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2011 Toronto Labour Day Open Saturday September 3 to Monday September 5
TD: Bryan Lamb
Please note the split venue:
Saturday at the Frontenac Ballroom at the Westin Harbour Castle Hotel (near the Queen's Quay ferry docks, where the Canadian Open took place);
Sunday and Monday at the ACC, 918 Bathurst Street (a short walk from Bathurst subway).
Re: 2011 Toronto Labour Day Tournament - Register Now
Hi Marcus;
Why do you have Sunday Start at 10 am when we all know the Subway does not open till 9am if you have players coming from Scarborough Kennedy Station or Kipling stations you don't leave us much time to get there .
Why not a 10:30 a.m. or 11:00 am start on Sunday???
Isn't it time to break tradition and make players want to come to your event in a more relaxed state then rushing in like mad dogs to the Kill.
If you want maximum turn out don't you need maximum convenience?
Also can you explain why entry fees are so much higher than other years.
If you are going to offer a $2000 First in the Open then let them pay $95 and let others pay a reasonable amount in the other sections so that you get more participation and thus make more money NO?
Re: 2011 Toronto Labour Day Tournament - Register Now
Suggestion:
Do you really need 8 hours between game starting times, when the maximum length of a 60-move game would be only 5 hours? Start the morning rounds later and/or start the afternoon rounds earlier.
Do you really need 8 hours between game starting times, when the maximum length of a 60-move game would be only 5 hours? Start the morning rounds later and/or start the afternoon rounds earlier.
Rounds are at 10 am and 4 pm each day. I think that's only 6 hours. Maybe I don't understand your question.
Why do you have Sunday Start at 10 am when we all know the Subway does not open till 9am if you have players coming from Scarborough Kennedy Station or Kipling stations you don't leave us much time to get there .
Why not a 10:30 a.m. or 11:00 am start on Sunday???
Isn't it time to break tradition and make players want to come to your event in a more relaxed state then rushing in like mad dogs to the Kill.
If you want maximum turn out don't you need maximum convenience?
Thanks, John. I take TTC myself, and I'm fully aware of the 9 am subway start. How long does it take to get from Kennedy to Bathurst? Or Scarborough Centre to Bathurst? (ACC is really close to Bathurst station.) Maybe we need to be a bit flexible with the start on Sunday morning.
Unless there's a real need, I think consistency in start times is helpful. I know there were some people (I won't embarrass them by naming) who forfeited a weekend game at the Canadian Open by failing to note the new start times :)
Re: 2011 Toronto Labour Day Tournament - Register Now
JK wrote:
Is that still true that the subway only opens/starts at 9:00am on Sunday?
Even as a non-Toronto resident, I knew that.
Keeping on-topic as to Sunday closings:
The first Canadian Open in Montreal in 1956 was held in Redpath Hall - at McGill University. However - McGill would not allow the use of their facilities on Sundays. Thus - the Sunday rounds were held at the YMHA - a couple of km away. (the YMHA had been approached about using their hall for the whole event - but no Friday night or Saturday games could be played there).
Hi Marcus;
...
Also can you explain why entry fees are so much higher than other years.
If you are going to offer a $2000 First in the Open then let them pay $95 and let others pay a reasonable amount in the other sections so that you get more participation and thus make more money NO?
I'm sure you know, John, that this is a thorny issue, and it's hard to find the right balance.
Actually, there are two issues here, as I see it. First is the overall price, including the overall percentage returned as prizes. And second is the amount of class players' entry fees that gets syphoned off to pay for prizes in the top section.
To respond to the second point first, I like playing in events where top players are competing for big prizes. And I am hierarchical enough or meritocratic enough to think that we should help support the elite players. On the other hand, I appreciate that most players, and almost all new players we could hope to attract, are going to be in the lower sections. Actually I thought we might draw flack for the size of the prizes in the lower sections. Why does the top U1600 player get the same prize as an IM who wins second place in the open section? To that I would have to answer that this is where the numbers are, and it's the biggest area where we need to stimulate interest.
To respond to the first point, one of the first questions I am asked, when non chess players look at big tournaments like the Canadian Open, is "How much money does the winner get?" I think we would help chess in general if we could make bigger prize funds. This cannot all come from "taxation," i.e., entry fees. We need corporate sponsors, etc. We are trying to work on all aspects of that question, and hopefully we will have some corporate sponsors for the Labour Day Open and Thanksgiving Day Opens to make the prize funds more attractive and increase general interest in chess.
As far as the percentage returned in prizes, we are a not-for-profit organization, but we have real costs. Bryan Lamb and others who have heroically run chess at a loss in this city, paying out of their own pockets to maintain prize funds, and working for free, have suffered enough. We are trying to avoid that and thereby help bring new organizing blood and better events into this sport.
We all want turnout to be high, events to be good, and chess to be as attractive as possible to new players. As I said it's a thorny issue, or set of issues, and it's hard to get into all its aspects.
I know you run small, inexpensive events at free venues and return most (maybe all) the entry fees in prizes - or maybe you don't have prize funds? I don't think that model alone will raise the status of chess in the city, but maybe I'm wrong. I certainly think it's good that it's there, too, and I hope I can come to one of your events soon. Please let me know when you have one coming up!
As far as the Toronto Labour Day Open and big annual city events go, maybe you can suggest a specific model. I'd be interested to know where you stand on attracting and rewarding top players, attracting new players, keeping costs low, keeping organizers sane, etc.
Last edited by Marcus Wilker; Sunday, 31st July, 2011, 12:30 PM.
Reason: annoying its/it's typo
Re: 2011 Toronto Labour Day Tournament - Register Now
Kind of dissapointing that there is no discounts for juniors like in the hart house tournament, although it's understandable that if the westin harbor venue is used the entree fees are higher
Thanks, John. I take TTC myself, and I'm fully aware of the 9 am subway start. How long does it take to get from Kennedy to Bathurst? Or Scarborough Centre to Bathurst? (ACC is really close to Bathurst station.) Maybe we need to be a bit flexible with the start on Sunday morning.
Unless there's a real need, I think consistency in start times is helpful. I know there were some people (I won't embarrass them by naming) who forfeited a weekend game at the Canadian Open by failing to note the new start times :)
Hi Marcus;
At the CDN OPen they changed the start time to earlier I'm saying start later . How can you be late for a later start time. I would think you'd be early as the time before would be earlier.
Kind of dissapointing that there is no discounts for juniors like in the hart house tournament, although it's understandable that if the westin harbor venue is used the entree fees are higher
Hi Mike;
Why not just charge for the section. So if you play in the Open you pay a big entry fee as you'll be playing for the most of the money.
In the U2000 you pay a lower amount as your prizes are lower.
And in the U1600 you pay even lower entries as your prizes are even lower still.
They did this way back in the 60-70's and the numbers were greater per section.
Supply us with a decent entry fee and we won't mind playing.
Charge us two legs and an arm and we will find a new hobby.
If you are a Junior and you want to win adult Prizes then Pay Adult fees.
How would you feel if they said OH you can only win $55 for top Junior prize because you took the discounted entry fee and you are not eligible for the Bigger Prizes. You can't have your cake and eat it too Mike.
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