The One and Only Climate Change thread...

[Paul Bonham]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

Forbidden by who? She seems to be just full of excuses. Why is her abilities always used for comfort, you have to think that some of the people she is talking to beyond the grave are in the bad afterlife, not everyone lives a good life.

Forbidden by the same laws that govern all our existence on Earth, such as that we absolutely cannot go back in time and change something in the past (at least not without somehow jumping into a parallel universe). That makes perfect logical sense. What you need to realize in order to grow (spiritually) is that there are limitations placed on us here that we simply cannot break through. Knowing our future in great detail is one of these limitations.

That just sounds stupid to me, love holds all of creation/existence together?? It sounds terribly poetic and pretty, but that's a fairy-tale, it's a nice lie but nothing more. It makes absolutely no sense to me, love is just a chemical reaction in the brain nothing more, but yet somehow that holds all of everything together?

Anyone who does not acknowledge the power of love is lost (but not lost forever, by grace). Additionally not believing that they are lost, nor understanding why, is in indication of extreme spiritual immaturity.

I don't buy that for a second, suicide is the ultimate wrong? Is she a moron? I guess slaughtering millions of people is less evil/wrong then killing yourself? That is just illogical and foolish.

Well, Adam, think for a moment. If someone proved to you beyond a shadow of a doubt that your soul will live forever and will not suffer want or need (just hold onto that for a moment, don't fight it), what value would you then place on your Earthly existence? Practically zero. That means slaughtering millions of Earth people has no real significance, especially when you add to that the fact that all of those millions that were slaughtered agreed before they even came to Earth that they would be slaughtered!

But -- and this is a very big but -- it is not meant for us as a civilization or as a species to place zero value on Earthly existence. It is meant for MOST OF US to place value on it and thus to have a justice system that punishes those who slaughter or do other injustices to other people. You are showing yourself to be, in your current incarnation, one of these people. That is ok, because the rest of us do not disagree with this. We know that it must be so. I am all for Charles Manson being kept in prison for life, or heck, even put to death if the courts were to decide that. But at the same time, I know that the soul that is in his body will ultimately unite with it's creator. This is promised to all of us.

Oh, and I know you wrote something earlier about living forever would mean ultimately being bored, or something like that. What you are ignoring is the concept of infinity. Just as we can live eternally, so we can learn eternally. Just look at chess as an example. There is probably some finite number of possibly unique chess games. An unimaginable huge number, larger than the number of atoms in the universe, but still most likely finite. However, what about the rules of chess? Is it not possible that there might be infinite or nearly infinite ways to change the rules of chess, with each rule change creating another unimaginably huge number of possible games? And when chess and it's variants get exhausted, well, then there's poker! Or what about hockey, how many games of hockey would have to be played before it became impossible to have a unique game of hockey?

There are plenty of other mental / physical exercises besides games that could be extended into infinity.

Since you are not willing to delve further into Sylvia's teachings because of your Earthly bounds, I invite you to really, really start thinking about infinity. But of course, first of all you have to believe in it.

We don't understand the brain completely yet, it is still a mystery, so I can't give you an answer about NDEs and these dreams until I have more knowledge on the subject myself(and the scientists as well), but I refute superstition on the basis that it is illogical and there is no evidence for it(human psychology can explain the reasons for most superstition).

Well, this answer was the most disappointing I've seen from you, a total cop-out. It would be as bad if I posted tomorrow saying I was briefly dead tonight, and I visited you while dead, proving it by outlining in great detail everything you did tonight, every sentence you uttered or action you took, with nothing being wrong or amiss. And you responded that you don't understand my brain yet, so you can't give an answer about whether I really have a soul that left my body and visited you while I was dead.

If that isn't enough evidence for you, there is not much hope for you in your current incarnation. You will need to reincarnate at least one more time, or in this incarnation you will need to have your own NDE.

The sources are out there? But you must remember this is the internet and a certain degree of doubt must be used when doing research on the internet.

Well, how do you handle your sources for AGW? How do you verify them? Do the same for the sources you find regarding those who have been hyptonized into one of their past lives and recall names and events that independant researchers have later verified.

You claim to be so excellent at gathering evidence and making judgments based on facts and validation of sources. Maybe you don't WANT to do this for reincarnation, maybe you're afraid of finding out something you don't want to believe in???

[Adam Cormier]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

Sylvia has written many times that she is forbidden to know anything about her own or her immediate family's future. And that is quite logical, because one of the central themes of our existence here on Earth is that we aren't to know our future in any great detail. Psychic gifts are not given in order that we might short-circuit the necessary conditions of our Earthly lives. They are given to provide some comfort. That is why there is no foolproof psychic and never will be. Sylvia's business is to provide a little bit of information and a lot of comfort. And that's all. BTW, do you consider the emotion of love to be a weakness? Love, according to not only Sylvia but virtually all people who have had an NDE, is the force that holds all of creation (or if you like, all of existence) together.





Ok, well, what about those who are clinically dead, yet during this level of consciousness you speak of are able to float above the scene of their death and accurately recall (later, when revived) each and every action that took place, each and every sentence uttered? Yet their eyes are closed, their brain responds to no sound. There are even instances where they float away from the scene and recall details from another scene perhaps miles away, details that have been confirmed later. What kind of "dreams" are these?




It is possible that this person was having suicidal thoughts in the days before her death. One of the things Sylvia teaches is that suicide is the ultimate wrong we can commit here, because we break our contract to survive all trials and tribulations. The result is that we must immediately re-enter the Earth realm, i.e. be physically reinstated on Earth as a newborn, to learn our lessons all over again. Some NDE people who had their NDE after a suicide attempt have reported being in this vast realm of darkness before being allowed to survive their death.





Ok, so your faith is with the scientists, the ones who say it's all a matter of chemistry, there is no eternal soul, etc. That's fine, you are free to put your faith where it suits you most.

But aren't you the least intrigued that these vibrant dreams are not chaotic nor muddy as you might expect from brain cells that are having death spasms, but are instead EXTREMELY clear and that many things hidden to us in this realm are revealed during these dreams?






The sources are out there, must I do all your work for you?




Yes, I've loved this one and have dwelt on that thought long before I ever read the quote. But according to Sylvia, we have all been on the other side for countless eons of Earth time and in coming to Earth, we are necessarily purged of all those memories. You prefer the simpler explanation, which denies the existence of your soul.






Sylvia writes that all types of animals and plants exist on the other side. No insects, apparently. She also writes of other civilizations, practically infinite numbers of them, throughout the universe.

Forbidden by who? She seems to be just full of excuses. Why is her abilities always used for comfort, you have to think that some of the people she is talking to beyond the grave are in the bad afterlife, not everyone lives a good life.

That just sounds stupid to me, love holds all of creation/existence together?? It sounds terribly poetic and pretty, but that's a fairy-tale, it's a nice lie but nothing more. It makes absolutely no sense to me, love is just a chemical reaction in the brain nothing more, but yet somehow that holds all of everything together?

I'm pretty sure she was not suicidal(she might have been I don't really know), a bit stupid but not suicidal, she liked to party, she had a disease which is what made her heart stop(I don't know the exact specifics).

I don't buy that for a second, suicide is the ultimate wrong? Is she a moron? I guess slaughtering millions of people is less evil/wrong then killing yourself? That is just illogical and foolish.

faith when defined non-religiously can be:
complete confidence in a person or plan(which is impossible when it comes to science because science is always changing, always adapting, getting better, more complete), It is also impossible to have complete confidence in a human because all humans are fallible.
and the second definition
loyalty or allegiance to a cause or a person(I would say I'm aligned on the side of science vs superstition, but the difference is I don't have faith blindly, I look at the facts and evidence and make a decision based on that)

We don't understand the brain completely yet, it is still a mystery, so I can't give you an answer about NDEs and these dreams until I have more knowledge on the subject myself(and the scientists as well), but I refute superstition on the basis that it is illogical and there is no evidence for it(human psychology can explain the reasons for most superstition).

The simpler more logical explanation is what I accept, since absence of evidence, is the best evidence for absence in this case the soul.

No Insects? why? I bet she isn't a friend of nature and doesn't like insects so she wouldn't want them to be in her 'perfect' afterlife based on her own ideals. A major reason I don't trust most God-garbage is it is always humans saying they know the 'word of God', humans always talk for God, you'd think an omnipotent,omniscient, omnipresent God would have the ability to tell us what he wants first-hand.

The sources are out there? But you must remember this is the internet and a certain degree of doubt must be used when doing research on the internet.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I didn't see that but the Liberals here in Ontario already have increased energy prices. They tacked the HST onto gasoline, heating and electricity bills, etc. BC has some kind of tax revolt going but here in Ontario where there is a provincial election next year there is no point. I figure we're in for a change because people simply can't afford the constant tax increases by the liberals.

I can't see the Liberals in Ottawa gaining a minority much less a majority. All I know about Ignatieff is he seems to be a tax and spend liberal who has spent the last couple of years helping to prop up the government. Good thing because someone had to make the hard decisions and next election I'm going to vote for the party that did.

Have you seen Layton on TV recently?

I could be entirely wrong but I expect an election this fall or next spring at the latest. We need stronger legislation in several areas. The leaders appear to be spending the summer campaigning.

There seemed to be a huge increase in the electricity this month. The HST was one item. Another was a significant fee for green energy. There was another for transmission, another for debt retirement. I guess the liberals never could say no to a new tax. The electricity bill was half of the other items.

Layton turns my stomach. The only leader who is worse is Elizabeth May.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I guess her physic powers didn't tip her off to what her husband was going to be like right? :)

Sylvia has written many times that she is forbidden to know anything about her own or her immediate family's future. And that is quite logical, because one of the central themes of our existence here on Earth is that we aren't to know our future in any great detail. Psychic gifts are not given in order that we might short-circuit the necessary conditions of our Earthly lives. They are given to provide some comfort. That is why there is no foolproof psychic and never will be. Sylvia's business is to provide a little bit of information and a lot of comfort. And that's all. BTW, do you consider the emotion of love to be a weakness? Love, according to not only Sylvia but virtually all people who have had an NDE, is the force that holds all of creation (or if you like, all of existence) together.

The problem with that link is it assumes that the brief consciousness when you are dead but before your body can't be revived is the soul's experience, whereas I believe it to be the brain.

Ok, well, what about those who are clinically dead, yet during this level of consciousness you speak of are able to float above the scene of their death and accurately recall (later, when revived) each and every action that took place, each and every sentence uttered? Yet their eyes are closed, their brain responds to no sound. There are even instances where they float away from the scene and recall details from another scene perhaps miles away, details that have been confirmed later. What kind of "dreams" are these?

During my religion course this semester there was a girl who had died while in a hospital and was later brought back to life, her experience was just darkness, surrounding her. I believe this reinforces my point about how your brain reacts when you die but is still functioning. She was agnostic so she had little to no belief in the divine so her brain saw darkness. Someone who believes in God/afterlife generally sees a bright light. I'm under the impression that Near death experiences are completely dependent on the person's opinions and life and it seems to be the logical explanation to me(especially since there is no evidence for a 'soul').

It is possible that this person was having suicidal thoughts in the days before her death. One of the things Sylvia teaches is that suicide is the ultimate wrong we can commit here, because we break our contract to survive all trials and tribulations. The result is that we must immediately re-enter the Earth realm, i.e. be physically reinstated on Earth as a newborn, to learn our lessons all over again. Some NDE people who had their NDE after a suicide attempt have reported being in this vast realm of darkness before being allowed to survive their death.

My guess why the dreams would be more profound is because you're dying. Seems like a simple explanation to me, your brain cells are on fire, they are going to die very shortly unless you are brought back to life to get the blood flowing again, I can see that creating extremely vibrant dreams.

Ok, so your faith is with the scientists, the ones who say it's all a matter of chemistry, there is no eternal soul, etc. That's fine, you are free to put your faith where it suits you most.

But aren't you the least intrigued that these vibrant dreams are not chaotic nor muddy as you might expect from brain cells that are having death spasms, but are instead EXTREMELY clear and that many things hidden to us in this realm are revealed during these dreams?

I would like some sources to your last point about reincarnation, because I'm having serious doubts about how much of that last paragraph can be substantiated.

The sources are out there, must I do all your work for you?

Mark Twain's quote I believe is a good way to think of the afterlife,
"I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it."

Yes, I've loved this one and have dwelt on that thought long before I ever read the quote. But according to Sylvia, we have all been on the other side for countless eons of Earth time and in coming to Earth, we are necessarily purged of all those memories. You prefer the simpler explanation, which denies the existence of your soul.

I wouldn't mind there being something after death, but I view it as arrogant in that only humans, have such pleasure, none of the other animals on this planet, or other lifeforms any where else in this vast universe we live in. I hope one day we are capable of traveling to planets far away(The Christian Dark Ages sent us back a few hundred years) and meet other species(hopefully intelligent), but that is far in the future if even possible.

Sylvia writes that all types of animals and plants exist on the other side. No insects, apparently. She also writes of other civilizations, practically infinite numbers of them, throughout the universe.

[Adam Cormier]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I think you meant to say tenet. The main tenant is usually a fat guy that likes his private jets and spending sprees. Hmmmm... that could be Al Gore too.

Near death experiences are one of the proofs suggested in the religious courses that I took that there is an Ultimate Reality beyond this world. Most of the biblical scriptures indicate that when we die that we go to sleep for a period of time until the resurrection so maybe your agnostic friend just didn't have any REM sleep during her experience while others do. :)

The other convincing proof is that of the numinous experience or the direct experience of or encounter with the divine.



Don't be too eager for those ET's to arrive. Hawking may be right about them, you know.

Always ready to take a shot at Al Gore, I don't know why you think climatologists like him, they don't and neither do I, he politicized global warming erroneously. I'd prefer to listen to scientists who do research on this issue personally then some fat-cat politician.

If you're reduced to using NDE as proof of something after death(Ultimate Reality as you put it), I'm not convinced.

By resurrection, do you mean the 2nd coming of Christ? He's a bit late because in the New Testament it says he would return during his disciples life time.

I wouldn't call her a friend, more of an acquaintance.

Why don't you call your 2nd 'convincing' argument what it is, 'personal experiences'.

Dawkin's shatters the argument from personal experience in his book, The God Delusion, youtube clip of The God Delusion read by Dr.Dawkins. There are several other counter arguments for the argument from personal experience.

I thought you took a psychology course, this should be one of the least impressive arguments for someone who studied human psychology.


Peter Atkins(physical chemist) view is very similar to my own,
“I’d quite like there to be a God, especially if it were a benevolent one,” he begins. “Not the one of the Old Testament—that would be rather grim. But in order to believe that there is a God, I would need evidence, and I see no evidence. No evidence of any kind whatsoever. Sentiment is not evidence. Faith, revelations, all that sort of thing—these are just quirks of the brain that have been impressed upon it by family or culture. So why should I believe, given the absence of evidence, in the existence of this entity?”

I said we'd fine them in the future not the other way around, Hawking's fright might be justified but if such evil creatures did roam the universe, then we're all doomed to destruction and chaos anyways.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

Hannity did a feature tonight called "The Green Swindle" which was an excellent indictment of the whole CO2 scam. He had Obama on there talking about how he was going to increase energy prices.

Excellent coverage.

I didn't see that but the Liberals here in Ontario already have increased energy prices. They tacked the HST onto gasoline, heating and electricity bills, etc. BC has some kind of tax revolt going but here in Ontario where there is a provincial election next year there is no point. I figure we're in for a change because people simply can't afford the constant tax increases by the liberals.

I can't see the Liberals in Ottawa gaining a minority much less a majority. All I know about Ignatieff is he seems to be a tax and spend liberal who has spent the last couple of years helping to prop up the government. Good thing because someone had to make the hard decisions and next election I'm going to vote for the party that did.

Have you seen Layton on TV recently?

I could be entirely wrong but I expect an election this fall or next spring at the latest. We need stronger legislation in several areas. The leaders appear to be spending the summer campaigning.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I guess her physic powers didn't tip her off to what her husband was going to be like right? :)

Cold Reading, this is the logical answer to her 'gift'...

Like I already said, Skeptical Inquirer, has found loads of contradictory evidence to the extent, power and usefulness of her supposed physic abilities. No the people who believe in her aren't daft but they aren't looking at it logically, they are probably extremely emotional about it and can't think clearly. When you revisit a painful memory emotions start to take over(one of the many reasons I view most emotions as weaknesses).

The problem with that link is it assumes that the brief consciousness when you are dead but before your body can't be revived is the soul's experience, whereas I believe it to be the brain.

During my religion course this semester there was a girl who had died while in a hospital and was later brought back to life, her experience was just darkness, surrounding her. I believe this reinforces my point about how your brain reacts when you die but is still functioning. She was agnostic so she had little to no belief in the divine so her brain saw darkness. Someone who believes in God/afterlife generally sees a bright light. I'm under the impression that Near death experiences are completely dependent on the person's opinions and life and it seems to be the logical explanation to me(especially since there is no evidence for a 'soul').

You are right about profound changes, I use to be one of the most super-religious, right-wing, bible-thumping, anti-gay rights, anti-Muslim people on the planet. So far I'm happy with the changes in my life. :)

My guess why the dreams would be more profound is because you're dying. Seems like a simple explanation to me, your brain cells are on fire, they are going to die very shortly unless you are brought back to life to get the blood flowing again, I can see that creating extremely vibrant dreams.

I actually want to study String Theory(Physics and Biology are the two sciences I'm interested in, as well as some math courses), but there is a big difference between educated faith, and blind faith, I am completely against blind faith, but I'm more open to educated faith.

I would like some sources to your last point about reincarnation, because I'm having serious doubts about how much of that last paragraph can be substantiated.

Most religions use fear tactics and the main tenant of most of them is pretending to know some deep questions of the universe, example: what happens after death?

I think you meant to say tenet. The main tenant is usually a fat guy that likes his private jets and spending sprees. Hmmmm... that could be Al Gore too.

Near death experiences are one of the proofs suggested in the religious courses that I took that there is an Ultimate Reality beyond this world. Most of the biblical scriptures indicate that when we die that we go to sleep for a period of time until the resurrection so maybe your agnostic friend just didn't have any REM sleep during her experience while others do. :)

The other convincing proof is that of the numinous experience or the direct experience of or encounter with the divine.

Mark Twain's quote I believe is a good way to think of the afterlife,
"I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it."

Some of us don't want anything after this life, one of my friends has an interesting view on the idea of eternal life, in that it would eventually become quite boring, The finite possibilities will eventually end and then you will be left with absolutely nothing to do, I don't know why eternal life is considered a reward by many religions. I wouldn't mind there being something after death, but I view it as arrogant in that only humans, have such pleasure, none of the other animals on this planet, or other lifeforms any where else in this vast universe we live in. I hope one day we are capable of traveling to planets far away(The Christian Dark Ages sent us back a few hundred years) and meet other species(hopefully intelligent), but that is far in the future if even possible.

Don't be too eager for those ET's to arrive. Hawking may be right about them, you know.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I don't know all the details, but Sylvia Browne's ex-husband is a convicted felon, and implicated her. Even if the court decided that she was involved, it could be that her ex was very meticulous and devious in getting her involved.

Whenever someone is making a living by claiming to be a psychic, there are going to be attackers who will bring up any and all wrong predictions to try and prove otherwise. What Sylvia says about this is that when she gets asked a question, the answer (if one comes at all) comes to her as something she has to interpret, and it is her interpretation that can be wrong.

I don't buy the reincarnation idea and relying on psychics who are wrong as often as they are right just doesn't fit. Some Christian groups claim that many psychics are possessed by discerning spirits similar to the one talked about in Acts where the disciples cast out a demon that had made a home in a slave that had made their master very rich. With the demon cast out there was no more predictions to profit from. This annoyed the slave owner and led to some adventures for the apostles/disciples involved.

There are supernatural forces at work in the world both for good and for ill. You have to be careful about the doors that you allow to open in your life as the consequences can be dangerous to you and those around you. There is a gift of prophecy that some people show but it is not wrong if it is real.

There are others who are just charlatans. I believe Richard Bandler wrote a bit about how he could and did use NLP (neurolinguistic programming) techniques to convince people that he was psychic when he was not and made no claim to be.

[Vlad Drkulec]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

You folks can dismiss Fox News all you want. Voters in the U.S. take it seriously. I suspect they will contribute to the Democrats losing one of both of the House and Senate in the mid term elections. Obama, unless he can improve his performance, will likely lose next election.

Hannity did a feature tonight called "The Green Swindle" which was an excellent indictment of the whole CO2 scam. He had Obama on there talking about how he was going to increase energy prices.

Excellent coverage.

[Adam Cormier]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

I don't know all the details, but Sylvia Browne's ex-husband is a convicted felon, and implicated her. Even if the court decided that she was involved, it could be that her ex was very meticulous and devious in getting her involved.

Whenever someone is making a living by claiming to be a psychic, there are going to be attackers who will bring up any and all wrong predictions to try and prove otherwise. What Sylvia says about this is that when she gets asked a question, the answer (if one comes at all) comes to her as something she has to interpret, and it is her interpretation that can be wrong. For each anti-Sylvia naysayer, there are literally thousands of people who she has helped, how else could she have such success and make a living? I've been to one of her events, and talked with attendees, and heard firsthand how Sylvia's visions and predictions have helped them. Are they all daft? Well, if you want to think so, that is fine, I think otherwise.

Adam, I also provided a web link when I mentioned Sylvia's book. You are free to think what you will about her vision of the afterlife, but have you visited that link and read any of the hundreds and hundreds of accounts (of near death experience) there? If so, you will know that the most common statement from the person giving the account is that they know what vivid dreams are like, and the experience was more profound by orders of magnitude than their most vivid dream. Well, yes, we could explain this away as some kind of dying brain chemical reaction. Perhaps we will all have this as we die, and ultimately it will end and we will become nothing. Or perhaps we just don't WANT to believe that something better than this life could possibly await us all.

That is what I meant when I wrote that a degree of faith is still required. I'm getting the distinct impression that you just aren't willing to have any degree of faith. You don't want to believe scientists who say that string theory points to there being 11 dimensions to reality. In either case, no one is dragging you to water and forcing you to drink. The water is there if you decide you are thirsty.

I know you are fairly young, and like all searchers, I'm confident that you will undergo profound changes as you age.

Let me leave you with this, and you can search it out for yourself: one of the tenets of Sylvia's teachings (and many major religions as well) is reincarnation. To give any credence to Sylvia at all, you must believe in reincarnation. There are documented cases of people being put into trance, taken into a past life, and mentioning names and events from those past lives -- names and events that were so trivial, the person under hypnosis could not possibly have had knowledge of them. These names and events have been subsequently verified by independant researchers. With your focus on scientific facts and evidence, this should serve to at least get you believing in reincarnation. Or maybe it won't. It's hard to know just how much hard evidence you must have before you accept something.

I guess her physic powers didn't tip her off to what her husband was going to be like right? :)

Cold Reading, this is the logical answer to her 'gift'...

Like I already said, Skeptical Inquirer, has found loads of contradictory evidence to the extent, power and usefulness of her supposed physic abilities. No the people who believe in her aren't daft but they aren't looking at it logically, they are probably extremely emotional about it and can't think clearly. When you revisit a painful memory emotions start to take over(one of the many reasons I view most emotions as weaknesses).

The problem with that link is it assumes that the brief consciousness when you are dead but before your body can't be revived is the soul's experience, whereas I believe it to be the brain.

During my religion course this semester there was a girl who had died while in a hospital and was later brought back to life, her experience was just darkness, surrounding her. I believe this reinforces my point about how your brain reacts when you die but is still functioning. She was agnostic so she had little to no belief in the divine so her brain saw darkness. Someone who believes in God/afterlife generally sees a bright light. I'm under the impression that Near death experiences are completely dependent on the person's opinions and life and it seems to be the logical explanation to me(especially since there is no evidence for a 'soul').

You are right about profound changes, I use to be one of the most super-religious, right-wing, bible-thumping, anti-gay rights, anti-Muslim people on the planet. So far I'm happy with the changes in my life. :)

My guess why the dreams would be more profound is because you're dying. Seems like a simple explanation to me, your brain cells are on fire, they are going to die very shortly unless you are brought back to life to get the blood flowing again, I can see that creating extremely vibrant dreams.

I actually want to study String Theory(Physics and Biology are the two sciences I'm interested in, as well as some math courses), but there is a big difference between educated faith, and blind faith, I am completely against blind faith, but I'm more open to educated faith.

I would like some sources to your last point about reincarnation, because I'm having serious doubts about how much of that last paragraph can be substantiated.

Most religions use fear tactics and the main tenant of most of them is pretending to know some deep questions of the universe, example: what happens after death?
Mark Twain's quote I believe is a good way to think of the afterlife,
"I do not fear death. I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it."

Some of us don't want anything after this life, one of my friends has an interesting view on the idea of eternal life, in that it would eventually become quite boring, The finite possibilities will eventually end and then you will be left with absolutely nothing to do, I don't know why eternal life is considered a reward by many religions. I wouldn't mind there being something after death, but I view it as arrogant in that only humans, have such pleasure, none of the other animals on this planet, or other lifeforms any where else in this vast universe we live in. I hope one day we are capable of traveling to planets far away(The Christian Dark Ages sent us back a few hundred years) and meet other species(hopefully intelligent), but that is far in the future if even possible.

[Ed Seedhouse]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

You folks can dismiss Fox News all you want. Voters in the U.S. take it seriously.

Yes, we are well into The Crazy Years, and Garrrrrry is actively working to keep the craziness going.

[Adam Cormier]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

Obama, unless he can improve his performance, will likely lose next election.

And that is what disgusts me...the current version of republican party(a.k.a. the party of NO) is just appalling it is so far on the right, it's ridiculous. This isn't the party of the famous republican presidents of the past. this is a sick, twisted and perverted variation.

[Gary Ruben]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

You folks can dismiss Fox News all you want. Voters in the U.S. take it seriously. I suspect they will contribute to the Democrats losing one of both of the House and Senate in the mid term elections. Obama, unless he can improve his performance, will likely lose next election.

Let's not forget Clinton got lucky in winning his first term. The right wing vote was split between "one term" Bush and Ross Perot. So you had a popular vote of Clinton 42%, Bush 37%, and Perot 19%. Not the kind of split we normally see in U.S. politics. Bush had been a strong favourite to win a second term before Perot started cutting into his right wing votes.

Canada's left wing model is broken. Take a province like B.C. They have bascially a resource ecoomy and many are closing and leaving. The forestry industry is hard hit and mills are closing or laying off. Taxation and wages are too high to compete with other countries.

I got a laugh out of the free trade settlement between Abitibi and Canada over the expropriation in Newfoundland. The Canadian govenrment could have dragged that one out for years. Instead they settle for $130 million under the free trade act.

What happens here is that settlement should allow the company to emerge from bankruptcy protection and keep and make jobs in central Canada. I think simply giving them that money outside of the settlement would have been considered a subsidy under the Free Trade Agreement. So, Canada used the agreement to their advantage.

Now to see if they can find a way to stimulate the forestry industry in B.C.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

You are correct about her being far from perfect, she's a convicted felon. I actually do know a bit about her already, there was a research article in Skeptical Inquirer(A fantastic magazine, I have a few issues) about her, because she said something like she gets 80% of cases correct, but their conclusion was, "Browne has not even been mostly correct in a single case."

But enough about her supposed physic abilities(hot and cold reading techniques basically), onto the spirituality part of Sylvia Browne.

The book you told Paul Beckwith about, "Life on the other side", about her near-death experience is all fantastically poetic, but your brain is quickly dying when you flat line, and we don't know what you experience when you are in between death and life(or after death for that matter), different people have had all sorts of different near-death experiences, but really these experiences could just be the last thoughts(basically dreams) of a dying brain(and could be influenced by that person's way of thought up to that point of their life).

Her retelling of her near-death experience to me at least sounds like a dream, that she spiced up with some adjectives(how would she know that this white light in front of her had sacred brilliance and infinite intelligence). Her religious beliefs seem to mix and mash a bunch of religions together, reincarnation, purgatory, a white light, etc...

Her idea of the afterlife is all well and good, and it sounds like a very nice place(and it even uses the proper criteria for determining good and bad, deeds not belief) but I don't believe in it for several reasons. Plus I don't have to believe it according to her I just have to accept God when I get there to go to heaven. I'm perfectly capable of living a normal life without God, and then if when i die I meet God obviously I'd accept him, I'd have all the logical proof I needed(I don't think that is going to happen though)

Reasons:
- I have problems with nearly all of her 7 stages of advancements they aren't logical to me.
- She is so specific, don't this offensively but I'm reminded of Scientology by her beliefs.
- This whole religious ideal came out of a near-death experience, which like I said before is like a dream, fantastical ideas and creations can come out of dreams but it doesn't mean they are correct
etc...

On to your next point on impossibility, that statement is interesting, I feel no reason to believe that there are any other dimensions besides our own and I don't know why'd we care if there were these dimensions seeing as they are impossible to reach therefore it is a pointless line of thought(unless we could somehow reach them), but science is delving into something similar to this, the multiverse( a whole bunch of universes side by side) theory for example in physics(but we are supposed to be able to go into other universes, therefore not making it useless, I don't know how that works exactly).

Also if this other dimension is something we can't comprehend why bother? That means the best position would be agnostic on that particular issue, because since we can't comprehend it we can't feel positive or negative feelings on the subject. Dawkins makes a point like that on God(s), if God(s) can't be comprehended how do all these people(every religion basically) know exactly what he/they want(s)? If he can be comprehended then he can be scientifically tested and proved either to be real or delusion.

Just my 2 cents...

I don't know all the details, but Sylvia Browne's ex-husband is a convicted felon, and implicated her. Even if the court decided that she was involved, it could be that her ex was very meticulous and devious in getting her involved.

Whenever someone is making a living by claiming to be a psychic, there are going to be attackers who will bring up any and all wrong predictions to try and prove otherwise. What Sylvia says about this is that when she gets asked a question, the answer (if one comes at all) comes to her as something she has to interpret, and it is her interpretation that can be wrong. For each anti-Sylvia naysayer, there are literally thousands of people who she has helped, how else could she have such success and make a living? I've been to one of her events, and talked with attendees, and heard firsthand how Sylvia's visions and predictions have helped them. Are they all daft? Well, if you want to think so, that is fine, I think otherwise.

Adam, I also provided a web link when I mentioned Sylvia's book. You are free to think what you will about her vision of the afterlife, but have you visited that link and read any of the hundreds and hundreds of accounts (of near death experience) there? If so, you will know that the most common statement from the person giving the account is that they know what vivid dreams are like, and the experience was more profound by orders of magnitude than their most vivid dream. Well, yes, we could explain this away as some kind of dying brain chemical reaction. Perhaps we will all have this as we die, and ultimately it will end and we will become nothing. Or perhaps we just don't WANT to believe that something better than this life could possibly await us all.

That is what I meant when I wrote that a degree of faith is still required. I'm getting the distinct impression that you just aren't willing to have any degree of faith. You don't want to believe scientists who say that string theory points to there being 11 dimensions to reality. In either case, no one is dragging you to water and forcing you to drink. The water is there if you decide you are thirsty.

I know you are fairly young, and like all searchers, I'm confident that you will undergo profound changes as you age.

Let me leave you with this, and you can search it out for yourself: one of the tenets of Sylvia's teachings (and many major religions as well) is reincarnation. To give any credence to Sylvia at all, you must believe in reincarnation. There are documented cases of people being put into trance, taken into a past life, and mentioning names and events from those past lives -- names and events that were so trivial, the person under hypnosis could not possibly have had knowledge of them. These names and events have been subsequently verified by independant researchers. With your focus on scientific facts and evidence, this should serve to at least get you believing in reincarnation. Or maybe it won't. It's hard to know just how much hard evidence you must have before you accept something.

[Paul Bonham]

Re: The One and Only Climate Change thread...

Use your imagination for a cubic-sphere :D


The middle sphere is a cube, isn't :D

Great renderings! Egidijus, do you have an image of a chessboard mapped onto a sphere?

My question about the cubes shown on this sphere: is the surface area of each cube face exactly equal to the area of the perfect cube face BEFORE it was applied to the sphere. Conceptually, this can be seen as a perfect cube that is "inflated" into a sphere. But by the act of inflating, we seem to be increasing the surface area of each face.

Another aspect that has changed: part of the definition of a cube may be that each face is that a vector drawn between any two points on the face will have the same direction (angle) as any other vector on the same face. That's obviously not true for the cubic sphere, therefore a true cubic sphere (i.e. an object that has identical properties of a perfect sphere AND of a perfect cube) cannot exist in our 3 (4) dimensional realm of existence.