Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

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  • #16
    Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

    Originally posted by Andrei Botez View Post
    Also I believe that you can submit your FIDE rated games played outside Canada to CFC to be rated under Canadian rating sistem.

    Here is an example.
    You notify the CFC Office ahead of time you would like your non Canadian FIDE event rated.

    There would be a charge for this service. I'm not sure if it would simply be $3 x (the number of opponents you had + 1) or something else.

    The event probably wouldn't be rated until the results were available at the FIDE site, unless you returned with a certified copy of your results.

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    • #17
      Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

      Originally posted by Gary Ruben View Post
      Yes. However, one can not miss the suggestion CFC ratings are 200 or more points higher than FIDE ratings. A Canadian rating minus 200 points being a fair estimation of playing strength in the worldwide player pool.

      Possibly others see the use of the term "Canadian rating scale" differently. I thought it was pointed.
      I did not read anything else. The typo was enough to put me off food for several hours.

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      • #18
        Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

        Originally posted by Fred McKim View Post
        Sorry Gary:

        Your quoted difference of 200 points is way off the mark. I worked this out about 4 months ago, and I think it's about 90 points for the top 20 active players, which is what we're more interested in. I'll look up the spreadsheet when I get back to the computer it's on next week.
        Well, Fred. I merely commented the article suggested there is a 200 point difference between FIDE and CFC ratings. It refers to a "Canadian rating scale". If you figure a 2750 CFC rating is worth FIDE 2660 all I can comment is the "correction", if that's what it is, seems to be going in the right direction to merge with the FIDE rating.

        I have no idea because I don't follow that players games.

        The CFC ratings system does have some serious problems from my personal point of view. I haven't played a CFC rated game since the mid 1970's. Around 35 years. The CFC lists a rating for me and presumably I would be able to play with that rating and win a class prize, in the unlikely event the urge strikes me.

        I tried at one time to find out how the rating was arrived at. It seems there was a rating card around with some parts erased. I never could find out what was erased because the information was lost forever. Then there was 100 points added for some general rating bonus which was added because it was felt the Canadian rating scale was too low, if I understood this correctly.

        My CFC rating matters little to me in the same way my CCCA rating matters little to me. I keep track of my ICCF rating which is the correspondence international rating and the only one which really matters to me. National ratings mean nothing to me as they are regional rating pools.

        However, keeping such old CFC ratings active rather than simply discarding the rating and having a player enter an event as "unrated" seems like a problem to me. It seems likely such an old ratng would result in a player either gaining or losing a fast few hundred ponts from a selected few opponents.
        Gary Ruben
        CC - IA and SIM

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        • #19
          Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

          Originally posted by Gary Ruben View Post
          Well, Fred. I merely commented the article suggested there is a 200 point difference between FIDE and CFC ratings. It refers to a "Canadian rating scale". If you figure a 2750 CFC rating is worth FIDE 2660 all I can comment is the "correction", if that's what it is, seems to be going in the right direction to merge with the FIDE rating.

          I have no idea because I don't follow that players games.

          The CFC ratings system does have some serious problems from my personal point of view. I haven't played a CFC rated game since the mid 1970's. Around 35 years. The CFC lists a rating for me and presumably I would be able to play with that rating and win a class prize, in the unlikely event the urge strikes me.

          I tried at one time to find out how the rating was arrived at. It seems there was a rating card around with some parts erased. I never could find out what was erased because the information was lost forever. Then there was 100 points added for some general rating bonus which was added because it was felt the Canadian rating scale was too low, if I understood this correctly.

          My CFC rating matters little to me in the same way my CCCA rating matters little to me. I keep track of my ICCF rating which is the correspondence international rating and the only one which really matters to me. National ratings mean nothing to me as they are regional rating pools.

          However, keeping such old CFC ratings active rather than simply discarding the rating and having a player enter an event as "unrated" seems like a problem to me. It seems likely such an old ratng would result in a player either gaining or losing a fast few hundred ponts from a selected few opponents.
          I only *wish* I still had some of my older ratings... I don't know what a rating system can do to properly handle inactivity. Maybe some fancy formula to assume that ratings decline with inactivity (not clear that this is true or even to what extent it might be true) and have some rating points exhibit radioactive decay...

          Allowing a player to resume active play (as "unrated") after a long period of inactivity feels like the wrong solution, but I am not smart enough to think of a better one - perhaps treating that player as "provisionally rated" with his/her previous rating as the base? I am not at all certain how that would work out...

          I think all rating systems make the simplifying assumption to sort of ignore the question of activity or inactivity. Clearly a player who is very active should have a more accurate rating than someone who hasn't played in years or months, but what if the more inactive player was training with Kasparov? What then?

          It isn't possible to take into account all factors since no one knows what all the factors are and what impact they have.
          ...Mike Pence: the Lord of the fly.

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          • #20
            Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

            The FICS rating system takes into account inactivity by making ratings semi-provisional. It's probably a good approach but it hasn't been properly tested.

            In FICS there is a serious problem of rating deflation. (The cause is believed to be computer accounts, where one week a computer plays at 2200 strength, and next week the software is upgraded and it plays 2300. Result is players play a 2300 computer but its official rating is 2200. Players lose rating points this way.) We don't know whether taking out the computer ratings would correct that, or if it's the rating system's problem.

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            • #21
              Re: Chessbase report on Canadian Closed

              Originally posted by Kerry Liles View Post
              I only *wish* I still had some of my older ratings... I don't know what a rating system can do to properly handle inactivity. Maybe some fancy formula to assume that ratings decline with inactivity (not clear that this is true or even to what extent it might be true) and have some rating points exhibit radioactive decay...
              I don't know if we can assume decay, or the degree of decay, with CFC inactivity. I still maintain a correspondence rating of over 2400 and I'm active. I'm currently playing in this:

              Click Here...

              I should find a higher category event to play but I think I'm too lazy to work on theory.

              Assuming decay of a few hundred points, a player coming back after 35 years should be a bonus rating system for those lucky enough to be paired against him. The thing is CFC inactivity isn't the same as total inactivity. There's the internet and lots of speed games to be played.

              There is one thing for sure. An old rating discourages inactive players from coming back to competitive chess. If a person has a high rating there's the feeling a person has to come back and play up to the previous level. Successful players don't want to come back to a situation where they aren't competitive in relation to an expectation. The level of a rating is an expectation.

              A lower rated player wouldn't want to come back because his rating would be either lower or higher than what the CFC shows. As an example, if a low rated player came back after 10 years and started winning the class prizes by a large margin he'd have to listen to complaining. Also, the pairing systems and rating eligibility for sections generally discourages participation. Does an over rated player want to play an event where he doesn't figure to win a game OR does an under rated player want to play an event where he won't find much of a challenge? With the internet play people have an idea of how they are competing.
              Gary Ruben
              CC - IA and SIM

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