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Yes Sid I did. Perhaps you noticed that were a lot of other paragraphs that came before it. Those paragraphs were generally negative and in some cases very negative about Kasparov and the way he treats people. It described the exact behaviour described by the CFC Executive that offended them. It cited in particular the black and white thinking of the Kasparov camp in the way it treats people: if you are not supporting us, you must be the enemy (paraphrasing).
I think the overall article gave a good summation of what went wrong with the Kasparov campaign. It's certainly less hysteria-driven than some of the stuff on Spraggett's site (or here).
Steve
P.S. There is a difference between having good ideas and being the right person to implement them.
Yes Sid I did. Perhaps you noticed that were a lot of other paragraphs that came before it. Those paragraphs were generally negative and in some cases very negative about Kasparov and the way he treats people. It described the exact behaviour described by the CFC Executive that offended them. It cited in particular the black and white thinking of the Kasparov camp in the way it treats people: if you are not supporting us, you must be the enemy (paraphrasing).
I think the overall article gave a good summation of what went wrong with the Kasparov campaign. It's certainly less hysteria-driven than some of the stuff on Spraggett's site (or here).
Steve
P.S. There is a difference between having good ideas and being the right person to implement them.
The good ideas have been and are being implemented world wide through the Kasparov Chess Foundation and Garry has done a fantastic job in implementing them, assembling a world class group of sponsors along the way.
If you think Garry is not the right person to beat a corrupt system who's sole sponsor is now the worlds leading Asshole...Mr Vladimir Putin, I think that is true. Ask Mr Carlsen what he thinks about the next world championship happening in Sochi courtesy of Vladimir Putin. If you want to go to the word class chess centre in St Louis sponsored by Mr Sinquefeld you will see Magnus there in a few weeks participating in the strongest chess tournament in history courtesy of Western sponsors.
I did read it. You made the unsupported claim that the article was pro-Kasparov. It wasn't. Further, I didn't suggest that the article, or Crouch's viewpoint, was pro-Kirsan. As far as I know, Crouch is generally quite anti-Kirsan.
Steve
If there are only 2 candidates in the election, and if the author of the article
(a) does not mention any 3rd candidate that he, the author, would prefer to see running,
(b) does not mention that anyone should abstain,
(c) does mention that he, the author, is more anti-Kirsan
(d) goes out of his way to mention twice that Kasparov has ambitious ideas that seem to make sense for the future of chess
then in terms of the FIDE Presidency and the future of chess, which is the context of the article, both the article and the author are pro-Kasparov.
All of the criticisms he has of Kasparov and his campaign team have to do either with the distant past (PCA) or have to do with matters political. Remember, the author wrote "perceived arrogance", not "actual arrogance", and pinned this on parts of the Kasparov campaign, not Kasparov himself.
The author is obviously not so naive as to expect a perfect candidate for FIDE President. The mere presence of criticisms of Kasparov doesn't make either the article nor the author anti-Kasparov in the context of the FIDE Presidency. It merely points out Kasparov's imperfections.
Will you nit-pick further? Maybe you'll start arguing nouns and verbs again?
Last edited by Paul Bonham; Saturday, 16th August, 2014, 11:43 PM.
Reason: Kasparov's imperfections
Only the rushing is heard...
Onward flies the bird.
Two participants in the Olympiad have passed away; Kurt Meier (SEY) died from a heart attack and Alisher Anarkulov (hearing impaired team and from UZB) from natural causes. The breathless reports have been accompanied by unrelated denunciations of the FIDE Presidential election winner, Kirsan Ilyumzhinov, presumably to associate Kirsan with the deaths of the two players.
So the ugly politics continues. FIDE has been denounced for not expressing condolences quickly enough. On it goes.
Can we expect expensive and frivolous anti-FIDE litigation to follow?
Last edited by Nigel Hanrahan; Monday, 18th August, 2014, 02:45 PM.
Dogs will bark, but the caravan of chess moves on.
More follow-up. The Norwegian Chess Federation has sent a letter to the Russian Chess Federation (RCF) and their national team apologizing for (their role in) the situation in which the Russian women's national team were prohibited from playing in the Olympiad.
"In a letter sent to the RCF, the Olympiad organizers expressed regret that this misunderstanding could have affected the preparation of the Russian chess players. The authors of the letter congratulated the Russian national team on its victory and expressed hope for further fruitful cooperation.
For its part, the RCF accepted the apologies of the Olympiad organizers. Thus, the conflict that arose just before the start of the tournament may be regarded as fully resolved."
Andrei Filatov, RCF President, noted ...
Originally posted by A. Filatov
“We are grateful to ... [our legal team]. Together we established a legal precedent that will serve as a good lesson in the future. Chess players from any national team must be confident that they are protected, while chess officials must act in strict accordance with legal norms and avoid arbitrariness. I would also like to say thank you to everyone who supported the Russian chess players in this situation during the competition. I am grateful to officials and rank and file representatives from the national federations of the United States, Canada, France, and many other countries for their kind words and moral support that we experienced over the course of all the difficult and tense days of the Olympiad.
I think things will return to normal. The only people who wanted to see the Russian women excluded were some misguided members of the Kasparov campaign including the illustrious genius at the helm. Fortunately good sense prevailed thanks to the leadership of Kirsan Ilyumzhinov who reached out to the Tromso organizers in the right way at the right moment. Its good to have someone with some skill in diplomacy at the helm of FIDE.
For all the haters out there how could you be against letting the Russian women play and defend their title?
I think things will return to normal. The only people who wanted to see the Russian women excluded were some misguided members of the Kasparov campaign including the illustrious genius at the helm. Fortunately good sense prevailed thanks to the leadership of Kirsan Ilyumzhinov who reached out to the Tromso organizers in the right way at the right moment. Its good to have someone with some skill in diplomacy at the helm of FIDE.
For all the haters out there how could you be against letting the Russian women play and defend their title?
You just never give up with your bullshit do you? Do you have a screw loose in your head or something? The election is over and it is time for the CFC to move on and mend fences for reasons I have already stated. I will sit out as long as the CFC is controlled by you and your execs but Mig has more patience then me and already made you an offer for the sake of young chess players that have nothing to do with your stupidity and deserve better.
I will not sit by however, and allow us to accept insults unanswered. I urge you to stop the slander. It serves no useful purpose for the CFC and as an elected officer of the CFC you are over the line.
Garry Kasparov:
"I do not intend to allow Kirsan Ilyumzhinov’s plan to drag me and the election for FIDE president into the situation around the Olympiad teams excluded from the Tromsø Olympiad. Ilyumzhinov’s gang and his allies at the Russian Chess Federation are desperate to politicize this unfortunate mess of their own making. They should not be allowed to distract from how and why they created this scandal by attacking me and the Norwegian organizers.
It is clear that Ilyumzhinov’s administration has been accomplice to the Russian Federation both before and after the willful rule violation that led to this crisis. They assisted in an illegal action and then attempted to pardon that illegal action using 6.1. And instead of working with the Norwegian organizers, or any of the other affected federations, Ilyumzhinov’s group took the side of one powerful federation. All federations should be equal under the law or the law has no meaning. Similarly, if 6.1 allows the FIDE president to overrule all other regulations and contracts there is no point in having them. Lastly, it is complete hypocrisy for Ilyumzhinov to now speak of the other excluded federations, especially since four of them – Gabon, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Senegal – failed to meet the deadline due only to their legitimate leadership being attacked by Ilyumzhinov’s administration in the Electoral Commission for purely political reasons.
Today is the 90th anniversary of FIDE. In the spirit of Gens Una Sumus we should all seek a compromise that satisfies spirit of the rule of law and that allows for every team that desires to play in the Olympiad to play. This cannot mean bullying the organizers with every kind of legal action, even of canceling the Olympiad, as several Ilyumzhinov officials have threatened to do. If there can be any possibility for the Russian women’s team and the other excluded teams to participate, it must begin with ceasing to make threats and instead to align FIDE and the federations with the organizers and to show respect for the rule of law. The RCF should begin by admitting they consciously violated the rules and apologizing to the organizers and the other federations for doing so.
I cannot speak for the organizers and I have no authority or role in these proceedings. I wish only to express my desire as an eight-time Olympiad champion, and as a chess fan, that the players not be punished for the errors and wrongdoings of officials. From my first Olympiad as a teen in 1980 to my last as a veteran in 2002, the Olympiad was always a very special event and I know every other participant feels the same. FIDE and the federations must reconcile with the organizers in Tromsø to find a way forward instead of making threats and burning bridges. I am ready and willing to help in any way that I can.
Garry Kasparov
Podgorica, Montenegro
July 20, 2014"
"I do not intend to allow Kirsan Ilyumzhinov’s plan to drag me and the election for FIDE president into the situation around the Olympiad teams excluded from the Tromsø Olympiad. Ilyumzhinov’s gang and his allies at the Russian Chess Federation are desperate to politicize this unfortunate mess of their own making. They should not be allowed to distract from how and why they created this scandal by attacking me and the Norwegian organizers.
Let's be clear: this is Kasparov's response to the decision, under the threat of serious repercussions for the organizers, that ALL teams, including the Russian women's team and the 8 other teams excluded from the Olympiad, would be permitted to play in the event.
I guess I have to repeat what I wrote almost a month ago now.
Originally posted by me
So, to summarize ...
Garry Kasparov: "I cannot explain the bizarre statements of FIDE vice-president Israel Gelfer. What would I or the Norwegian organizers have to gain from excluding the celebrated Russian women’s team?"
Seems pretty obvious.
Wayne K: "The Russian news agency Itar-Tass revealed the list of teams excluded from the 2014 Tromso Chess Olympiad: Cambodia, Central African Republic, Gabon, Côte d’Ivoire, Oman, Pakistan, Senegal (Men's teams); Women: Russia, Afghanistan; making a total of nine teams, all supporting FIDE President Kirsan Ilyumzhinov in the coming elections according to the agency."
Mind you, it could just be an unlucky "coincidence" that all nine teams just happen not to support Kasparov.
Let's be clear. It isn't just not being able to play in Tromso. It is also not being able to vote in the upcoming FIDE Presidential election.
And then Kasparov had the effrontery to claim that others, like the FIDE leadership in particular, were "politicizing" a mess of their own making.
A lie repeated over and over again is still a lie.
The truth is, were it not for Kirsan Ilyumzhinov's decisive actions to ensure that the 9 teams would be playing in the Olympiad, even to the point of threatening to move the event, the Kasparov minions would have succeeded in excluding 9 countries from the event - countries that just "happened" to be voting against their candidate.
Dogs will bark, but the caravan of chess moves on.
"Countries that just "happened" to be voting against their candidate."
The Truth is that most of these Countries just happened to be supporting Kasparov but their legitimate federations were deleted by Kirsan's FIDE and replaced by sham groups sanctioned by the so called Electoral commission consisting of Kirsan's henchmen.The best is when one of the countries allowed in could not even produce a team because the newly minted "federation" president did not know any chess players. So for a team he put down his family including his infant children.
Your posts are like the rantings of a sick twisted mental patient just like one would expect from a Putin sycophant. It is unbelievable that you are even still a member here, at least you are no longer a moderator. You did a great job of abusing that role.
Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Tuesday, 19th August, 2014, 04:16 PM.
You just never give up with your bullshit do you? Do you have a screw loose in your head or something?
That is known as projection.
The election is over and it is time for the CFC to move on and mend fences for reasons I have already stated.
Yes it is time to mend fences but that won't be done with you bitching and moaning on chesstalk about the outcome of the election. Unlike Kirsan I am not a diplomat.
I will sit out as long as the CFC is controlled by you and your execs but Mig has more patience then me and already made you an offer for the sake of young chess players that have nothing to do with your stupidity and deserve better.
I will not sit by however, and allow us to accept insults unanswered. I urge you to stop the slander. It serves no useful purpose for the CFC and as an elected officer of the CFC you are over the line.
Slander? Nine of nine federations that were to be excluded from the Olympiad just happened to be supporting Kirsan. According to you this was just a coincidence. I'm not buying what you are selling.
"Yes it is time to mend fences but that won't be done with you bitching and moaning on chesstalk about the outcome of the election. Unlike Kirsan I am not a diplomat."
Your the one that won't stop posting bullshit long after the election is over against a group that made a nice unconditional gesture. Nothing to do with me bitching and moaning.
"Slander? Nine of nine federations that were to be excluded from the Olympiad just happened to be supporting Kirsan. According to you this was just a coincidence. I'm not buying what you are selling."
The Truth is that most of these Countries just happened to be supporting Kasparov but their legitimate federations were deleted by Kirsan's FIDE and replaced by sham groups sanctioned by the so called Electoral commission consisting of Kirsan's henchmen.The best is when one of the countries allowed in could not even produce a team because the newly minted "federation" president did not know any chess players. So for a team he put down his family including his infant children.
I am not trying to sell you anything. It's too late for that and the Canadian Chess playing community loses because of your stupidity, I agree that you are not a diplomat, you are a stupid donkey!
Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Tuesday, 19th August, 2014, 09:22 PM.
I agree that you are not a diplomat, your a stupid donkey!
And In a response to Nigel Hanrahan you said:
Originally posted by Sid Belzberg
Your posts are like the rantings of a sick twisted mental patient just like one would expect from a Putin sycophant. It is unbelievable that you are even still a member here, at least you are no longer a moderator. You did a great job of abusing that role.
You are purportedly an adult but how do you expect to be taken seriously when you make statements like that?
You are purportedly an adult but how do you expect to be taken seriously when you make statements like that?
Steve
I couldn't give a damn, I'm beyond that. I could give you quite a few examples of posts where Vlad also uses colorful adjectives to describe me but you seem to take him very seriously. My favorite with Nigel is the expression "Antediluvian" which is simply a pompous way of saying old fashioned.
Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Tuesday, 19th August, 2014, 12:22 PM.
My favorite with Nigel is the expression "Antediluvian" which is simply a pompous way of saying old fashioned.
Actually, no. By antediluvian I mean "pre-flood" as in "before the breakup of the Soviet Union". Before that event, Russia was (arguably) a socialist country. After that event, it joined the ranks of the capitalist countries. So the "need" for the Cold War and its obstinate prejudices towards Russia should have ended.
The problem is, Russia has been capitalist for 25 years but these antediluvian cold warriors are stuck in the past and cannot abandon their "pre-flood" attitudes. Like Garry Kimovich Kasparov.
Like you, Sid. Cheers.
Last edited by Nigel Hanrahan; Wednesday, 20th August, 2014, 01:10 AM.
Reason: cheers
Dogs will bark, but the caravan of chess moves on.
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