A protest to Nigel Haranham

[Sid Belzberg]

Nigel I find your "memoriam" to the tragic deaths of a journalist that recently were caught in gun fire in the Ukraine conflict and your subsequent comments that somehow attempt to link this to Kasparov's advocacy of a regime that supposedly condones murder as a pathetic and disingenuous attempt to discredit Gary as well as the Ukraine Government.

If you think this is anyway comparable to my post about two aides very close to KI that brutally stab to death a journalist who just happens to publish opposition literature to KI's regime you are very mistaken. I've read about protests during KI's regime from hungry mothers in Kalmykia unable to feed their children while millions were spent on chess palaces. However, some here choose to debate whether starvation was a reality in Kalmykia when they clearly have not even researched the evidence.

I suspect you are trying to compare my memoriam of the premeditated murder of Yudina to what appears to be a tragic casualty in a battle zone. Someone like you who can make a distinction between the two ( but choose not to in order to promote your political arguments) and other's here who refuse to recognize evil when they see it and try to make weak excuses and arguments without even thinking about or researching the facts (ie Starvation in Kalmykia under KI) truly disgust me.

Since you are a moderator on this board I no longer will be posting here. You make a mockery of all that is good and you are not worthy of being a moderator on this forum. Enough is enough.

[Nigel Hanrahan]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Since you are a moderator on this board I no longer will be posting here. You make a mockery of all that is good and you are not worthy of being a moderator on this forum. Enough is enough.

Since I am moderator and fair as I can be (in my own eyes) your tirade can stand and we can let others form their own opinions on the matter. You are welcome back to express your opinion about all matters relating to chess, including saying what an awful moderator I am, if and when you decide to do so.

...........................................

A sizable number of those participating in Vlad's survey treated Kirsan and Garry as much the same, which I think is fair. Kasparov couldn't get elected Dog Catcher in Russia and, while his place in chess history is assured, I don't see any evidence that he'll be any better an administrator than the incumbent. If it was up to me, I would no more vote for Kasparov than for the late Bobby Fischer as FIDE President. Let the CFC decision-making bodies decide what is in the best interest of chess in Canada and let the chips fall where they may. I have to admit that what I saw as a rather excessively vicious attack on the CFC President by supporters of Kasparov's candidacy here on this Discussion Board made me immediately suspicious of such attacks. Vlad was, however, quite capable of arguing his own points and didn't need my help. Whatever way the CFC votes he seems to me to be the sort of calm under fire kind of person we could use at the CFC and I hope that your difference with him on this issue doesn't prevent you from working with him on other issues.

The International Olympic Committee (IOC), FIFA (the governing body for soccer), and FIDE should probably be compared for corruption and awfulness. They're much the same, only the sums of money vary. And they all kill people. [That doesn't make it right. But let's use chess criteria to evaluate chess issues. Politics tends to poison sports and do them harm.]Even the Olympics in Vancouver had a controversial death that was swept under the rug.

[Steve Douglas]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

I am no fan of Nigel, particularly with respect to his politics, and I have had some issues with his moderation style.

But to you, this is clearly personal somehow. Also, I have always made it a point to spell people's names properly whether I agree with them or not. It is a basic sign of basic respect.

With respect to your various posts about things that are far away from Canada, and about which most, average CFC members would have little information, it is clear you want to bully the CFC into voting a certain way regarding FIDE.

The CFC's vote should not be determined by whether or not a previous sponsor would return if the CFC votes a certain way.

That's the irony that Vlad was speaking about.

Steve

[Sid Belzberg]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

I am no fan of Nigel, particularly with respect to his politics, and I have had some issues with his moderation style.

But to you, this is clearly personal somehow. Also, I have always made it a point to spell people's names properly whether I agree with them or not. It is a basic sign of basic respect.

With respect to your various posts about things that are far away from Canada, and about which most, average CFC members would have little information, it is clear you want to bully the CFC into voting a certain way regarding FIDE.

The CFC's vote should not be determined by whether or not a previous sponsor would return if the CFC votes a certain way.

That's the irony that Vlad was speaking about.

Steve

Steve,
Thank you for your thoughtful reply. You bring up an interesting point. The notion that I am "bullying the CFC". Vlad also brought up a point earlier that even if the CFC votes for Gary it is unlikely he will win so why bother? Here are some reasons.

1) I was on the board for many years of the Kasparov Chess foundation whose mission in life is to make chess part of the curriculum in public schools around the world. I am sure that this foundation could complement existing organizations in Canada and do some great work here in Canada. i attended some master classes Gary had with talented youth in America and they were a magnificent experience for these kids. This type of outcome would be irrespective of who wins the FIDE election. Assuming of course that the CFC endorses Gary.

2) It would not surprise me at all if KI and others (some of KIs cronies are already on the list) end up on the EU and US sanctions list that could result in FIDE not having funding at all. I am sure you noticed that no funding is available for the World Chess Championship match between Anand and Carlsen. This in my estimation will only get worst and I am already even seeing that the Olympiad is having funding problems.

We made the CFC well aware that Governmental bodies outside of chess organizations take the matter of Gary's support in his FIDE bid very seriously. Hence I consider the scenario very possible and it would not be good for chess in Canada or any where else in the world. You need to keep in mind that well substantiated allegations of politically motivated murder a regime notorious for its corruption as well as KI's continued close relationship with Russian governmental authorities does not help him in the eyes of the EU or USA. This to us is a very possible scenario and absolutely it should be viewed as a threat to FIDE itself and hence to chess organizations around the world including the CFC.

So in short I think significant benefits accrue to chess in Canada regardless of who wins the FIDE election but I also believe it is absolutely vital that Canada remain on the right side of history in the eventuality that FIDE fails and Canada needs all the allies it can get in picking up the pieces for a new international chess organization.

[Sasha Starr]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Steve,
Thank you for your thoughtful reply. You bring up an interesting point. The notion that I am "bullying the CFC". Vlad also brought up a point earlier that even if the CFC votes for Gary it is unlikely he will win so why bother? Here are some reasons.

1) I was on the board for many years of the Kasparov Chess foundation whose mission in life is to make chess part of the curriculum in public schools around the world. I am sure that this foundation could complement existing organizations in Canada and do some great work here in Canada. i attended some master classes Gary had with talented youth in America and they were a magnificent experience for these kids. This type of outcome would be irrespective of who wins the FIDE election. Assuming of course that the CFC endorses Gary.

2) It would not surprise me at all if KI and others (some of KIs cronies are already on the list) end up on the EU and US sanctions list that could result in FIDE not having funding at all. I am sure you noticed that no funding is available for the World Chess Championship match between Anand and Carlsen. This in my estimation will only get worst and I am already even seeing that the Olympiad is having funding problems.

We made the CFC well aware that Governmental bodies outside of chess organizations take the matter of Gary's support in his FIDE bid very seriously. Hence I consider the scenario very possible and it would not be good for chess in Canada or any where else in the world. You need to keep in mind that well substantiated allegations of politically motivated murder a regime notorious for its corruption as well as KI's continued close relationship with Russian governmental authorities does not help him in the eyes of the EU or USA. This to us is a very possible scenario and absolutely it should be viewed as a threat to FIDE itself and hence to chess organizations around the world including the CFC.

So in short I think significant benefits accrue to chess in Canada regardless of who wins the FIDE election but I also believe it is absolutely vital that Canada remain on the right side of history in the eventuality that FIDE fails and Canada needs all the allies it can get in picking up the pieces for a new international chess organization.

I have a scheduled meeting tomorrow to raise an issue of having Canada to add KI to the sunctions' list. As a minimum I want the following. 85% of the Russians are supporting Putin, including his annexation of the Krimea. Illumzhinov and BTW the members of Russian National teams must make public statements that THEY ARE NOT SUPPORTING PUTIN. Otherwaise Canada must NOT have any dealings with these people.

[Sasha Starr]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Since I am moderator and fair as I can be (in my own eyes) your tirade can stand and we can let others form their own opinions on the matter. You are welcome back to express your opinion about all matters relating to chess, including saying what an awful moderator I am, if and when you decide to do so.

...........................................

A sizable number of those participating in Vlad's survey treated Kirsan and Garry as much the same, which I think is fair. Kasparov couldn't get elected Dog Catcher in Russia and, while his place in chess history is assured, I don't see any evidence that he'll be any better an administrator than the incumbent. If it was up to me, I would no more vote for Kasparov than for the late Bobby Fischer as FIDE President. Let the CFC decision-making bodies decide what is in the best interest of chess in Canada and let the chips fall where they may. I have to admit that what I saw as a rather excessively vicious attack on the CFC President by supporters of Kasparov's candidacy here on this Discussion Board made me immediately suspicious of such attacks. Vlad was, however, quite capable of arguing his own points and didn't need my help. Whatever way the CFC votes he seems to me to be the sort of calm under fire kind of person we could use at the CFC and I hope that your difference with him on this issue doesn't prevent you from working with him on other issues.

The International Olympic Committee (IOC), FIFA (the governing body for soccer), and FIDE should probably be compared for corruption and awfulness. They're much the same, only the sums of money vary. And they all kill people. [That doesn't make it right. But let's use chess criteria to evaluate chess issues. Politics tends to poison sports and do them harm.]Even the Olympics in Vancouver had a controversial death that was swept under the rug.

As a moderator you should have not be allowed to put ANY posts at all.
And if you feel that you have to influence public here, and owners of the site allow it, then read this: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2014/04...n_5192863.html
I'm not getting it: is CFC a Canadian organization or WHAT? How is it possible that CFC's executive's point of view is 100% the opposite from one of the rest of Canada?

[Steve Douglas]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

As a moderator you should have not be allowed to put ANY posts at all.

Not even to respond to a *thread* naming him?

Ah, yes. Censorship. Freedom of idiocy and all that.

And who are you exactly??

Steve

[Sasha Starr]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Not even to respond to a *thread* naming him?

Ah, yes. Censorship. Freedom of idiocy and all that.

And who are you exactly??

Steve

With all due respect. If you don't know who I am, you probably don't need to know it.

"What Putin has done in east Ukraine will backfire, perhaps immediately. World public opinion may be inattentive, but everyone in Europe and North America detests bullying, election abuse, and intimidation. Such images do not sit well with the civilized world. Putin can continue to play his “I am not responsible” game, but it will not find a receptive audience". from Forbs: http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulrode...-the-election/
What I'd like to understand is this: is Canada a part of North America? And is CFC a part of Canada? Anybody could answer? Get out in the open, stop hiding!

[Steve Douglas]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

With all due respect. If you don't know who I am, you probably don't need to know it.

It was a simple question.

And I do know how to spell TROLL.

Steve

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Could you please clarify this statement? Are you saying that Canada should boycott playing in the Olympiad if Russia plays? Or just not play the Russians if we are paired against them? Should all members of the Canadian team also make a declaration on this matter? What about members of other teams? Who are the people we aren't dealing with and what constitutes dealing with them?

I have a scheduled meeting tomorrow to raise an issue of having Canada to add KI to the sunctions' list. As a minimum I want the following. 85% of the Russians are supporting Putin, including his annexation of the Krimea. Illumzhinov and BTW the members of Russian National teams must make public statements that THEY ARE NOT SUPPORTING PUTIN. Otherwaise Canada must NOT have any dealings with these people.

[Sasha Starr]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

According to Vlad Dobrich I won an A prize in his 15 min. tournament held last Saturday in Toronto. A CFC Member, nominated to become a voting member. Would that satisfy you?

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Not even to respond to a *thread* naming him?

Ah, yes. Censorship. Freedom of idiocy and all that.

And who are you exactly??

Steve

Meet the future class A voting member from Toronto who apparently can't read very well or possibly refuses to read and expects me to explain step by step how he can lead a coup against the CFC for Garry. This is what happens when you let someone else run for CFC governor because you can't be bothered. I expect hilarity to ensue but not necessarily in a good way. Michael and Sasha the pointy haired bosses of the CFC.

I do not believe the Harper people are stupid so I don't expect Sasha's efforts to go very far. Though this is the level of insanity that the GK camp seems to be lurching towards. Don't look for salvation from our chess idols. They have feet of clay. As Nigel said Garry couldn't be elected dog catcher in Russia. There is a reason for that.

[Sasha Starr]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Could you please clarify this statement? Are you saying that Canada should boycott playing in the Olympiad if Russia plays? Or just not play the Russians if we are paired against them? Should all members of the Canadian team also make a declaration on this matter? What about members of other teams? Who are the people we aren't dealing with and what constitutes dealing with them?

As you know France under the liedership of Alexandre Alekhine refused to play Germany in the 1939 Chess Olympiad after Germany has started its invasion and annexation of other countries. Which is exactly what Russia is doing today. Therefore I would recomment that Canadian Team (its captain) will be assured that the Russian players will make a statement that they disagree with the annexation carried by Putin. And if they don't, it means that they are Putin's supporters, and Canada has to refuse playing them. Same thing applies to KI.

[Tom O'Donnell]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

Thanks for the clarification. An observation: many teams have players born in Russia on them. Shall we require that all of these players make similar statements or is it a requirement that the players be living in Russia? So, for example, if Kramnik is on the Russian team but lives in France much of the time, would he have to make a statement? And what about non-Russians who approve of what Putin is doing? And what if the Canadian team itself decides that they want to play the Russians anyway and over-rule their captain?

I am not unsympathetic to what you are proposing but it seems to me the mechanics are very complicated. Or perhaps I am over-thinking this?

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: A protest to Nigel Haranham

As you know France under the liedership of Alexandre Alekhine refused to play Germany in the 1939 Chess Olympiad after Germany has started its invasion and annexation of other countries. Which is exactly what Russia is doing today. Therefore I would recomment that Canadian Team (its captain) will be assured that the Russian players will make a statement that they disagree with the annexation carried by Putin. And if they don't, it means that they are Putin's supporters, and Canada has to refuse playing them. Same thing applies to KI.

Are you nuts?