Chess on ice

[Ed Seedhouse]

Re: Chess on ice

Maybe you should introduce chess clocks to curling... ;)

They already have, several years back.

[Ed Seedhouse]

Re: Chess on ice

Tell us, how many children went hungry because your strike and picket line wouldn't let their parents go to work.

I'd be happy to answer that, but first you tell me, yes or no, have you stopped beating your wife yet?

[Ernest Klubis]

Re: Chess on ice

We can only wish chess was as widely enjoyed as curling.

Neil, your wish came true. Name me the country, outside Canada, that has more curlers than "registered" chess players.

I agree with you that chess has a problem. It's too sophisticated for simpleton like Duncan. If ESPN or TSN will produce a 2 hour show on one of the World Chess Championship game with a detail commentary and move by move explanation of the possible lines what percentage of North American audience will be capable to comprehend what's going on? GM Shirov has a video in which he analyzes one of his endgame for 45 minutes with "normal" 12-16 moves line variations. How many Duncan's can follow that. But with curling, like hockey, no complex analysis required, everyone can understand "peel". That's why you have higher TV audience, because more people can comprehend.

I'm not dissing curling. I'm disappointed that some people has misconception that "curling is chess on ice". I want make ignorant people aware of their fallacies. Unfortunately, I failed.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Chess on ice

There was also the missed draw for 2 in the second end.

The Edmonton Journal wrote this:

Click Here.

[Duncan Smith]

Re: Chess on ice

At our club, a bell is rung 25 minutes before the scheduled end of the game. Each end normally takes around 15 minutes, you are allowed to complete one additional end beyond the one in progress.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Chess on ice

Duncan, is there a curling variation played by only single persons (just throwers)? (As I have seen some teams rotate their throwers, some have only one.)
and other chess type question - What is the status of curling engines (similar to Fritz, Rybka etc)? :D Do they beat humans 100%? (in a strategy/tactic level)

[Duncan Smith]

Re: Chess on ice

You are bringing a whole lot of ignorance to the thread and digging yourself an ever deeper hole of stupidity. If you think chess end games present some form of highly complex problem solving exercise that does not exist in other activities in life you seem quite sheltered and antisocial really.

Many people understand chess, in fact you can have a below average IQ and be a chess master ( especially given the amount of computerized theory running around ). It is just that most people are not interested in chess. They may not choose Curling as their sport of choice but they may well choose from any number of sports alternatives.

For you to infer that people aren't taking an interest in Chess because they don't understand it is a whole lot of bs. You may believe this but that just illustrates there is plenty of room in Chess for ignorant people. Certainly, both Chess and Curling have smart well rounded people involved as well, but then there is you to remind us it's not all good.

[Egidijus Zeromskis]

Re: Chess on ice

You are bringing a whole lot of ignorance to the thread and digging yourself an ever deeper hole of stupidity. If you think chess end games present some form of highly complex problem solving exercise that does not exist in other activities in life you seem quite sheltered and antisocial really.

Many people understand chess, in fact you can have a below average IQ and be a chess master ( especially given the amount of computerized theory running around ). It is just that most people are not interested in chess. They may not choose Curling as their sport of choice but they may well choose from any number of sports alternatives.

For you to infer that people aren't taking an interest in Chess because they don't understand it is a whole lot of bs. You may believe this but that just illustrates there is plenty of room in Chess for ignorant people. Certainly, both Chess and Curling have smart well rounded people involved as well, but then there is you to remind us it's not all good.

It is a good manner to include a person name or a quotation, otherwise it may look totaly out of contents (I'm using a linear mode, and took several lines to read and to understand that it was not an answer to my questions)

[Duncan Smith]

Re: Chess on ice

There may be training exercises involving one-on-one but no competitions. They've introduced a doubles event but its strictly a novelty event for now.

Curling simulation would be difficult to program you'd need to factor in many variables like ice conditions or it wouldn't be realistic. I suppose if such a program existed it would be useful for training newer elite teams but for now its mostly live coaching and personal experiences. Most of the other Curling nations currently hire Canadians to coach their national teams. The reason is mostly to teach strategy.

Overall I would say written literature and theory on Curling is below par because people would rather experience the game and participate and learn the rest as they go. People who enjoy Curling tend to spend a lot of time at the rink and the learning cycle is constant.

[Kerry Liles]

Re: Chess on ice

There may be training exercises involving one-on-one but no competitions. They've introduced a doubles event but its strictly a novelty event for now.

Curling simulation would be difficult to program you'd need to factor in many variables like ice conditions or it wouldn't be realistic. I suppose if such a program existed it would be useful for training newer elite teams but for now its mostly live coaching and personal experiences. Most of the other Curling nations currently hire Canadians to coach their national teams. The reason is mostly to teach strategy.

Overall I would say written literature and theory on Curling is below par because people would rather experience the game and participate and learn the rest as they go. People who enjoy Curling tend to spend a lot of time at the rink and the learning cycle is constant.

I wonder if there is curling for the WII ? I quite enjoy bowling on the WII - I would think that curling would be an interesting game too (and more amenable to a single screen than WII Tennis for example)

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Chess on ice

There may be training exercises involving one-on-one but no competitions. They've introduced a doubles event but its strictly a novelty event for now.

Curling simulation would be difficult to program you'd need to factor in many variables like ice conditions or it wouldn't be realistic. I suppose if such a program existed it would be useful for training newer elite teams but for now its mostly live coaching and personal experiences.

As I posted last night, there is this program available on Amazon.com, but it's currently out of stock:

http://www.amazon.com/Granite-v2-Cur.../dp/B001NG41EQ

[Paul Bonham]

Re: Chess on ice

I wonder if there is curling for the WII ? I quite enjoy bowling on the WII - I would think that curling would be an interesting game too (and more amenable to a single screen than WII Tennis for example)

Funny you should mention it. I don't know if it's for real, but Jay Leno on the Tonight Show last night mentioned there is now curling on the WII, and he showed a clip, and warned viewers that it looks a little... graphic....

It shows 2 people simulating the motion of sweeping curling brooms with their WII, and I'll leave it to your imagination what this also looked like.

[Kerry Liles]

Re: Chess on ice

Funny you should mention it. I don't know if it's for real, but Jay Leno on the Tonight Show last night mentioned there is now curling on the WII, and he showed a clip, and warned viewers that it looks a little... graphic....

It shows 2 people simulating the motion of sweeping curling brooms with their WII, and I'll leave it to your imagination what this also looked like.

lol

I didn't watch Leno (last night - or at all since he left the Tonight Show the first time) ... I am guessing that since he lampooned Curling on the WII, it isn't available.

[Dan Scoones]

Re: Chess on ice

In terms of "game space", Curling is definately much closer to chess by your description. I don't know why you think otherwise it doesn't make sense to anyone who is an experienced Curler at the competitive level. I don't think you are understanding the decision making process that accompanies the selection of shots. Perhaps it is the speed of decisions of experienced players that is fooling you.

Curling decisions are fundamentally different from chess decisions in one important parameter, one that has nothing to do with speed.

In chess, we can look to see if our move works before playing it. In curling, we can't know for sure if it's going to work until we play it. We can guess, but the level of certainty that is possible in chess is just not possible in curling. One doesn't have to be a curler to know this -- it's the nature of the game space.

In chess, the moves are discrete and precise. The physical aspect is arbitrary, and the game space is more virtual than real. We can play chess on a huge board, a normal board, a tiny board, or no board at all save for the one in our heads.

In curling, the physical aspect of the game is paramount, and there is a continuous, non-discrete aspect to the moves. The stone is thrown and either hits or misses the opponent's stone, and either achieves or misses the desired position.

Once again you are assuming a judgement that curling is inferior to chess. That isn't what I'm talking about.

[Ed Seedhouse]

Re: Chess on ice

In curling, the physical aspect of the game is paramount, and there is a continuous, non-discrete aspect to the moves. The stone is thrown and either hits or misses the opponent's stone, and either achieves or misses the desired position.

Once again you are assuming a judgement that curling is inferior to chess. That isn't what I'm talking about.

I would say that, at the very highest levels of curling, such as exhibited in the Men's gold medal final game in the Vancouver Olympics, the physical aspect was not as paramount as it might be at lower levels. In the Women's final it was more evident, as Canada had two direct shots for the win that were missed.

I do not think that Curling is "chess on ice", just that there are perhaps more parallels with chess than in other games except perhaps billiards or pool. I much prefer chess, but that does not make it better or worse than any other game.

I just prefer my chess on a chessboard.