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FYI, Bob G, pointing out the problems with DM is not trolling. If Bob A wants to tell everyone that DM is beneficial, he should be able to answer the points raised which show that it would be disastrous...
Oh my god, the utter HYPOCRISY!!!!
THE UNMITIGATED HYPOCRISY !!!!
I pointed out all the problems with Libertarianism and got labelled by this piece of shit as a "nasty troll" in response. He was unable to answer the points raised which showed that LIbertarianism would be disastrous ....
WHAT AN UTTER PIECE OF HYPOCRITIC SHIT IS DILIP PANJWANI.
For the record, I think the world needs to come together somehow, in a loose global framework, allowing for diverse political and economic systems, encouraging democracy and the elimination of human exploitation and environmental collapse. That system does not currently exist, but hopefully will evolve over time.
That is my hope, it maybe is a pipe dream.
Given the choice between Democratic Socialism and Libertarianism, I choose DM.
Hopefully we can evolve.
Very nice post! (just one minor correction: DM stands for Democratic Marxism, not Democratic Socialism, but it's really the same, is it Bob A?)
The unfortunate truth about the changes needed that you speak of is that it cannot happen without a massive, worldwide DIE-OFF of human population. The preponderance of cancerous elitists running the world cannot at this stage be displaced by revolution or coups d'etats or anything else besides total economic / environmental collapse of society. Then the survivors must keep records of all past events to realize what happened.
and then, as you said Bob G, we evolve.
Bob, I was wondering what you think of my take on the Canadian election? Do you think Canadians did what those elephants did in response to a crisis they were unfamiliar with (earthquake) in the video I saw? The elephants came running from all directions, into a circle they formed around their young. In the election, it seemed to me Canadians, dealing with a very unfamiliar crisis of an antagonistic USA, gathered in a circle and voted centrist. like the elephants forming that small circle.
I had provided an extensive response and a set of questions for you in response to the set of statements on DM that you had posted not too long ago. So it is not true that I did not give feedback.
FYI, smart and hard-working entrepreneurs do not make obscene profits; they work extremely hard to make a decent, comfortable living, with some savings for retirement, but your DM would forcefully snatch away more than 60% (?more than 75%) of what they earn, and so it would become more attractive for them to stop sweating (which they did not mind originally) and relax more, as health care, dental care, children's education, housing, travel, etc. etc. would all be free, leading to the society losing wealth creation by these entrepreneurs. That is what eventually happened in Chile under Allende, and the inflation rate shot to 3-digits, and everybody got poorer...
Those who make obscene income are those who bribe the 'all-powerful' politicians into letting them do so unfairly... These politicians make the earnings of a life-time while they are in power, even though they end up eventually being booted out by DM, only to be replaced by another set of all-powerful politicians, who do the same as their predecessors... (That is why in Libertarianism politicians do not have any 'power' over others, and all the efforts of the government are directed towards enforcing swiftly and comprehensively the Natural Law, to which the politicians are also subject to. As mentioned earlier on discussion on this, one of the main tricks criminals employ in preventing being found liable is 'privacy', which would not be allowed in Libertarianism. The inability of the poor to seek justice because of inability to hire hard-working lawyers who themselves do a lot of investigation, will also not exist in Libertarianism).
Do you realize that the above is the reason that the vast majority of people (including Americans, Europeans, Chinese, Indians, Arabs and Africans) stay away from Marxist principles, which your DM espouses.
Last edited by Dilip Panjwani; Saturday, 3rd May, 2025, 09:30 PM.
Dilip (I know.....I said I wouldn't take the bait [sigh])
I tried my best in the Democratic Marxism thread......
That CT group developed a set of DM Statements that were generally considered acceptable to that CT'er group.
There were discussed probably over 20 Discussion Papers on DM issued by the Democratic Marxist Global Institute.
All we ever got from you was: You're not answering the questions, ad nauseum. No one sided with you except Syd. Other CT'ers gave feedback on topic, but not you.
At some point I have to get the message being delivered by you.......
Others must try to get you to understand that the answers are in the wealth of DM material already presented.
And I have told the world that the CT thread on DM is one of the best places to start researching on this new concepts party.
One example only: yes, in that, is the statement that entrepreneurs will be valued in a DM society for the same contributions they make to capitalism, though without exorbitant, obscene profits made on the back of society generally - to just show that you don't want answers.....you just want super-critical, unbased, monologue....your monologue.
Bob A (DM'er)
P.S. I agree with Bob G - if I have to choose between Libertarianism and Democratic Marxism, I too will choose DM. I don't know about the other CT'ers on this new thread I started, but they can speak for themselves, if interested enough to answer Dilip and his Libertarian presentations, as the alternative to DM.
For the record, I think the world needs to come together somehow, in a loose global framework, allowing for diverse political and economic systems, encouraging democracy and the elimination of human exploitation and environmental collapse. That system does not currently exist, but hopefully will evolve over time.
That is my hope, it maybe is a pipe dream.
Given the choice between Democratic Socialism and Libertarianism, I choose DM.
Hopefully we can evolve.
FYI, Bob G, pointing out the problems with DM is not trolling. If Bob A wants to tell everyone that DM is beneficial, he should be able to answer the points raised which show that it would be disastrous...
Sloganneering that is repetitive gets quite tiring.
I'll no longer try to explain things to you......pretty committed to Libertarian ideology.
Good plan. Ignore the trolls.
For the record, I think the world needs to come together somehow, in a loose global framework, allowing for diverse political and economic systems, encouraging democracy and the elimination of human exploitation and environmental collapse. That system does not currently exist, but hopefully will evolve over time.
That is my hope, it maybe is a pipe dream.
Given the choice between Democratic Socialism and Libertarianism, I choose DM.
Bob, have the guts to answer the points raised, instead of shutting your eyes and brain to obvious truth.
You do not seem to understand that DM does not encourage the growth of society's wealth, as it punishes entrepreneurs; all it does is redistribute shrinking wealth. It also makes the process of generating wealth managed by government employees, and history and common sense have shown that businesses fail to deliver when run by the government.
Sloganneering that is repetitive gets quite tiring.
I'll no longer try to explain things to you......pretty committed to Libertarian ideology.
If others here are interested, I will continue to try to explain, what Dilip has NEVER gotten, is that "Communism" is a socialism, but is a bastardization of Marx, not Marxism (And this is the old dog he keeps coming up with so as to beat it with a stick, the same old, tiring one).
Democratic Marxism has never been tried before, as elaborated here, for the benefit, hopefully, of CT'ers. DM has only said that the closest thing to a DM government was that of President Salvador Allende in 1970-73. But it was actually a Unity Government of Democratic Socialism, and the traditional USSR-type Communist Party of Chile.
So please consider (Don't listen Dilip) the series of Discussion Papers I have posted on the prior CT Democratic Marxism thread, and then levy criticism on the policies proposed & we'll have an intelligent debate (Not a mouthing of platitudes, as has regularly happened here).
Bob A (Trying to explain my Democratic Marxism; I've totally failed with Dilip; hope others are clearer on the NEW PARTY proposed policies)
Capitalism with a Human Face - Social Democracy - New Democratic Party of Canada
... the people will finally look at, and appreciate the benefits of Democratic Socialism (Or by then, perhaps the benefits of Democratic Marxism - they will by then have seen the benefits when the Democratic Marxist Party...).
Bob A (Democratic Marxist)
What benefits, Bob, are you talking about...you have never honestly answered all the questions about the disastrous nature of Marxism...
Instead of making sure that the dirty rich cannot bribe the politicians to build a system and put in a myriad regulations which prevent the hard-working commoners to start businesses on their own, Marxism just lets the dirty rich steal from the rest and then itself steals what it can from hard and smart-working entrepreneurs to distribute the stolen stuff to those who prefer to relax rather than do hard and smart work.... a very destructive and disastrous system indeed...
Last edited by Dilip Panjwani; Friday, 2nd May, 2025, 07:59 PM.
Capitalism with a Human Face - Social Democracy - New Democratic Party of Canada
The NDP is the eventual path out of Capitalism........capitalism must evolve in Canada to an NDP majority government in future! They will rise like the Phoenix in the next election (Likely not that far off, since the Libs and Cons will agree on nothing).
Eventually the NDP & the Bloc & the Green will decide to end the pain of the struggling Carney minority government, pass the non-confidence motion, and all will go for the golden ring again.
After the NDP fails to satisfy, somewhere forward in Canada's future, the people will finally look at, and appreciate the benefits of Democratic Socialism (Or by then, perhaps the benefits of Democratic Marxism - they will by then have seen the benefits when the Democratic Marxist Party of Ontario formed the provincial government, & restructured the whole province municipally).
As many of you might recall, I have long said that for major democratic developed nations, it is probably best to remain politically Center or Center-Left.
Canada did the right thing and threw away the false promises of Libertarianism / Conservatism and stayed Center-Left for the next few years.
The other PP who leads the woeful Conservatives, did he actually lose his seat? If yes, he should resign as did Singh of the Old Democrats. (How long can they be New Democrats? How long can they even remain a party?)
Too bad Dollup Panhandler, your miracle man is not going to take over. Thank goodness.
In the face of crisis, Canadians flocked to the center. Like a herd of elephants who, in response to the unexpected such as an earthquake, form a circle inside of which are their babies.
The Americans did something very different and disturbing, and as a result are in dire straits.
The collapse of the New Democrats is also a trend worth commenting on. Could it be that in Canada, we will reject polarization altogether?
I cannot think of a piece of land on Earth which has not been claimed by at least one country. This includes places that have no people.
Antarctica is covered by an international treaty. No country is allowed to claim even a part of Antarctica for themself. Of course treaties can be violated.
IThe border people have won the battle of ideas in practice, for good or bad. Land has been claimed and it must be defended from criminal invaders. You claim it and defend it or you will inevitably lose it to someone else who wants it. ...
This is the philosophy that leads to exactly what I said, increasing population leads to increasing borders. Claim it and defend it ... leads to conflict and wars, both civil and international.
I
We don't need to limit population growth through force.
...
I agree with this, even though in my last post I said we should now at this point in time limit population growth. Actually, the window has closed. Instead, population growth is henceforth going to be limited by TOTAL .... GLOBAL .... ECONOMIC .... COLLAPSE.
Anyone with children must now prepare for their children's survival. It That is, if you love your children, in which case prepare to sacrifice yourselves as parents for your children.
It may happen in slow motion ... but it is underway now.
Gold at record highs.
Global trade disintegrating.
China surpassing USA as top world economy, economic war in progress.
USA to annex countries by force, including Canada no matter how many times you say "elbows up".
LOL elbows up .... AK-47s firing .....
end of civilization as we have known it.
Last edited by Pargat Perrer; Monday, 7th April, 2025, 03:43 AM.
I believe parts of Antarctica have been claimed by various countries, though eyeballing the map on the site below it appears that there are unclaimed parts. Perhaps there are also some tiny islands in the middle of nowhere that are unclaimed. I suspect that if there were easy to extract resources / sudden strategic value these places would not be unclaimed for long.
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