Female Chess Players and Their Discomfort With Male Chess Players

[Brad Thomson]

This thread is interesting and quite philosophical, it relates to the age-old battle of the sexes. In the beginning men dominate because of physical strength. Then women fight back the only way they can, with the threat of withholding sex or of offering their favours somewhere else. Men need sex more than women, so the threat works. And here we are thousands of years later, but the human situation is still the same. Boys are still boys and girls are still girls. As a species we are immature, we have yet to grow up. And of course our time is running out.

[Pargat Perrer]

This thread is interesting and quite philosophical, it relates to the age-old battle of the sexes. In the beginning men dominate because of physical strength. Then women fight back the only way they can, with the threat of withholding sex or of offering their favours somewhere else. Men need sex more than women, so the threat works. And here we are thousands of years later, but the human situation is still the same. Boys are still boys and girls are still girls. As a species we are immature, we have yet to grow up. And of course our time is running out.

Yes, let's continue the philosophical part of the discussion.

"Men need sex more than women" -- agreed. And it seems also that men need chess more than women.

Are chess and sex somehow one and the same? Nudge, nudge, wink, wink, know what I mean, eh? Know what I mean?

Or am I overthinking? (apologies to Peter McKillop)

[Bob Armstrong]

Males who are still alive do notice women they consider, cute, beautiful or sexy..........in all paths of life. So why should chess be any different?

The issue is not whether males find some women attractive......the issue is declining to follow up!

We males are getting a clear message from women/girl chess players, that in chess tournaments, they are not looking for male "friends", and they would request not to be hit upon in this setting.

This request seems clear, regardless of how a woman/girl may dress.

~ Bob A (T-S/P)

[Peter McKillop]

Males who are still alive do notice women they consider, cute, beautiful or sexy..........in all paths of life. So why should chess be any different?

The issue is not whether males find some women attractive......the issue is declining to follow up!

We males are getting a clear message from women/girl chess players, that in chess tournaments, they are not looking for male "friends", and they would request not to be hit upon in this setting.

This request seems clear, regardless of how a woman/girl may dress.

~ Bob A (T-S/P)

Right you are, Bob!

[Erik Malmsten]

Also, from that article - With my daughter, for instance, the guy I found talking to her once tried to strike up a conversation with her in the skittles room and offer "advice" on how she could have won her games. I couldn't always be there to stop it because I'd still be playing a tournament round myself.

"Mansplaining" I've been guilty of that. A women player was upset that I said it was a theoretical draw. But it can also be an unhealthy attempt by a man to become a "mentor" or "friend," to exchange sexual glances, have dinner and so on. And when a group of men are leaning over, trapping her in, competing for her attention, it can be very uncomfortable.

[Erik Malmsten]

This thread is interesting and quite philosophical, it relates to the age-old battle of the sexes. In the beginning men dominate because of physical strength. Then women fight back the only way they can, with the threat of withholding sex or of offering their favours somewhere else. Men need sex more than women, so the threat works. And here we are thousands of years later, but the human situation is still the same. Boys are still boys and girls are still girls. As a species we are immature, we have yet to grow up. And of course our time is running out.

There is the theory that in the beginning "human society was matriarchal—or at least "woman-centered" and goddess-worshipping—from the Paleolithic era, 1.5 to 2 million years ago, until sometime around 3000 BCE" Men were the dangerous hunters because they were dispensable. With the development of farming of animals and farm pens to protect from theft, power shifted to males. And with male farm ownership it was necessary to know which sons were the heirs, so women's sexuality were controlled.

As for sex, if men were any good at satisfying women, they might find that women need it as much. I've heard that men cleaning the house is great foreplay. But it's also an individual thing, with some needing little, others alot. We pile alot of our psychological needs into the sex basket.

[Henri Hughes]

What type of shorts are we talking about? I recall a female player wearing cut-off jeans that were skimpier than a pair of erotic panties (not to mention a very light tank-top). A few men did in fact make remarks (a couple of women too), many at least glared at her, and she came to me to complain about it. I do not recall being particularly sympathetic.

Now, I am not absolutely certain about this, but I do seem to remember an article in En Passant from my times at the CFC wherein Todd Southam commented upon males, or perhaps one male, being distracted by the provocative apparel of a female player.

its not a females responsibilty to dress a certain way so men wont look at them, nor is it there fault if some regressed creep stares at them because of his own pent up crap. this is patriarchal bs that is being projected onto the female chess population.

[Henri Hughes]

This thread is interesting and quite philosophical, it relates to the age-old battle of the sexes. In the beginning men dominate because of physical strength. Then women fight back the only way they can, with the threat of withholding sex or of offering their favours somewhere else. Men need sex more than women, so the threat works. And here we are thousands of years later, but the human situation is still the same. Boys are still boys and girls are still girls. As a species we are immature, we have yet to grow up. And of course our time is running out.

implicating that women can only get what they want through sexual means?

[Pargat Perrer]

Males who are still alive do notice women they consider, cute, beautiful or sexy..........in all paths of life. So why should chess be any different?

The issue is not whether males find some women attractive......the issue is declining to follow up!

We males are getting a clear message from women/girl chess players, that in chess tournaments, they are not looking for male "friends", and they would request not to be hit upon in this setting.

This request seems clear, regardless of how a woman/girl may dress.

~ Bob A (T-S/P)

So you ask "why should chess be any different?" meaning males should still "notice" females they consider attractive .... and then you state that males are being asked by the females "not to be hit upon in this setting" .... which setting, as I've mentioned here, requires the males to sit directly across from the females and often by distracted by the female's .... assets.

So tell us your opinion, Bob. Should males who are only doing what is natural, -- what they would be doing if a female came alone into a bar -- oblige the females in their request REGARDLESS OF HOW THE FEMALES DRESS?

If it is your opinion that yes, the males should oblige the females, then the next thing I ask is .... how do you police that? What should an organizer do to stop male "harassment" of females at mixed chess events?

Because I think it is a pipe dream that males are going to oblige the request without some kind of enforcement .... at which point, if such enforcement is brought in in some form, you would lose many MALES at chess tournaments.

[Pargat Perrer]

its not a females responsibilty to dress a certain way so men wont look at them, nor is it there fault if some regressed creep stares at them because of his own pent up crap. this is patriarchal bs that is being projected onto the female chess population.

So males who stare at pretty females are "regressed creeps"? I think you are guilty of your own form of bs. I could ask if you are a homosexual, but that would probably be considered a privacy invasion. Instead, I will simply assume you are a homosexual.

I would agree that males who sexually assault pretty females are regressed creeps. But staring? That is perfectly natural for a heterosexual male. Nothing regressed or creepy about it.

What I think is that this expectation of certain females (perhaps who are themselves homosexual) that they can dress in shorts or tank tops and NOT be stared at or hit on by males .... that expectation is where the true bs lies.

You can't stop Mother Nature.

[Pargat Perrer]

its not a females responsibilty to dress a certain way so men wont look at them ....

There are many cultures where that is simply NOT the case .... in many Arab countries, for example. You are thus imposing your own cultural beliefs onto chess, which is a global activity, with many prominent events held in Arab countries.

[Henri Hughes]

So males who stare at pretty females are "regressed creeps"? I think you are guilty of your own form of bs. I could ask if you are a homosexual, but that would probably be considered a privacy invasion. Instead, I will simply assume you are a homosexual.

I would agree that males who sexually assault pretty females are regressed creeps. But staring? That is perfectly natural for a heterosexual male. Nothing regressed or creepy about it.

What I think is that this expectation of certain females (perhaps who are themselves homosexual) that they can dress in shorts or tank tops and NOT be stared at or hit on by males .... that expectation is where the true bs lies.

You can't stop Mother Nature.

not sure how this has to do with my sexuality, feel free to continue making incorrect statements, i chose my wording carefully, yes LOOKING is natural, but having decency is to not stare, there is a big difference between the two.

[Henri Hughes]

There are many cultures where that is simply NOT the case .... in many Arab countries, for example. You are thus imposing your own cultural beliefs onto chess, which is a global activity, with many prominent events held in Arab countries.

im not discussing in a culural sense, your need to make assumptions leaves you quite blind to what im saying, I am simply commenting on the morality of the fact that men should be the ones to deal with themselves instead of putting it on females because they cant keep themselves in check

[Bob Armstrong]

Hi Pargat:

Your Question to me: Should males who are only doing what is natural, -- what they would be doing if a female came alone into a bar -- oblige the females in their request REGARDLESS OF HOW THE FEMALES DRESS?

Answer (Not complicated) - YES.

~ Bob A (T-S/P)

[Peter McKillop]

.... I could ask if you are a homosexual, but that would probably be considered a privacy invasion. Instead, I will simply assume you are a homosexual.
....

WTF?!?! Why would you make a comment like this? Whatever Henri's sexuality is, how does it advance your arguments to make that comment? Explain!