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Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
The fact that a Canadian organization would seriously condone sending a high school student to Iran to play chess and accept that they must wear a hijab is both absurd and revolting. Hal claims the player is fine with it, but seriously, how many young people truly have the life experience to understand the full nature of this situation. Sure, they shouldn't be prevented from playing if they want to ( and fully understand the risks in Iran ), but the CFC shouldn't support FIDE on this.
Last edited by Duncan Smith; Friday, 30th September, 2016, 03:32 PM.
The fact that a Canadian organization would seriously condone sending a high school student to Iran to play chess and accept that they must wear a hijab is both absurd and revolting. Hal claims the player is fine with it, but seriously, how many young people truly have the life experience to understand the full nature of this situation. Sure, they shouldn't be prevented from playing if they want to ( and fully understsnd the risks in Iran ), but the CFC shouldn't support FIDE on this.
Good points Duncan. Qiyu has been all over the world playing chess, with her parent in tow, and likely have a lot more informed position than most in Canada would on the cultural situation in Iran.
Obviously safety is a concern to everybody, and Hal has been working on all aspects of that with FIDE.
Last edited by Fred McKim; Friday, 30th September, 2016, 04:53 PM.
Reason: Iran not Iraq
Re: Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
Duncan, this isn't directed point blank at you, but it does include your comment
I don't know if this is absolutely equal, but there is certainly some commonality.
I recall visiting Catholic churches in Europe and my spouse and daughter were directed to cover their shoulders inside and weren't allowed in unless they had. Who is offended by their shoulders being exposed? I don't hear a great challenge to that demand. We want them to conform while here, but don't want to conform while there seems hypocritical to me.
Re: Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
In many of these situations, there is an attempt by religious leaders to control or subjugate woman according to "tradition". I don't deny the rights of anyone to accept the playing conditions in Iran or to enter those Catholic churches, you just wouldn't see me do either. And I don't think it's wise for Canadian organizations to openly support events that defy accepted Canadian values.
Last edited by Duncan Smith; Friday, 30th September, 2016, 05:08 PM.
Good points Duncan. Qiyu has been all over the world playing chess, with her parent in tow, and likely have a lot more informed position than most in Canada would on the cultural situation in Iraq.
Obviously safety is a concern to everybody, and Hal has been working on all aspects of that with FIDE.
Fred, WTF are you talking about? The situation is in Iran, not Iraq. The Canadian govt can not guarantee the safety of Canadians in Iran but somehow you think Hal can get FIDE to do a better job? You really are a naive moron. The so called culture of Iran is one of oppression starting with Sharia Law and ending with Canada having a terrible relationship with Iran after there famous and heroic assistance in 1979 in rescuing some of the American hostages. Suggesting to any Canadian that it is a good idea to go there on the strength of FIDE's assurances is just plain irresponsible.
Fred, WTF are you talking about? The situation is in Iran, not Iraq. The Canadian govt can not guarantee the safety of Canadians in Iran but somehow you think Hal can get FIDE to do a better job? You really are a naive moron. The so called culture of Iran is one of oppression starting with Sharia Law and ending with Canada having a terrible relationship with Iran after there famous and heroic assistance in 1979 in rescuing some of the American hostages. Suggesting to any Canadian that it is a good idea to go there on the strength of FIDE's assurances is just plain irresponsible.
Wow Sid, chill a bit. Did it occur to you that Fred's use of "IraQ" might have been an unintended typo since it differs from "IraN" only in the last character??
All he seemed to be saying was that Qiyu and her family are experienced travellers and can make their own determination.
I am no fan of IllusionOf or FIDE either but I don't think Fred was even hinting that everyone should trust FIDE (with or without Hal's involvement) to do anything sensible.
Calling people morons is not called for.
Fred, WTF are you talking about? The situation is in Iran, not Iraq. The Canadian govt can not guarantee the safety of Canadians in Iran but somehow you think Hal can get FIDE to do a better job? You really are a naive moron. The so called culture of Iran is one of oppression starting with Sharia Law and ending with Canada having a terrible relationship with Iran after there famous and heroic assistance in 1979 in rescuing some of the American hostages. Suggesting to any Canadian that it is a good idea to go there on the strength of FIDE's assurances is just plain irresponsible.
Thanks for the usual vote of confidence, Sid.
What I meant is that the Zhou family will be making an informed decision based on all of the facts in front of them.
Is the CFC happy the event is in Iran ? Obviously not. The Executive are still discussing the situation.
Re: Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
Perhaps a relevant question would be if any chess players have participated in an official FIDE event and come to harm in a sketchy country. I believe it is pretty rare but I am unsure. I recall some robberies at a bank during the Moscow Olympiad back on the 90's. FIDE is seeking a stay and play venue so hopefully it will be possible to stay inside the fence. The Executive is not encouraging our champion to go - we have simply asked how the family feels about it. Fred is right - they are very experienced travellers and can make their own call. And no we are not happy about the venue.
Perhaps a relevant question would be if any chess players have participated in an official FIDE event and come to harm in a sketchy country. I believe it is pretty rare but I am unsure. I recall some robberies at a bank during the Moscow Olympiad back on the 90's. FIDE is seeking a stay and play venue so hopefully it will be possible to stay inside the fence. The Executive is not encouraging our champion to go - we have simply asked how the family feels about it. Fred is right - they are very experienced travellers and can make their own call. And no we are not happy about the venue.
The more relevant question is why do chess federations support and endorse "sketchy" FIDE leadership that discourages western sponsorship and thus many events end up in "sketchy" countries. The answer can be summed up in one word.... corruption.
Fred is not right, here is what he said in his post
Originally posted by Fred Mckim
Obviously safety is a concern to everybody, and Hal has been working on all aspects of that with FIDE.
Fenced or not fenced off does not provide safety for players against a hostile governmental regime. This is particularly true in the case of Canada that has a long standing acrimonious relationship with Iran. The idea that FIDE with your help could somehow make this situation better for a Canadian chessplayer that chooses to go to Iran is idiotic.
Duncan, this isn't directed point blank at you, but it does include your comment
I don't know if this is absolutely equal, but there is certainly some commonality.
I recall visiting Catholic churches in Europe and my spouse and daughter were directed to cover their shoulders inside and weren't allowed in unless they had. Who is offended by their shoulders being exposed? I don't hear a great challenge to that demand. We want them to conform while here, but don't want to conform while there seems hypocritical to me.
The difference is that this was in one place-a church, vs. the religious oppressing law being enforced in the entire country and including the visitors.
It is pretty sad that FIDE couldn't organize the event in a normal country.
Re: Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
You did not answer my question Sid, though you seem quite content to answer your own and it is quite beside the point.
My suggestion is that FIDE has an excellent record of awarding bids to organizers whose attention to security has ensured the safety of its participants. Iran has organized several high level events recently and has met this standard every time. If I am wrong I welcome a refutation. You are quite right that I cannot make this event any safer – I can only seek clarification and make suggestions. Your inference that the hostile Iranian regime will come through the fence and incarcerate a number of chess players is… noted.
You did not answer my question Sid, though you seem quite content to answer your own and it is quite beside the point.
My suggestion is that FIDE has an excellent record of awarding bids to organizers whose attention to security has ensured the safety of its participants. Iran has organized several high level events recently and has met this standard every time. If I am wrong I welcome a refutation. You are quite right that I cannot make this event any safer – I can only seek clarification and make suggestions. Your inference that the hostile Iranian regime will come through the fence and incarcerate a number of chess players is… noted.
I personally know people that were harassed by the Libyan authorities during the World Championship of 2004 including one that was interrogated on the suspicion that he may be a spy because his last name sounded too Jewish for their taste.
My point about the fence is that it is of little value against a government that might for example plant something in someones luggage at the airport on arrival or departure from the airport and then arrest them on trumped up charges. I thought that even you could envision scenarios like that.
Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Saturday, 1st October, 2016, 06:37 PM.
Re: Women will be forced to compete in hijabs at the next world championship in Iran
So Sid, is your stance that the CFC should FORBID the winner of the Women's Closed from attending the tournament?
I fail to see the logic here. Let's walk through the chain of events.
1) The Canadian Women's Closed was announced this summer, before the announcement of the tournament being held in Iran.
2) The event was for the most part privately sponsored and organized by one individual.
3) The prize was coverage of the flight costs to the event.
4) The announcement of the tournament being awarded to Iran only 2 weeks before the Canadian Women's Closed was held, too late to cancel the event, but early enough that the players knew where the event was going to be held.
So based on the assumption that the winner is well informed of the risks involved, and that the CFC is not actively encouraging or trying to coerce her to go, it appears to me that the decision is up to the winner (and in this case her parents). If she/they decide to go, then the best course of action for the CFC is to actively work with FIDE, the Canadian Government, the organizers in Iran, and any other relevant organizations to help ensure their safety and well being. What other actions at this point make sense?
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