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  • Hi Peter:

    I thought I had responded to your suggestion we discuss the ethics of the situation re the unvaccinated in my post # 2596 (Jan. 10)

    I was waiting for you to respond........I can't see that you did. I thought you had nothing to say about my position, one way or another.

    I'd be pleased to continue to tease out the ethical issue here........for example.....Quebec wanting to place a health surcharge on the unvaccinated in Quebec?

    First of all.......what does this say about our socialized health care system, with power somewhat divided between the provinces/territories, and the federal government, which has the funding to dole out, on its own terms. Are we moving to "user-pay"? Secondly, what about the "slippery slope" argument? Should we have a health surcharge on alcoholics?

    How is this for getting us re-started? Everyone else can feel free to jump in too!

    ~ Bob A (T-S/P)

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Bob Armstrong View Post
      Hi Sid:

      Your link: https://rumble.com/embed/vklfaf

      Appears very well-researched re global capitalism. I will not comment on the vaccination issue.

      I have posted it to my Fb site, Democratic Marxism - Global: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100064839518717
      (For transparency purposes - the posting has a rider that the Democratic Marxist Global Institute (DMGI) does not endorse any anti-vaccine positions). It

      was then shared to the Fb DM Discussion Group, Democratic Marxist Global Forum (DMGF). From there it went to my personal Fb account (The REAL News).

      Thanks

      ~ Bob A (T-S/P)
      Originally posted by Bob Armstrong View Post
      I will not comment on the vaccination issue.
      Why not? If you think the film creator has got it wrong somewhere on this issue, please tell us. My impression is that a massive amount of corruption courtesy of the elite "capitalists" is being used to abuse the little guy (mostly middle class) to take away their power and their property using health safety as a pretext and as the film appears to accurately portray has been in the planning for a long time.
      https://twitter.com/MichaelPSenger/s...30348324380674
      Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Wednesday, 12th January, 2022, 04:57 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Bob Armstrong View Post
        Hi Peter:

        I thought I had responded to your suggestion we discuss the ethics of the situation re the unvaccinated in my post # 2596 (Jan. 10)

        I was waiting for you to respond........I can't see that you did. I thought you had nothing to say about my position, one way or another.

        I'd be pleased to continue to tease out the ethical issue here........for example.....Quebec wanting to place a health surcharge on the unvaccinated in Quebec?

        First of all.......what does this say about our socialized health care system, with power somewhat divided between the provinces/territories, and the federal government, which has the funding to dole out, on its own terms. Are we moving to "user-pay"? Secondly, what about the "slippery slope" argument? Should we have a health surcharge on alcoholics?

        How is this for getting us re-started? Everyone else can feel free to jump in too!

        ~ Bob A (T-S/P)
        Hi Bob. I'm a little embarrassed because when you said, in your first response to me, that you saw this (i.e. how do we treat anti-vaxxers) as a sociology issue....I stopped reading. Oops! Now, having read your full first response plus the post copied above, my impression is that we're pretty much on the same wavelength! Since "Yup, I agree" doesn't usually make for an interesting discussion, I guess this is where I sign off.
        "We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office." - Aesop
        "Only the dead have seen the end of war." - Plato
        "If once a man indulges himself in murder, very soon he comes to think little of robbing; and from robbing he comes next to drinking and Sabbath-breaking, and from that to incivility and procrastination." - Thomas De Quincey

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Peter McKillop View Post
          I don't understand your parking lot scenario.
          Oh, the parking lot thing was an extrapolation of just how far things could swing the other way in 2 or 3 years' time. So what I wrote was

          "Ah, Peter McKillop, yeah i remember him, he almost called us all assholes. Well, i know it's 120 degrees out here due to climate change and there's no shade, but he'll have to stay out here in the hospital parking lot until there's a guy with a hacksaw ready to work on him."

          This is imagining that 2 or 3 years from now, the 85% who received an mRNA vaccine are all getting "sick" (i.e. having various medical emergencies, perhaps organ failures as an example) at roughly the same time, overfilling hospitals much much worse than is going on right now, so that only the unvaccinated are left to care for them (hence the "hacksaw" reference) and most of them cannot even get inside the hospitals and are being triaged outside in the parking lots.

          Not an impossible situation. Science fiction writers are probably already hard at work exploring this scenario, and their books or shows on Netflix should be coming out soon.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Pargat Perrer View Post

            Oh, the parking lot thing was an extrapolation of just how far things could swing the other way in 2 or 3 years' time. So what I wrote was

            "Ah, Peter McKillop, yeah i remember him, he almost called us all assholes. Well, i know it's 120 degrees out here due to climate change and there's no shade, but he'll have to stay out here in the hospital parking lot until there's a guy with a hacksaw ready to work on him."

            This is imagining that 2 or 3 years from now, the 85% who received an mRNA vaccine are all getting "sick" (i.e. having various medical emergencies, perhaps organ failures as an example) at roughly the same time, overfilling hospitals much much worse than is going on right now, so that only the unvaccinated are left to care for them (hence the "hacksaw" reference) and most of them cannot even get inside the hospitals and are being triaged outside in the parking lots.

            Not an impossible situation. Science fiction writers are probably already hard at work exploring this scenario, and their books or shows on Netflix should be coming out soon.
            https://www.meetmeforcoffee.co/dr-pe...ight-covid-19/
            Fauci: “Omicron variant will infect ‘just about everybody’ regardless of vaccination status.” Well, so much for all those mask mandates, lockdowns, curfews, vaccine passes, and quarantine camps. Ouch! Risk of Hospitalization very very low for vaccinated...even lower for covid recovered (almost zero!) and low for unvaccinated as well. Hopefully, Omicron is a natural vaccine although it is likely lab-made and longitudinal consequences are unknown.
            https://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...-live-updates/
            Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Thursday, 13th January, 2022, 09:43 AM.

            Comment


            • Update on Ontario hospitalization this morning:

              in ICU has been rising steadily
              Dec 21 - 165
              Jan 8 - 385
              Jan 12 - 505
              but today, small drop to 500.

              Has the Omicron wave peaked?

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Bob Gillanders View Post
                Update on Ontario hospitalization this morning:

                in ICU has been rising steadily
                Dec 21 - 165
                Jan 8 - 385
                Jan 12 - 505
                but today, small drop to 500.

                Has the Omicron wave peaked?
                If I may suggest, "rolling averages" are better for such questions.
                And they smooth out graphs, making them more comprehendable.

                Comment


                • Re: Has Omicron wave peaked -- I don't believe this small a change is statistically significant. More data is needed to determine a trend, over the coming days. I think we could be headed for 1,000 or more in ICU within the next few weeks, province-wide.

                  I stand by my earlier prediction, of a long, hard slog for Ontario health care, during the next 3 months, especially for the regions within 150 km. of Toronto. This is primarily because of the very large number of unvaccinated adults living there, and the 'urban dominance' of the virus. There are about as many unvaccinated adults living in that region, about one million, as the entire population of Saskatchewan (just over one million), or the entire population of Nova Scotia (just under one million). Omicron is showing a powerful ability to seriously infect the unvaccinated, but less of an ability to seriously infect those who are vaccinated, whether partially or fully. The more rural regions, such as the North, and parts of Eastern Ontario, will recover faster from Omicron (fewer people overall, less interpersonal interaction, higher ratios of care resources per person). The new COVID case counts in Kingston are dropping significantly; I think that Kingston will once again be able to soon accept patients from other jurisdictions, as it did repeatedly at earlier phases of the pandemic. It probably has the best resources of any health unit in the province.

                  Two hopeful data notes from today:
                  1) The site cnn.com puts Canada at an index of 191, meaning we have 191 vaccinations given per 100 Canadians, on average. Their rank puts us at #25 in the world, but in my view, a more accurate international ranking for us is #21, since non-independent small population entities Guernsey, Jersey, and Isle of Man are listed independently and ahead of us, when all three are part of the United Kingdom at the United Nations. As well, the small population Faeroe Islands is ahead of Canada, but is in fact part of Denmark at the international level.
                  Next up for Canada is an index of 200, or two vaccinations per Canadian, on average. We will hit this at 76 million vaccinations, taking Canada's estimated population as 38 million (the 2021 Canadian census is due to be published in February, and that will provide a more accurate total). At an average of 400,000 vaccinations per day on weekdays, during the past couple of weeks, we will probably reach 200 within two weeks.
                  2) For Ontario, more than 5 million booster doses have now been delivered, and this covers more than one third of the province's population. This is courtesy of thestar.com, the Toronto Star's website. Only people 18 and over are so far eligible for the booster, so judged from that perspective, more than 40 per cent of those eligible have received it, and there are just over 78 per cent of the population with two shots. The booster program started December 1, 2021, about six weeks ago, so that is a very strong uptake. For the record, this is about as many people as the entire population of British Columbia, and about equal to the combined population of Atlantic Canada, Manitoba, Saskatchewan, and the three northern territories. This gives Ontario an index of about 196, or ahead of Canada, by about 5.

                  Comment



                  • The Americas - Province of Quebec, Canada

                    Post-COVID Booster

                    Quebec now recommends booster for people recovering from COVID-19.


                    Several Montreal COVID-19 vaccination centres are also now offering the booster shot [the third shot] to all adults on a walk-in basis.


                    https://montrealgazette.com/news/local-news/quebec-now-recommends-booster-for-people-recovering-from-covid-19?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Montreal%20Gazette%20Headline%20News%20-%20Weekdays%202022-01-13&utm_term=MG_HeadlineNews

                    ~ Bob A (T-S/P)

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Frank Dixon View Post
                      Re: Has Omicron wave peaked -- I don't believe this small a change is statistically significant. More data is needed to determine a trend, over the coming days. I think we could be headed for 1,000 or more in ICU within the next few weeks, province-wide.

                      I stand by my earlier prediction, of a long, hard slog for Ontario health care, during the next 3 months, especially for the regions within 150 km. of Toronto. This is primarily because of the very large number of unvaccinated adults living there, and the 'urban dominance' of the virus. There are about as many unvaccinated adults living in that region, about one million, as the entire population of Saskatchewan (just over one million), or the entire population of Nova Scotia (just under one million). Omicron is showing a powerful ability to seriously infect the unvaccinated, but less of an ability to seriously infect those who are vaccinated, whether partially or fully. The more rural regions, such as the North, and parts of Eastern Ontario, will recover faster from Omicron (fewer people overall, less interpersonal interaction, higher ratios of care resources per person). The new COVID case counts in Kingston are dropping significantly; I think that Kingston will once again be able to soon accept patients from other jurisdictions, as it did repeatedly at earlier phases of the pandemic. It probably has the best resources of any health unit in the province.

                      A year ago I wouldn't have been worried about people from all of Toronto as there were hot spots only in highrise neighbourhoods (in the NW, next to Brampton, and NE). But today the map shows rates 10X higher in all areas of Toronto. The swamped airport can only do random tests. Americans bringing it here, and Canadians taking it to tourist resorts. It's hit homeless shelters and unmasked people wander on subway trains. Schools will reopen and a couple of kids have died. Toronto's double vaccinated rate is double 78.49% (2,445,000 people, 1,043,000 with third), single 83.55%, higher than average.

                      From Public Health Ontario

                      Cumulative rate per 100,000
                      Peel 9.55
                      Toronto 8.23
                      York 7.16
                      Windsor 7.0
                      Hamilton 6.93
                      Durham 6.1
                      Niagara 5.65
                      Halton 5.63
                      Waterloo 5.43
                      Ottawa 4.96
                      Guelph 4.92
                      Chatham 4.58
                      Muskoka 4.48
                      Kingston 3.7
                      Thunder Bay 3.43
                      Peterborough 2.78
                      North Bay 1.66
                      Last edited by Erik Malmsten; Thursday, 13th January, 2022, 09:46 PM. Reason: update total

                      Comment


                      • Screen Shot 2022-01-13 at 9.33.30 PM.png
                        Originally posted by Erik Malmsten View Post


                        A year ago I wouldn't have been worried about people from all of Toronto as there were hot spots only in highrise neighbourhoods (in the NW, next to Brampton, and NE). But today the map shows rates 10X higher in all areas of Toronto. The swamped airport can only do random tests. Americans bringing it here, and Canadians taking it to tourist resorts. It's hit homeless shelters and unmasked people wander on subway trains. Schools will reopen and a couple of kids have died. Toronto's double vaccinated rate is double 78.49% (2,445,000 people, 1,043,000 with third), single 83.55%, higher than average.

                        From Public Health Ontario

                        Cumulative rate per 100,000
                        Peel 9.55
                        Toronto 8.23
                        York 7.16
                        Windsor 7.0
                        Hamilton 6.93
                        Durham 6.1
                        Niagara 5.65
                        Halton 5.63
                        Waterloo 5.43
                        Ottawa 4.96
                        Guelph 4.92
                        Chatham 4.58
                        Muskoka 4.48
                        Kingston 3.7
                        Thunder Bay 3.43
                        Peterborough 2.78
                        North Bay 1.66
                        Make no mistake about it, In Ontario, it is a pandemic of the Vaccinated.

                        https://covid-19.ontario.ca/data

                        Comment


                        • I am not satisfied:


                          COVID Conspiracy Theory # 1 - that the world governments and multi-national pharmaceutical companies have conspired together to make the world sick, in order to maxiimize profits of these companies.

                          I am satisfied:

                          - that there is a whole universe of non-human viruses out there, which are transferable to humans, and make them sick.
                          - that our world capitalist system sees nothing wrong with the multi-national pharmaceutical companies making obscene profits off human illness.

                          ~ Bob A (T-S/P)
                          Last edited by Bob Armstrong; Friday, 14th January, 2022, 09:28 AM.

                          Comment


                          • Dr. Anthony Fauci is the highest paid US government employee at well over 400k.

                            How'd that happen?

                            He is the director of a sub-department at the National Institute of Health. A sub-department director at well over 400k?

                            He is paid more than a five star general ... paid more than the president of the United States of America !!!

                            How'd that happen?


                            LOOL!!!

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Neil Frarey View Post
                              Dr. Anthony Fauci is the highest paid US government employee at well over 400k.

                              How'd that happen?

                              He is the director of a sub-department at the National Institute of Health. A sub-department director at well over 400k?

                              He is paid more than a five star general ... paid more than the president of the United States of America !!!

                              How'd that happen?


                              LOOL!!!
                              So what? He's highly qualified in his field. Meanwhile, the median total compensation for Fortune 500 CEOs in 2020 was about US$12.7 million. Average player salaries for the four major pro sports in North America are in the (roughly) US$ 2-5 million range. There are probably thousands of doctors, lawyers, and accountants across North America who are earning compensation in the US$ seven figure range. I didn't look up the exact numbers but I believe Lionel Messi's current contract pays him north of US$ 150 million per year. Is Lionel Messi going to save the world from a pandemic? No? Someone like Dr. Fauci might. US$ 400k seems like a bargain.
                              "We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office." - Aesop
                              "Only the dead have seen the end of war." - Plato
                              "If once a man indulges himself in murder, very soon he comes to think little of robbing; and from robbing he comes next to drinking and Sabbath-breaking, and from that to incivility and procrastination." - Thomas De Quincey

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Bob Armstrong View Post
                                I am not satisfied:


                                - that the world governments and multi-national pharmaceutical companies have conspired together to make the world sick, in order to maxiimize profits of these companies.

                                I am satisfied:

                                - that there is a whole universe of non-human viruses out there, which are transferable to humans, and make them sick.
                                - that our world capitalist system sees nothing wrong with the multi-national pharmaceutical companies making obscene profits off human illness.

                                ~ Bob A (T-S/P)
                                Originally posted by Bob Armstrong View Post
                                That there is a whole universe of non-human viruses out there, which are transferable to humans, and make them sick.)

                                Nope, there is no animal reservoir of the chimeric SarsCov2 virus. The theory that this is a virus that is naturally evolved has been debunked entirely. An article appeared in Nature last year signed off by 26 scientists with this theory. As it turns out they all had ties to the Wuhan bioweapons lab and a recent Freedom of Information Act for Dr. Fauci's emails showed that he tried to cover up the fact that the virus was made in a lab funded by his NIH and NIAID and in fact, was a collaboration between the bioweapons lab in Fort Detrick North Carolina by a scientist named Ralph Barivc and the Chinese Communist Parties lab ib Wuhan. Dr. Fauci's emails reveal that he organized the fake article in Nature last year as part of the coverup for his crimes.
                                Furthermore, the so-called Vaccine turns your body into a pathogenic spike protein factory that weakens your immune system more and more with each booster
                                shot. Hence the reason we now have a "pandemic of the vaccinated"
                                This vaccine was developed by the same bioweapons lab. and was bought by Moderna in 2019 before the pandemic even started. Are you "satisfied yet"?...no? The number one bestseller book in nonfiction today is this

                                https://www.amazon.com/Real-Anthony-...s%2C114&sr=8-1

                                The book is heavily referenced and I challenge you to find any fact that is not true in this awesome book.
                                Last edited by Sid Belzberg; Friday, 14th January, 2022, 05:58 AM.

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