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I was wondering what the playoff procedure for the four-way playoffs in U12 and U16. Specifically, if the playoffs are single-elimination do 3rd/4th play off for the Pan Am spot, for example?
Also, what exactly are the prizes. I heard mention that first is the all-expense paid trip to the WYCC, 2nd is some supplemental support for the 2014 NAYCC(?), third is the Pan Am spot (which gets you free room/board but not travel?).
Thanks.
"Tom is a well known racist, and like most of them he won't admit it, possibly even to himself." - Ed Seedhouse, October 4, 2020.
The playoff info is online as of a few hours ago; you can find it here.
It would have been up much earlier, but I got sucked into a very long appeals procedure, and wasn't free until after 11pm. (some details here)
As I understand it (maybe not well) the usual prizes are funding for the WYCC.
But we expect to contribute over $35,000 to the CFC, and some of us [me included] think we have good reason to attach some "strings" to that.
Here's one reason for "strings": there are members of the organizing committee this year who are still pissed off that so much of the money generated for the CFC from the 2007 CYCC in Ottawa went to the Karpov visit to Toronto, rather than to either travel expense or something of more obvious merit for youth chess. Of course, money is fungible, so it's not possible to show which dollar went where, but AFAIK it's a fact that the huge profit-generating 2007 CYCC was followed by the One Time Only Very Expensive Visit by Former World Champion Anatoly Karpov; and IMHO this is reason enough to link them as cause and effect.
[Disclaimer: I was not part of the 2007 CYCC/CO in Ottawa, and didn't pay any attention to CFC finances until I got hired as CCN editor in March, so I don't have any special knowledge or feelings about this affair, but someone I trust who was involved still calls it a "boondoggle".]
One possible sort of condition would be to earmark the $$ for particular purposes: e.g. 80% WYCC, 10% Pan-Ams, 5% NAYCC, and 5%...?
One possible problem with this is that it might be unconstitutional or illegal. (I have no idea about this, but would guess that we can't :()
Assuming it is possible to earmark/attach conditions to the 2013 CYCC $$, it would be very nice to hear some ideas about how you want to spend it; preferably from the parents who actually paid for their kids to come to the CYCC. It's not our money, and it's not (yet) the CFC's.
I'm not so savvy, but I suspect that if the CFC Govs want more financial windfalls like the 2013CYCC seems set to become, it would be a Really Good Idea to find out what the parents and players want done with all that money. (again, I don't know all that much about CFC or CYCC hsitory: maybe the CFC has done recent detailed surveys about what the CYCC players and parents want)
I think it's fair to say that our goal for the 2013CYCC was to create an event that would both:
1) identify the top player(s) in each age group, and
2) generate a Big Pile of Money for the CFC and (in particular) the WYCC contestants.
I think it could be argued that in some sections with very large tiebreak groups, the 2103CYCC will not convincingly identify a uniquely best player. I'm not sure I'd find those argument convincing, since the very existence of ties for 1st place is evidence that no player is clearly superior, and a completely fair system would actually produce ties among equally strong players. OTOH, even with a seventh round, it is very likely there would still be a tie between two players, and that tie would have to be settled by a Rapid play-off.
One way we did #2 is by cutting back on lots of expenses (e.g. no FIDE rated sections = no FIDE rating-fees + no FIDE-certified arbiter expenses).
Personally, I think the 2013CYCC would have been more fun if we'd spent more of that $$ here, rather than saving it to give to the CFC. But then, everybody likes to spend other people's money on their own fun.
Thanks for the info. I find it strange that the players are fighting for unknown prizes for 2nd and 3rd. Will they be told what they are fighting for before the matches? I take it there will be no consolation match to determine 3rd/4th position? Also, what tiebreak is being used to determine 3rd place in the U12G?
Sorry, found one more question to ask: how are the tiebreak matchups determined? Lot? SB tiebreak? Rating?
"Tom is a well known racist, and like most of them he won't admit it, possibly even to himself." - Ed Seedhouse, October 4, 2020.
The bid specified that the organizers will keep $75 per entry, so shouldn't we expect a payment of something like $150*200 + $175*75 (late entries)= $43 k (approximative)?
Usually all the money received goes to the WYCC fund (for this year or the next to come). It is rarely enough to cover for the expenses, but it might be enough this year (as the amount is high). Everything will depend on how much cost the flights.
There is usually no money prize or much financial support for the Pan-Ams and NAYCC (beside the free board provided to the official representative). However, in the past, organizers have offered bursaries with the profit they made out of their $75 per entry (which represents a lot of money). I believe Toronto 2011 was extremely generous at this level.
To be honest, John, I'm no more comfortable than you in seeing a lot of money go to the CFC, but I don't think you can legally give any conditions now that the bid was accepted.
For instance, the bid for the 2014 CYCC in Montreal has set some conditions, but these had to be specified well in advance. I don't want to give any details as of now, as the bid has not been accepted yet, but it would involve the creation of a temporary Canadian youth fund with the profit from the $75 and some of the registration fees if there is a lot of them, as for the 2013 CYCC.
In any case, congratulations for giving nearly $45 000 to our Canadian Champions, so they can represent us in Al-Ain :)
Last edited by Felix Dumont; Saturday, 13th July, 2013, 09:00 AM.
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