actual games in which all the squares of the h1-a8 diagonal, or all squares of any file (other than the c or f-files) are occupied? (all squares on a rank are occupied many times besides the initial position) Probably there is a searching algorithm in Chessbase to do this, but I couldn't see one.
If I understand what you mean, Chess Assistant (since at least v 9 I believe)has this capability in their very powerful search.
For the h1-a8 diagonal, it found 234,000 games is less than 2 minutes
out of 4.2 million games.
a-file 255 games eg Romanishin -Howell Wijk 2009 move 21
b-file 263 games eg Romanishin-Cabrilo Lvov 1981 move 20
(would you like just Oleg games ? :))
c- has 34,445 games (Oleg has been White thrice, Black 3 times)
a-file 255 games eg Romanishin -Howell Wijk 2009 move 21
b-file 263 games eg Romanishin-Cabrilo Lvov 1981 move 20
(would you like just Oleg games ? :))
c- has 34,445 games (Oleg has been White thrice, Black 3 times)
Each search took <2 minutes
How about any games in which all squares on BOTH diagonals (a1 to h8, h1 to a8) are occupied?
Or how about any games in which all squares on 2 consecutive files are occupied (i.e. c and d files)?
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
How about any games in which all squares on BOTH diagonals (a1 to h8, h1 to a8) are occupied?
Or how about any games in which all squares on 2 consecutive files are occupied (i.e. c and d files)?
I had run the both diagonals, but it wasn't too rare (can't recall the exact number at the moment), including Marshall-Capablanca, NY 1927. Consecutive files - I will look at that sometime - I expect that to be rare.
I had run the both diagonals, but it wasn't too rare (can't recall the exact number at the moment), including Marshall-Capablanca, NY 1927. Consecutive files - I will look at that sometime - I expect that to be rare.
both diagonals - 1440
d file - 21432
e-15822
f-37455
g - 14139 !
h-345
I didn't find any consecutive files, but I did find this where I suspect the girls were having some fun.
[Event "Ch Ukraine"]
[Site "Chernigov (Ukraine)"]
[Date "2005.4.4"]
[Round "11"]
[White "Pokotilo Marina"]
[Black "Ivanenko Olga (UKR)"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[Eco "D02"]
I didn't find any consecutive files, but I did find this where I suspect the girls were having some fun.
[Event "Ch Ukraine"]
[Site "Chernigov (Ukraine)"]
[Date "2005.4.4"]
[Round "11"]
[White "Pokotilo Marina"]
[Black "Ivanenko Olga (UKR)"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[Eco "D02"]
You're welcome. What's interesting also is that there is no way from the standard opening position to achieve 3 files (consecutive or not) all occupied by pieces / pawns. This would require 24 total pieces, meaning (with material balanced) 12 per side. That means each side would have 4 pieces / pawns not on the 3 files. But in the standard opening position, if you eliminate any 3 files, each side would have 5 pawns not on the 3 files. There is no way to get the pawns to one of the 3 files without capturing an opposing piece / pawn, which defeats the purpose in this case.
Of course, if someone was REALLY creative, they could concoct a game in which each side allowed an opposing pawn to reach the 8th rank, thus promoting to Queen (or even better, a Knight). To do this, they'd each have to allow the opposing pawn to capture one of their pawns. Once it's promoted to a Knight, it can then occupy one of the 3 files. But obviously, such a game would be pure fantasy designed to get 3 files totally occupied, but at least it would demonstrate that it COULD be done using purely legal chess moves from the starting position.
Perhaps someday at a tournament in Quebec, in the last round, 2 players will agree beforehand on a draw, then sit down at the board next to Jean Hebert and play these moves, and in this position shake hands for the draw. They'll have a video camera recording Hebert's reaction as he watches the game!
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
You're welcome. What's interesting also is that there is no way from the standard opening position to achieve 3 files (consecutive or not) all occupied by pieces / pawns. This would require 24 total pieces, meaning (with material balanced) 12 per side. That means each side would have 4 pieces / pawns not on the 3 files. But in the standard opening position, if you eliminate any 3 files, each side would have 5 pawns not on the 3 files. There is no way to get the pawns to one of the 3 files without capturing an opposing piece / pawn, which defeats the purpose in this case.
Of course, if someone was REALLY creative, they could concoct a game in which each side allowed an opposing pawn to reach the 8th rank, thus promoting to Queen (or even better, a Knight). To do this, they'd each have to allow the opposing pawn to capture one of their pawns. Once it's promoted to a Knight, it can then occupy one of the 3 files. But obviously, such a game would be pure fantasy designed to get 3 files totally occupied, but at least it would demonstrate that it COULD be done using purely legal chess moves from the starting position.
Perhaps someday at a tournament in Quebec, in the last round, 2 players will agree beforehand on a draw, then sit down at the board next to Jean Hebert and play these moves, and in this position shake hands for the draw. They'll have a video camera recording Hebert's reaction as he watches the game!
Or maybe you could start to market a chess variant where the initial starting positions are replaced by the pieces placed on both first ranks and the a and h file... extra pieces can be placed somewhere else by a roll of dice... and ...
Bonham Randam Chess
Or maybe you could start to market a chess variant where the initial starting positions are replaced by the pieces placed on both first ranks and the a and h file... extra pieces can be placed somewhere else by a roll of dice... and ...
Bonham Randam Chess
YESSS! And I'll convince Ontario schools to teach it in the regular school curriculum. Jean Hebert, if you read this, respond with the probabilities of rolling, with 2 normal six-sided die, each possible sum from 2 to 12, and if you're correct, you will become the first Certified Professor of BRC.
Imagine! It's BRC -- a game! -- instead of math or science!
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
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