Canadian Chess League

[Brian Profit]

Here are the answers to some questions people might have of the new Canadian Chess League. We are very excited to be starting this new journey into online chess that will hopefully bring out some of the top players in the country and allow players from across our geographically large country to face each other over the board.

How many players can be on a team?
As few as 4, as many as 7.

How many players will play in any match?
4.

Who can be on a team?
Anyone! There are no rating limits. You can get your friends together to make a team, or players from your club or school. Clubs can have multiple teams if they would like.

How will the teams be paired?
Round robin groups of 8 that will be grouped by the average rating of your top 4 players. The top 4 teams make the playoffs in each group.

How will the players on each team be paired?
Your highest rated player will play the opposing team’s highest rated player, and so on. Colour allocations will be such that your team will have the same colour on either boards 1 and 3 or 2 and 4.

What is the time control?
60 minutes/game plus 15 seconds each move.

How will the games be transmitted?
The Internet Chess Club is going to give us league accounts to only play these games.

Where do teams play from?
That is up to your team, but it must be a place where all four games can be played from and where someone can come and watch the games in progress. An internet connection and a back up connection is required.

When will the games take place?
Once a month, starting in September. Playoffs will take place in April. Games will be played Monday to Friday. A complete schedule for the entire season will be drawn up in the first 2 weeks of September.

How much will it cost for a team to register?
$120.

Are there prizes?
Of course! The winning team in the top tier will be playing for a $1000 prize. There will be prizes for the winners in the other divisions.

Will the games be rated?
Yes. CFC and Canadian Chess League rated.

We will be offering a scholastic division that will be Chess and Math rated.

We are considering an amateur division that will be playing with a reduced team entry fee with no prizes is there is sufficient interest.

If you would like a copy of our rules as they now stand, please email me at profit@canadianchessleague.ca

If you have any questions, you can email me or post your questions here.

Our website should be up and running properly by the end of the weekend.

[Peter McKillop]

Re: Canadian Chess League

Brian, it's great to see people taking the initiative and accomplishing things. Best wishes for success with this project.

[Fred McKim]

Re: Canadian Chess League

Was the launch of the league announced at the Canadian Open ?

[Alan Baljeu]

Re: Canadian Chess League

Are there prizes?
Of course! The winning team in the top tier will be playing for a $1000 prize. There will be prizes for the winners in the other divisions.

How will cheating be avoided? It's too easy for a player in a complicated position to start Fritz and ask for the winning line. Mainly an issue when big prizes are at stake.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: Canadian Chess League

How will cheating be avoided? It's too easy for a player in a complicated position to start Fritz and ask for the winning line. Mainly an issue when big prizes are at stake.

You would need to find at least four people willing to cheat on a single team. The rules stipulate that the venue has to be a place that people can come and visit if they would like to watch the match in progress from what Brian was saying at the Canadian Open.

[Kevin Pacey]

Re: Canadian Chess League

Personally, if I played in a CCL match, I wouldn't mind too much if man+machine(+book!?) team (or even individual!?) matches were openly allowed by the Canadian Chess League, though Vlad's post seems to make clear that cheating isn't a real concern, given the set of rules that the Canadian Chess League is actually going to use for its team matches.

[Brian Profit]

Re: Canadian Chess League

Yes, an announcement and flyers were handed out at the Open.

[Brian Profit]

Re: Canadian Chess League

As Vlado stated, all games for a team must be played from the same location. If you get 4 people to think that cheating is ok, then you will find a fifth and sixth and.....
For the playoffs, teams will need a neutral observer or TD to be present for matches.

[Denton Cockburn]

Re: Canadian Chess League

As Vlado stated, all games for a team must be played from the same location. If you get 4 people to think that cheating is ok, then you will find a fifth and sixth and.....
For the playoffs, teams will need a neutral observer or TD to be present for matches.

I don't see this as a decent solution to the cheating concerns to be honest. Even one team of 4 players willing to cheat will taint the whole thing.

Perhaps if you put in place a system to address/enforce suspected cheating issues.

idea:
Players can check over their opponent's play with an engine after the game. If the player plays "too well" for their rating, then the game can be submitted to an "Ethics Arbiter".

Punishment should be severe for cheaters:
1st offence = loss of game (may require changing submitted result)
2nd offence = banning from CCL for a period of time
3rd offence = team's ejection and individual's lifetime ban from CCL

Perhaps you can even punish the entire team if cheating happens more than once for the team. For example, if 2 games by a team in a match are determined to involve cheating, the entire team will be ejected from the CCL (losing their entry fee as well).

More on the team aspect: 3 seperate incidents of cheating for the entire iteration of the League results in ejection and permanent banning of team members.

This has real consequences that players would have to take into account before considering cheating. It would also strengthen the view that you already have (about needing 3 co-cheaters to get away with cheating).

I like the CCL idea very much, but I already play online at FICS and have faced many people later banned for cheating. Cheating is a really big concern that would need to be addressed strongly before I think this could take off properly.

Denton

[Peter McKillop]

Re: Canadian Chess League

... Punishment should be severe for cheaters:
1st offence = loss of game (may require changing submitted result)
2nd offence = banning from CCL for a period of time
3rd offence = team's ejection and individual's lifetime ban from CCL
...

I suggest that you should not have a graduated series of penalties for cheaters. Instead, first offense = loss of game and lifetime ban from CCL. Brian Profit appears to be proposing a system based on trust. Will anyone ever again trust a cheater once they've been caught? Therefore, get rid of cheaters on the first offense. Who needs them?

[Denton Cockburn]

Re: Canadian Chess League

I suggest that you should not have a graduated series of penalties for cheaters. Instead, first offense = loss of game and lifetime ban from CCL. Brian Profit appears to be proposing a system based on trust. Will anyone ever again trust a cheater once they've been caught? Therefore, get rid of cheaters on the first offense. Who needs them?

The difficulty is that it would be near impossible to establish the allegations without doubt with just one instance. If we're relying on a computer engine to detect mistakes; we can't punish someone permanently based on that one instance. Maybe they really just played like Kasparov for that one game.

If you are an 1800 player that plays like Kasparov on a regular basis, but only when no one is watching in person, well...that's questionable.

Denton

[Gary Ruben]

Re: Canadian Chess League

idea:
Players can check over their opponent's play with an engine after the game. If the player plays "too well" for their rating, then the game can be submitted to an "Ethics Arbiter".

What if both players are playing "too well" for their rating and both players moves are preferred by a computer program at critical phases of the game? Is it woe on the player who won?

[Denton Cockburn]

Re: Canadian Chess League

What if both players are playing "too well" for their rating and both players moves are preferred by a computer program at critical phases of the game? Is it woe on the player who won?

If both cheated, then the win goes to whoever actually won (because hey, they used the better engine). Both would still be punished for cheating though and the result would be ignored for the team match.

Come to think of it though, why would someone complain about their opponent cheating, when they also cheated? Then you would both get in trouble for cheating...

The point is that it would be illogical to tell on the other guy if you also cheated.

A 3rd party could tell on both cheaters though.

I think as a rule the games from the CCL should be made/kept public so they can be reviewed by spectators for cheating. That may be even better than relying on the players to complain.

Denton

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: Canadian Chess League

This is supposed to be CFC rated so penalties would/could extend to sanctions and bans on CFC play. Getting caught cheating would also risk criminal charges for fraud.

I don't see the people who would play in this league as being the type of people who would cheat. They would make more money by working a minimum wage job at Tim Hortons which is my favourite analogy when people who are not GMs start talking about making money at chess. This would be seven games plus playoffs for a prize of $1000 per team. I'm not sure how the playoffs would work but you would be looking at nine or ten games at about three hours or more per game for a net profit of $210 per person if you use just the four people.

The biggest barrier to setting this up would be getting a public venue where you could play the match. With the games starting in September that does give some time to get things set up. My guess is a library, a university/college, a mall, a hotel, a restaurant, or an internet cafe would be the best venues at which to set this up.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: Canadian Chess League

I think proven cheating should result in an immediate lifetime ban on team play in the league and could lead to a three year ban on CFC play if I recall the sanctions for past examples of cheating.