If this is your first visit, be sure to
check out the FAQ by clicking the
link above. You may have to register
before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages,
select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
Policy / Politique
The fee for tournament organizers advertising on ChessTalk is $20/event or $100/yearly unlimited for the year.
Les frais d'inscription des organisateurs de tournoi sur ChessTalk sont de 20 $/événement ou de 100 $/année illimitée.
You can etransfer to Henry Lam at chesstalkforum at gmail dot com
Transfér à Henry Lam à chesstalkforum@gmail.com
Dark Knight / Le Chevalier Noir
General Guidelines
---- Nous avons besoin d'un traduction français!
Some Basics
1. Under Board "Frequently Asked Questions" (FAQs) there are 3 sections dealing with General Forum Usage, User Profile Features, and Reading and Posting Messages. These deal with everything from Avatars to Your Notifications. Most general technical questions are covered there. Here is a link to the FAQs. https://forum.chesstalk.com/help
2. Consider using the SEARCH button if you are looking for information. You may find your question has already been answered in a previous thread.
3. If you've looked for an answer to a question, and not found one, then you should consider asking your question in a new thread. For example, there have already been questions and discussion regarding: how to do chess diagrams (FENs); crosstables that line up properly; and the numerous little “glitches” that every new site will have.
4. Read pinned or sticky threads, like this one, if they look important. This applies especially to newcomers.
5. Read the thread you're posting in before you post. There are a variety of ways to look at a thread. These are covered under “Display Modes”.
6. Thread titles: please provide some details in your thread title. This is useful for a number of reasons. It helps ChessTalk members to quickly skim the threads. It prevents duplication of threads. And so on.
7. Unnecessary thread proliferation (e.g., deliberately creating a new thread that duplicates existing discussion) is discouraged. Look to see if a thread on your topic may have already been started and, if so, consider adding your contribution to the pre-existing thread. However, starting new threads to explore side-issues that are not relevant to the original subject is strongly encouraged. A single thread on the Canadian Open, with hundreds of posts on multiple sub-topics, is no better than a dozen threads on the Open covering only a few topics. Use your good judgment when starting a new thread.
8. If and/or when sub-forums are created, please make sure to create threads in the proper place.
Debate
9. Give an opinion and back it up with a reason. Throwaway comments such as "Game X pwnz because my friend and I think so!" could be considered pointless at best, and inflammatory at worst.
10. Try to give your own opinions, not simply those copied and pasted from reviews or opinions of your friends.
Unacceptable behavior and warnings
11. In registering here at ChessTalk please note that the same or similar rules apply here as applied at the previous Boardhost message board. In particular, the following content is not permitted to appear in any messages:
* Racism
* Hatred
* Harassment
* Adult content
* Obscene material
* Nudity or pornography
* Material that infringes intellectual property or other proprietary rights of any party
* Material the posting of which is tortious or violates a contractual or fiduciary obligation you or we owe to another party
* Piracy, hacking, viruses, worms, or warez
* Spam
* Any illegal content
* unapproved Commercial banner advertisements or revenue-generating links
* Any link to or any images from a site containing any material outlined in these restrictions
* Any material deemed offensive or inappropriate by the Board staff
12. Users are welcome to challenge other points of view and opinions, but should do so respectfully. Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Posts and threads with unacceptable content can be closed or deleted altogether. Furthermore, a range of sanctions are possible - from a simple warning to a temporary or even a permanent banning from ChessTalk.
Helping to Moderate
13. 'Report' links (an exclamation mark inside a triangle) can be found in many places throughout the board. These links allow users to alert the board staff to anything which is offensive, objectionable or illegal. Please consider using this feature if the need arises.
Advice for free
14. You should exercise the same caution with Private Messages as you would with any public posting.
15. Have fun!
(Thanks to Nigel Hanrahan for writing these up!)
$120,000 disappears into thin air and no questions asked!
Kevin Spraggett has very good web site and I always enjoy reading it. As far as disappearance of $120K, we have a case of a single greedy person who hired himself and paid wages also to himself without informing anyone else. Now, what you recommend we should do about this?
No recommendation on my side necessary as it is obvious case, isn't it?
No recommendation on my side necessary as it is obvious case, isn't it?
:(
well, Chris has patiently explained what has been done (some time ago I might add, you seem to be slow on reading the news... or is it only the chess tabloids you read?) and why. As you seem to be unhappy with what has been done, perhaps you SHOULD say what you expect to have been done.
This past week a perversely OCA-biased CFC Executive report into Mr. Thorvardsson's actions was released to the public.
At least the report was finished. Now it is Kevin's turn to releas his investigation about Canadian chess (TRUE COLOURS: THE RISE AND FALL OF ORGANIZED CHESS IN CANADA) Does he wait for April 1? :D
At least the report was finished. Now it is Kevin's turn to releas his investigation about Canadian chess (TRUE COLOURS: THE RISE AND FALL OF ORGANIZED CHESS IN CANADA) Does he wait for April 1? :D
First, we have to get his long awaited article on whatever that is "ALMOST COMPLETED" (as it has been for over a year)
Re: $120,000 disappears into thin air and no questions asked!
I don't think we have gotten anywhere near to the heart of the matter on this file as of yet.
It is a matter of public record that Barry Thorvardson, while serving as OCA President, broke OCA regulations on accountability measures for this $120,000grant from the Trillium Foundation, and that he awarded the bulk of this money to himself, without either most people knowing about it, or any advice or counsel from the OCA Executive apparently being sought in advance.
Once those precepts have been established, anything further that Barry said on the matter has to be viewed as potentially tainted. It was at that stage that outside investigators (likely Ontario Provincial Police, white-collar crime division) should have been informed of the matter. These specialists, supported by our tax dollars, are skilled in uncovering the truth in cases such as this, as pertaining to potential criminal violations. With all due respect to those in Canadian chess leadership who worked on this file, such as Hal Bond and Eric Van Dusen, both of whom I admire greatly, neither they nor anyone else in a position of leadership in the chess community has the requisite training and experience to uncover potential criminal fraud. It is also important to have an 'arms-length' investigation conducted; Barry is a chess organizer and an insider, with multiple connections in Canadian chess, including connections to those who were 'investigating' him.
The Canadian chess community got neither expert inquiry nor arms-length inquiry in this case, so it is not surprising, apart from the facts of the case, that no sanctions were applied. I'm not optimistic, either, that Canadian chess can or will learn the appropriate lessons from this case.
First, we have to get his [Spraggett's] long awaited article on whatever that is "ALMOST COMPLETED" (as it has been for over a year)
It has just been announced as "coming in 2010". The earliest reference I could find was in May 2009, when KS announced "This much anticipated article will appear within 3 weeks time".
I don't think we have gotten anywhere near to the heart of the matter on this file as of yet.
It was at that stage that outside investigators (likely Ontario Provincial Police, white-collar crime division) should have been informed of the matter. These specialists, supported by our tax dollars, are skilled in uncovering the truth in cases such as this, as pertaining to potential criminal violations.
All of this is very well stated. There has been a crime. Perhaps it is time to CALL THE COPS! Would you like to pick up the phone Frank?
Why is it that everyone chooses to 'pass the buck' ( including myself ) on matters such as these? Are we all satisfied about this entire matter after the OCA cleaned up their shop? And how much is there that we don't know?
Another disgusting page re: Organized chess in Canada
Re: $120,000 disappears into thin air and no questions asked!
The most common type of fraud encountered in Canada is asset misappropriation, although accounting fraud and money laundering are also prevalent. All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Case closed a year ago.
Last edited by Ernest Klubis; Wednesday, 30th December, 2009, 11:00 AM.
A computer beat me in chess, but it was no match when it came to kickboxing
Re: $120,000 disappears into thin air and no questions asked!
So what could be done for chess with $100,000 anyway?
Maybe 10 master tournaments with IM norms possible.
Maybe 2 GM tournaments with GM norms possible.
Maybe one humungous Swiss tourney with a 100 G prize fund with 2,000 players.
Maybe invite Garry Kasparov for breakfast (I've heard he charges at least twice that for lunch!)
Any other ideas?
The most common type of fraud encountered in Canada is asset misappropriation, although accounting fraud and money laundering are also prevalent. All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Case closed a year ago.
Before people start bandying words such as "crime" about, it might be helpful if they specified the following:
- Exactly what "crime" was committed?
- Who committed it?
- How did they commit it?
- Who was the victim?
- Can it be proven?
- Who is supposed to involve the police, and if not the victim, then why?
In no way am I defending what happened, but it was Trillium's money and they apparently consider the matter closed. I don't see how you could demostrate anything other than ethical behaviour if the OCA is the perceived victim, and the average OCA member was not a direct victim since it was never their money in the first place, nor was it intended for them.
Thanks for the information, Kerry and Erik. I'm sure there are a lot of people with a lot of good ideas on how that money might have been spent. For example, for round numbers let's say York Region District School Board has 200 elementary schools (I think this number is a little high but it makes for easy figuring). Consider the following, just for discussion, as an injection into the school system in exchange for the school board's commitment to including chess in the junior grades' curricula:
1. 200 schools x 30 CFC "school tubes" per school x $10 (approx) per tube = $60,000.
2. 200 schools x 2 CFC "Tom O'Donnell's Manual for Schools" per school
x $25/manual = $10,000.
3. engage CMA to run a train-the-trainer program for the school board - say, 2 teachers
per school with 40 teachers per training session at, say, $1,500 per session (don't
know if this figure is realistic but presumably the board would be providing the pre-
-mises for free) = $15,000.
Presumably the CFC would have been a few thousand dollars better off based on its mark up on the manuals and school tubes, CMA would have been happy and the board and its students would have been happy. And you'd still have $35,000 to spend.
Anyway, my point here is not to persecute Barry. He may be guilty of an important error in judgement with respect to how chess might best have benefitted from the grant but I'm assuming that he did nothing wrong from a legal perspective. However, I think it's fair to ask that all of the information pertaining to this fiasco be made public. Let's understand where we/the OCA went wrong so that the chance of something like this happening again is reduced. Perhaps the doors of the Trillium Foundation are closed to the OCA forever. Too bad.
"We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office." - Aesop
"Only the dead have seen the end of war." - Plato
"If once a man indulges himself in murder, very soon he comes to think little of robbing; and from robbing he comes next to drinking and Sabbath-breaking, and from that to incivility and procrastination." - Thomas De Quincey
Tweet
Comment