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it is interesting to see that there are 22 players registered in U12 Girls at this time(while other girl's sections have much less participants, some even have only 2 or 3 registered), all CFC published top 10 U12G players are participating, including players from Vietnam, Quebec, BC and Ontario etc. considering the BC players are under rated, and Quebec players have no true CFC rating, there will be about 7 players near or above 1700 CFC rating, also there are at least 3 girls having WCM FIDE title, a few players have FIDE ratings. Considering a few players with low ratings recently beat 1700 or above, there will be at least 10 players are very competitive.
One thought is that would be possible that some of the girls in U12G section participate in other older group, it might be much easier to get top 3 or even 1st place? Welcome to your thoughts.
it is interesting to see that there are 22 players registered in U12 Girls at this time(while other girl's sections have much less participants, some even have only 2 or 3 registered), all CFC published top 10 U12G players are participating, including players from Vietnam, Quebec, BC and Ontario etc. considering the BC players are under rated, and Quebec players have no true CFC rating, there will be about 7 players near or above 1700 CFC rating, also there are at least 3 girls having WCM FIDE title, a few players have FIDE ratings. Considering a few players with low ratings recently beat 1700 or above, there will be at least 10 players are very competitive.
One thought is that would be possible that some of the girls in U12G section participate in other older group, it might be much easier to get top 3 or even 1st place? Welcome to your thoughts.
Some are definitely underrated. One of the girls from Quebec has a CFC rating of 1188, but is the best player of her age in Canada (CMA ; girls and boys). It's far from being clear if she is the favourite in her actual section, but surprisingly she would probably win easily in the U16. I don't think they should be able to play up like this though. What is also quite funny is how some girls sections seem stronger than boys sections. In Quebec, girls always play in the same section as boys (it's much better to play against stronger players), but often have separate prizes.
Some are definitely underrated. One of the girls from Quebec has a CFC rating of 1188, but is the best player of her age in Canada (CMA ; girls and boys). It's far from being clear if she is the favourite in her actual section, but surprisingly she would probably win easily in the U16. I don't think they should be able to play up like this though.
As far as I know, in WYCC the kids are allowed to play older sections. Last year the U18 girls section was won by a 12 years old.
Regarding any 12 years old girls from Quebec winning easily the U16 girls section... I don't see it! I will start saying that the top U16 girl in Canada is rated over 2200 and she was part of the Canadian Women Olympiad Chess Team.
What is important is that we have great chess talent for boys and girls in Canada.
Some are definitely underrated. One of the girls from Quebec has a CFC rating of 1188, but is the best player of her age in Canada (CMA ; girls and boys). It's far from being clear if she is the favourite in her actual section, but surprisingly she would probably win easily in the U16. I don't think they should be able to play up like this though. What is also quite funny is how some girls sections seem stronger than boys sections. In Quebec, girls always play in the same section as boys (it's much better to play against stronger players), but often have separate prizes.
exactly, I noticed that she recently beat Ontario boys champion(1900 player) in Canadian Chess Challenge, and performed great in New York. not sure if she could eventually win this section with 3 WCMs and so many other competitive players.
One thought is that would be possible that some of the girls in U12G section participate in other older group, it might be much easier to get top 3 or even 1st place? Welcome to your thoughts.
This is definitely a reasonable strategy for maximizing the chance of winning a prize/qualification spot. Though, in addition to some of the problems mentioned by other posters involved in estimating regional differences in ratings, there's also a big risk: a late entry from a high-rated player could totally kill your chances.
[edit - I only just thought of this, but what I described above has already happened: Qiyu Zhou just entered the U14 girls, and she out-rates most girls in the country by 100s of points. That would have been a nasty surprise for any prize-seeking U12 section-hoppers.]
FWIW, the CFC Handbook says this would have to be approved by the executive. The HB doesn't specify a time-frame for when players/parents would request to play "up" an age group, but if it's the "45 days" mentioned for declaring their intention to play, it would be too late to do that for this year's CYCC.
708
{Motion Bunning/Taylor in 2002-3 GL1 From AGM}:
The Executive may allow exceptional players to move up to a higher age group.
Last edited by John Upper; Thursday, 27th June, 2013, 10:36 AM.
FWIW, the CFC Handbook says this would have to be approved by the executive.
708
{Motion Bunning/Taylor in 2002-3 GL1 From AGM}:
The Executive may allow exceptional players to move up to a higher age group.
I may argue that it is not true. The whole Youth tournament regulations were replaced with 2004-3 motion; thus the 2002-3 text is obsolete, and shall be not in the Handbook at all.
The CFC handbook is only a very general link to the real world. Take this clause:
708. Entries:
All eligible players who may qualify pursuant to Clause 703 and who wish to participate in the Youth Tournament shall notify the CFC Business Office no later than 45 days before the start of the Championship of their intention to participate, enclosing their entry fee of $225.00. The CFC Board of Directors may delegate this function to the tournament organizers. Entries which cannot be accepted because the number exceeds the number of players allowed shall be advised thereof and their entry fee returned to them. Players qualifying pursuant to Clause 703(b) shall send in their entries as soon as is practical after the Provincial Champion is known but in any case no later than three weeks prior to the start of the Youth Tournament. In exceptional circumstances, the CFC Board of Directors can vary the time limits in this Clause.
Online :) Your cited clause should not have been added during the latest update at all.
Egidijus, some of your posts read like you are paying for them by the letter.
The Handbook itself is online, so saying the actual regulations (other than what's in the Handbook) are "online" is no help at all unless you specify where they are. Where can I find the "2004-3 motion" you mention?
In the post I asked about, you said, "The whole Youth tournament regulations were replaced with 2004-3 motion". If you mean the "whole" thing, then all of Handbook section 7 is out of date (and not just one clause). If it's only one clause, why exaggerate? There are already enough people on this board and elsewhere who do that.
Egidijus, some of your posts read like you are paying for them by the letter.
The Handbook itself is online, so saying the actual regulations (other than what's in the Handbook) are "online" is no help at all unless you specify where they are. Where can I find the "2004-3 motion" you mention?
In the post I asked about, you said, "The whole Youth tournament regulations were replaced with 2004-3 motion". If you mean the "whole" thing, then all of Handbook section 7 is out of date (and not just one clause). If it's only one clause, why exaggerate? There are already enough people on this board and elsewhere who do that.
grr.
You should look historically how it evolved. A very old rules were amended by time to time. Some got in the handbook some not (most likely 'Motion Bunning/Taylor in 2002-3 GL1 From AGM' was missed.) In 2004 the whole youth section was moved and approved. The text has no mentioning of Bunning/Taylor. The version got online (probably). Three-four years ago the online Handbook was revised and probably then the Bunning/Taylor got back. Though I think illegally :)
I have these my notes:
First Presentation in 03-04GL4.pdf
• M.Barron proposed a new version in 03-04GL5.pdf
• Results of Voting in 04-05GL1.pdf Motion Passed with some exceptions.
grr.
You should look historically how it evolved. A very old rules were amended by time to time. Some got in the handbook some not (most likely 'Motion Bunning/Taylor in 2002-3 GL1 From AGM' was missed.) In 2004 the whole youth section was moved and approved...
I was afraid you'd say something like that.
I thought the CFC online Handbook was an up-to-date compilation of the CFC's evolving rules.
If you're right, it isn't; and the only way to know what the current rules are is to read through every Govs Letter and all the AGM reports and keep track of every vote and every amendment...
As I said, I thought that's what the online Handbook already does. (it certainly ought to)
Can somebody post a currently-in-effect CFC policy -- either from the Govs or from a CFC AGM (prior to the one last week) -- which is different from what's currently in the Handbook's section 7?
I thought the CFC online Handbook was an up-to-date compilation of the CFC's evolving rules.
If you're right, it isn't; and the only way to know what the current rules are is to read through every Govs Letter and all the AGM reports and keep track of every vote and every amendment...
As I said, I thought that's what the online Handbook already does. (it certainly ought to)
Can somebody post a currently-in-effect CFC policy -- either from the Govs or from a CFC AGM (prior to the one last week) -- which is different from what's currently in the Handbook's section 7?
I would suggest you try and contact Patrick McDonald.
There have been several people in the past few years trying to update the handbook, with motions that have been passed. It's a big job.
Can somebody post a currently-in-effect CFC policy -- either from the Govs or from a CFC AGM (prior to the one last week) -- which is different from what's currently in the Handbook's section 7?
John, I think the most knowledgable people to answer these questions are Bob Armstrong and Michael von Keitz. I will email them both and ask them to comment.
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