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hmmm....your comment is out of order!
You infer my support for the "trampling of rights", but I have made absolutely no comments regarding the Quebec student protests!
Hi Jerry:
..... Delaying students somewhat to inform them of the issues before entering the school is acceptable to me, though some interference with the opposed students' rights.
Bob A
Other similar delays to "inform" the public of the issues come to mind e.g. the harassement at certain abortion clinics by pro life groups. Protesters can protest, but I see no reason why students should have to walk a "walk of shame" and be exposed to harassment and verbal abuse just to go to class. As Chris Mallon notes, "informing" is not the reason for these things. They are motivated by bully tactics.
well, at least you disapprove of outright physical violence.
hmmm....your comment is out of order!
You infer my support for the "trampling of rights", but I have made absolutely no comments regarding the Quebec student protests!
no, I wondered if you had a position on Quebec, if you don't wish to clarify what that position is that's fine,
to me OWS and these 'student' protests are one and the same, that's been pretty conclusivey estabished, by the movement itself, you support OWS so by extension you may have an opinion on the Quebec student protests, many OWS supporters definitely do, maybe this is where you and the OWS movement part company? I guess we'll never know
Last edited by Zeljko Kitich; Wednesday, 16th May, 2012, 07:28 PM.
Definitely don't agree with use of violence against those not supporting the cause. Delaying students somewhat to inform them of the issues before entering the school is acceptable to me, though some interference with the opposed students' rights. The interference is proportional to the cause at stake.
But no way for assault.
Bob A
I find it interesting how you keep framing this in terms of a union strike and typical union strike tactics. How about a little thing called the Canadian constitution or a little thing like a legal injunction?
Last edited by Zeljko Kitich; Wednesday, 16th May, 2012, 07:32 PM.
If some of the students, or most of the teachers walked out of school that would be acceptable and then the students who want to attend class would be free to do so. The problem is that the students trying to attend class are harassed and abused, and that is happening for sure here in Gatineau. Quebec has had a history where a small, but significant minority are enamored of fascist and anti-democratic behavior, which in the long run is very damaging to the labor movement. The students are being maneuvered by the government and labor who are using them as pawns in a big chess game. They do not realize that there is a big difference between being an irritant and a threat. If the students, or the occupy Wall Street movement uses violence then they will eventually be labeled as terrorist. There is no democratic or constitutional right to low tuition. The last offer by the government was very generous, and the student's current demands are absurd. Stop all research because it only benefits corporations? Really? What do they think the Quebec government will do, just let the students run the Universities?
Before their Tuesday demonstration CLASSE, the most militant student organization, said their disruption ... aimed at reminding the rich of this world they are rich because they’re keeping us poor. It must be a bit of a challenge to find many rich people in Montreal, but after I read this I actually felt sorry for these delusional people. Maybe that idea can be applied to Chess, I must tell the Masters and Grandmasters that the only reason they are good is that they are keeping me bad! Hmm.. I think this CLASSE slogan should be adopted by the 1% and occupy Wall Street movement because it summarizes their reasoning so well. I do not know any of the people who post on either side of this issue personally, but if we ever meet they will know me by my T-shirt which will say "Proud to be part of the 1%".
no, I wondered if you had a position on Quebec, if you don't wish to clarify what that position is that's fine,
to me OWS and these 'student' protests are one and the same, that's been pretty conclusivey estabished, by the movement itself, you support OWS so by extension you may have an opinion on the Quebec student protests, many OWS supporters definitely do, maybe this is where you and the OWS movement part company? I guess we'll never know
Jerry, I find your logic totally unacceptable. OWS and the student protests over tuition fees are two totally different issues. Just because there have been some instances of violence in both, does not equate the two. A tomato is not an apple because both of them happen to be red.
I support the peaceful demonstrations of the OWS movement. The increasing divide between the rich and poor has the potential to cause great social and economic harm on a global basis. If the problems are not addressed, I fear ever increasing violence is inevitable. That is not what I want, that is what I hope we can avoid. Problems don't magically go away by ignoring them, they must be solved.
Jerry, I find your logic totally unacceptable. OWS and the student protests over tuition fees are two totally different issues. Just because there have been some instances of violence in both, does not equate the two. A tomato is not an apple because both of them happen to be red.
I support the peaceful demonstrations of the OWS movement. The increasing divide between the rich and poor has the potential to cause great social and economic harm on a global basis. If the problems are not addressed, I fear ever increasing violence is inevitable. That is not what I want, that is what I hope we can avoid. Problems don't magically go away by ignoring them, they must be solved.
You haven't been reading the press then, the corporate media or the aternative media then. It is not violence that equates the two things, although both have violence. It is the ideological links and the fact that many commentators, OWS and student activists have openly stated that this is part of one broader movement. The same minds that brought you OWS have brought you the student movement. Why do you think the student groups want Quebec universities to no longer engage in reasearch because it 'only profits corporations'. Even at a very basic level who is more part of the 99% than students?
You may or may not like the Quebec student situation but it is part and parcel of the OWS movement.
You cannot solve the problems of economic disparity by dragging down the rich and stealing their wealth. Its been tried before and it has failed miserably in every instance.
Five years from now Ontario will have a shortage of doctors. Again.
You can scapegoat certain people but the end result will be that they will vote with their feet.
You cannot solve the problems of economic disparity by dragging down the rich and stealing their wealth.
That is not what I am suggesting.
You believe in democracy, right? Do you not see a problem brewing when economic and political power becomes increasingly concentrated in the hands of a tiny minority?
That is not what I am suggesting.
You believe in democracy, right? Do you not see a problem brewing when economic and political power becomes increasingly concentrated in the hands of a tiny minority?
I don't know many examples of the opposite situation; I think economic and political power will always be concentrated in a small segment of a given population (unless we are going around the restaurant in Monaco ...)
There may be countries (Sweden??) where wealth is more distributed than say Canada or the U.S. or U.K. but I don't know whether that automatically means that the poverty line has a lower percentage of people below the line... The 'distribution' of wealth may just be better distributed through the top 50% of people leaving those at the bottom, well, still at the bottom.
12-year old Victoria Grant explains why her homeland, Canada, and most of the world, is in debt. April 27, 2012 at the Public Banking in America Conference, Philadelphia, PA.
That is not what I am suggesting.
You believe in democracy, right? Do you not see a problem brewing when economic and political power becomes increasingly concentrated in the hands of a tiny minority?
Render unto Caesar the the things that are Caesar's...
The OWS movement and the student riots in Quebec and the disgraceful situation in Caledonia have little to do with democracy. It is thugs exerting their thuggishness over a complacent population with the complicity of weak political leadership. Nothing more and nothing less. Celebrating or even condoning thuggishness is wrong, short-sighted and stupid. I hope the Montreal subway terrorists get the full punishment that they deserve which I understand could be five or more years in prison.
I believe in democracy as a theory but the practice leaves me disgusted at times. In practice its all about looting.
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